1954-1975 US MARINE VNMC ADVISOR TIGER STRIPE UNIFORM PATTERNS AND REFERENCE

[whittond]

Hello Gents,  For those that don't know me, MSgt Dan Whitton USMC(Ret),  USMC Infantry Related Militaria 1875-Vietnam Historian / Collector for over 44 years and VIETNAM US MARINE ADVISOR to VNMC / RSSZ / ARVN / SOG / POPULAR FORCES / CAP-CAG Advisor 1954-1975 Uniform/Gear/Photos/Paperwork, Historian / Collector for over 33 years now.  I am also the Historian to the Vietnam Marine Advisors Association.

 

I am opening a new forum reference section on Vietnam Era 1954-1975 US MARINE Advisors to the South Vietnamese Marine Corps and their VNMC Advisor Uniforms, etc.  One of these days (hopefully sooner than later) I will get a Very Detailed reference book published for collectors since I have been completely retired for over 10 years now & my days are on my own schedule.   I have an extensive collection of US Marine Vietnam Advisors Uniforms, Head Gear, Specialty Items (Clothing Related, Field Gear Related) Photos, Paperwork (AARs, Advisor Logs, Personal Letters, Training Materials, MAU Official Log Books, Etc), Captured NVA & VC Items.  Most of my collection (about 98%) has come directly from the former Advisor or His family.  The remaining 2% from Close Friends in the hobby, Militaria Shows, Gun Shows, Yard Sales, Flea Markets, & Internet Sites.  I have color photos & uniform items going back to the very first two VNMC Advisor's 1955-1957 (Capt Breckinridge & T/Sgt (GySgt) Tracy) through as recent as the Very Last VNMC Advisor LtCol Lukeman 1974-1975 who evacuated the Marine Advisory Unit HQs, US National Ensign / US Marine Corps Battle Colors / SVN National Colors as Saigon fell to the North Vietnamese Army in 1975.

 

These first images will be of my Vietnam Marine Advisors uniforms currently on display, as well as my uniforms stored (not on display).

[whittond]

THE FOLLOWING IMAGES WILL SHOW THE SIX (6) KNOWN AND VERIFIED, VNMC ADVISOR UNIFORM TIGER STRIPE PATTERNS FROM 1962-1975.

 

THERE IS A 1958 OR 1959 SOUTH VIETNAMESE MARINE CORPS QUARTER MASTER MARKED/DATED NEARLY MINT UNISSUED CONDITION TIGER STRIPE SHIRT IN ANOTHER COLLECTORS COLLECTION THAT OUTBID ME LAST SECONG FOR IT YEARS AGO OFF EBAY.  I CAN NOT FIND MY COLORED PICTURES OF IT, AND CAN NOT VERIFY IF IT IS THE SAME OR DIFFERENT FROM MY 1962-66 1ST PATTERN VNMC TIGER STRIPE.  REGRETABLY, I HAVE NOT FOUND ANY COLOR PHOTOS FROM THE 1958-61 PERIOD SHOWING THIS TIGER STRIPE UNIFORM, ONLY BLACK & WHITE.  IT IS VERY POSSIBLE THAT THERE ARE ACTUALLY SEVEN PATTERNS WITH THIS 1958-61 PATTERN BEING THE VERY FIRST.

 

THERE IS ALSO A COLOR VARIATION OF THE 1968-199 3RD PATTERN VNMC TIGER STRIPE, ONE VERSION HAS MORE OF A FOREST GREEN TINT TO THE OVERALL COLORS, THE OTHER VERSION HAS MORE OF AN OLIVE GREEN TINT TO THE COLORS, SO THERE COULD IN FACT BE EIGHT (8) PATTERNS DUE TO THE COLOR VARIANCE.

[USMC_COLLECTOR]

Amazing info! Quick question for you, did force recon use the VNMC pattern mainly or did they use others that would be available to the army and army special forces as well?

[whittond]

HERE ARE THE KNOWN VNMC NAME TAPE COLORS, AS WORN BY US MARINE ADVISORS TO THE VNMC AND ALSO THEIR VIETNAMESE MARINE COUNTERPARTS BROKEN DOWN BY BATTALION.  DURING CERTAIN YEARS SOME COMPANIES THAT WERE NOT AN INDEPENDANT BN, ROLLED UP UNDER THE AMPHIBIOUS SUPPORT BN, OR THE HEADQUARTERS COMMAND AND WORE THEIR COLORED NAME TAPE.

 

THE AMPHIBIOUS SUPPORT BN CHANGED ITS NAME TAPE COLORS THREE (3) TIMES DURING ITS EXISTANCE.  THE FIRST IS HARDER TO SHOW WITH ART PROGRAMS, AS THE NAME WAS ACTUALLY SEWN WITH " GOLD " THREAD ON A DARK OLIVE GREEN BACKING, AS OPPOSED TO " YELLOW " THREAD ON A DARK GREEN BACKING USED ON THE SECOND VERSION.

 

 

[whittond]

HERE ARE THE BASIC SOUTH VIETNAMESE RANK INSIGNIAS WORN ON THE US MARINE ADVISOR'S UNIFORMS, BROKEN DOWN BY GENERAL TIME PERIOD SHIFTS.  PLEASE NOTE I AM USING THE US MARINE CORPS EQUIVELANT RANK NOMENCLATURE IN THE IMAGES, NOT THE SOUTH VIETNAMESE MARINE RANK NOMENCLATURE, ALTHOUGH IN MOST INSTANCES THEY WERE THE SAME.  MY REFERENCE BOOK WILL GO INTO GREAT DETAIL ON ALL VARIATIONS BROKEN DOWN BY TIME FRAMES FROM 1954-1975, BUT THESE TWO IMAGES GIVE A BASIC VIEW ON THEM AT SIGNIFICANT CHANGE OVER PERIODS.

 

EARLIEST PHOTOS SHOW US MARINE ADVISORS WEARING THEIR EQUIVELANT VNMC RANK START IN 1964.  1964-65 NORMALLY WORN ON THE CENTER CHEST OF THEIR SHIRT (PIN ON OR CLUTCH BACKED, AND SOMETIMES ON THEIR HEADGEAR EMBROIDERED IN.  1966-1969 NORMALLY WORN ON THE SHIRT SHOULDER EPPAULETS AS SLIDE ON RANK INSIGNIA, OR WORE ARVN ARMY PIN ON RANK ON THEIR SHIRTS RIGHT SIDE POCKET FLAP NEAREST TO SHIRTS CENTER.  1969-1975 THEY WORE EITHER ARVN ARMY RANK INSIGNIA OR SOUTH VEITNAMESE MARINE RANK INSIGNIA SEWN ON OR EMBROIDERED ONTO THEIR SHIRTS RIGHT SIDE POCKET FLAR, NEAREST TO SHIRTS CENTER.

[whittond]

THE SHOULDER EPAULET RANKS, COULD ALSO BE WORN AS A SINGLE PIN ON OR CLUTCH BACKED CENTER OF SHIRT CHEST RANK INSIGNIA.  ONCE THE SOUTH VIETNAMESE MARINES SHIFTED TO COLLAR RANK, THE ADVISORS ALSO SHIFTED TO USING THE SAME AND WEARING IT SEWN ON OR EMBROIDERED ONTO THEIR RIGHT SIDE, SHIRT'S POCKET FLAP.  IN SOME INSTANCES, THE ADVISOR ACTUALLY USED THE VNMC RANK ON THEIR COLLAR VICE THEIR US RANK, BUT THAT WAS PRETTY RARELY DONE.

[whittond]

TO ANSWER THE QUESTION ABOUT US MARINE CORPS FORCE RECON PERSONEL USING THE VNMC TIGER STRIPE UNIFORM AS THEIR PRIMARY TIGER STRIPE UNIFORM.  ACTUALLY, US MARINE CORPS FORCE RECON DID NOT USE THE VNMC TIGER STRIPE AS A PRIMARY UNIFORM, AND IN MOST CASES AS A UNIFORM AT ALL,  THE FORCE RECON TEAM MEMBER PURCHASED WHAT EVER TIGER STRIPE UNIFORM THEIR TEAM AUTHORIZED FOR COMBAT WEAR FROM WHAT EVER SORCE WAS LOCATED CLOSEST TO THEIR UNIT.  THE BOTTOM LINE, IF THEY WORE A TIGER STRIPE UNIFORM, IT COULD BE ANY OF THE AVAILIBLE TIGER STRIPE VARIANTS.  THE FAVORED TIGER STRIPE UNIFORM WAS THE LIGHT WEIGHT OR POPLIN TIGER STRIPE AVAILIBLE VARIATIONS, BUT SOME DID WEAR THE HEAVIER WEIGHT COTTON SATEEN VARIATIONS.   

 

KEEP IN MIND ALSO THAT US MARINE CORPS UNITS WITH THE EXCEPTION OF THE SOUTH VIETNAMESE ADVISORS, FORCE RECON AND RECON, WERE NOT AUTHORIZED TO WEAR TIGER STRIPE UNIFORMS, ONLY THEIR US ISSUE UNIFORMS.

 

ONLY US MARINES THAT WERE ASSIGNED TO THE SOUTH VIETNAMESE MARINE CORPS WERE AUTHORIZED TO WEAR THEIR VNMC TIGER STRIPE UNIFORM,  ALSO US MARINES ASSIGNED TO RUNG SAT SPECIAL ZONE POPULAR FORCE UNITS, IF THEY WANTED TO WEAR THE VNMC TIGER STRIPES SINCE THEY ALL WERE ATTACHED TO THE MARINE ADVISOR UNIT (MAU) WHICH FELL UNDER THE NAVAL ADVISORY GROUP (NAG) VIETNAM.  SOME OF THE VNMC ADVISORS WERE SHIFTED OVER TO THE RSSZ TO ADVISE THE LOCAL POPULAR FORCES.

[whittond]

MY DISPLAY PICTURE SHOWING ALL OF THE US MARINE CORPS INFANTRY & RECON RELATED UNIFORM AND FIELD GEAR VARIATIONS WORN FROM 1964-1975, SHOWS A 1966-67 FORCE RECON MARINE STANDING IN THE CENTER OF THE DISPLAY,  HE IS NOT WEARING A VNMC TIGER STRIPE UNIFORM.  HE IS WEARING A LIGHT WEIGHT POPLIN TIGER STRIPE UNIFORM THAT WAS THE MOST POPULAR WITH FORCE RECON MARINES AND US MARINES ASSIGNED TO THE MACV-SOG NAVAL COMMANDO GROUP.

[USMC_COLLECTOR]

Thank you so much.

[whittond]

HERE ARE THE TWO NON-TIGER STRIPE UNIFORMS WORN BY THE US MARINE ADVISORS AND THE SOUTH VIETNAMESE MARINES DURING 1966-68 WHEN THEY WERE HAVING A VERY HARD TIME GETTING SUPPLIED WITH THEIR VNMC TIGER STRIPE UNIFORMS.

 

 

[spec6-spencer]

Wow what an impressive collection

[whittond]

AS FOR THE POSSIBLE 1958-1961 FIRST VNMC TIGER STRIPE UNIFORM,  I ONLY HAVE THESE BLACK AND WHITE PICTURES OF IT, AND THEY ARE NOT IN SUFFICIANT DETAIL TO TELL IF THEY MATCH THE 1962-63 1ST PATTERN VNMC TIGER STRIPE SHIRT IN MY UNIFORM VARIATION PLATES.

 

I WOULD LOVE THE OWNER OF THAT 1958 OR 1959 VNMC QUARTER MASTER MARKED AND DATED TIGER STRIPE SHIRT TO PROVIDE US ALL SOME HIGH-RESOLUTION IMAGES OF THE SHIRTS FRONT VIEW, BACK VIEW AND VNMC QM MARKING.

 

HERE IS THE OLDEST KNOWN PHOTO OF A US MARINE ADVISOR TO THE VNMC,  THIS WAS TAKEN IN 1959 MOST LIKELY OR 1960 (ADVISOR COULD NOT REMEMBER), CAPT GOTT USMC SEEN WEARING THE USMC MONTANA PEAK CAMPAIGN HAT AND THE VNMC BRIGADE POCKET HANGER PATCH, HIS TS UNIFORM IS WHAT I AM CALLING THE US PATTERN COMBAT UNIFORM.  TO HIS IMMEDIATE RIGHT IS A VNMC 1STLT ALSO WEARING THE US PATTERN UNIFORM,  TO THE 1STLT'S RIGHT IS THE BATTALION COMMANDER, THEN A MAJOR WHO IS WEARING THE 1958-59 FRENCH PATTERN COMBAT UNIFORM.

 

 

[whittond]

HERE ARE TWO FAIRLY WELL KNOWN PHOTOS OF SOUTH VIETNAMESE MARINES WEARING VNMC TIGER STRIPE UNIFORM,  WHICH I CALL THE FRENCH PATTERN COMBAT UNIFORM.  THESE ARE BOTH FROM 1958-1959, WHEN THERE WERE ONLY TWO INFANTRY BATTALIONS.  DURING THIS SHORT PERIOD THEY WORE EITHER A 1ST OR 2ND BATTALION PATCH ON THEIR LEFT SHOULDER.  IT IS A BLACK CIRCLE BACKING, WITH A RED STAR SEWN ON THE CENTER OF THE BLACK CIRCLE, AND EITHER A WHITE " 1 " OR WHITE " 2 " EMBROIDERED ON THE CENTER OF THE RED STAR.

 

 

[whittond]

12 minutes ago, whittond said:

AN ADJUSTMENT TO THE EARLIER POST.  " WEARING THEIR TIGER STRIPE UNIFORM "

 

HERE IS THE OLDEST KNOWN PHOTO OF A US MARINE ADVISOR TO THE VNMC WEARING THEIR TIGER STRIPE UNIFORM,  THIS WAS TAKEN IN 1959 MOST LIKELY OR 1960 (ADVISOR COULD NOT REMEMBER), CAPT GOTT USMC SEEN WEARING THE USMC MONTANA PEAK CAMPAIGN HAT AND THE VNMC BRIGADE POCKET HANGER PATCH, HIS TS UNIFORM IS WHAT I AM CALLING THE US PATTERN COMBAT UNIFORM.  TO HIS IMMEDIATE RIGHT IS A VNMC 1STLT ALSO WEARING THE US PATTERN UNIFORM,  TO THE 1STLT'S RIGHT IS THE BATTALION COMMANDER, THEN A MAJOR WHO IS WEARING THE 1958-59 FRENCH PATTERN COMBAT UNIFORM.

 

 

 

 

[easterneagle87]

WOW-ZAA!!

[jerry_k]

Wow!

[carrabassett]

Fantastic! Thanks so much for sharing this amazing reference material.

[whittond]

ADDITIONAL VIEWS OF THE VNMC TIGER STRIPE UNIFORM PATTERNS, USING THE BACK SIDES FOR FULL PATTERN VIEW.

 

REALISTICALLY, MY REFERENCED 1ST PATTERN VNMC TIGER STRIPE UNIFORMS (1962-1963 SILKY COTTON POPLIN) AND THE (1964-1966 NYLON / POLYESTER COTTON POPLIN) REALLY SHOULD BE SEPERATE PATTERNS, AS THEY BOTH HAVE DESTINCTIVE PATTERN STYLES.

 

I HAVE ALSO INCLUDED ADDITION VIEWS OF THE (1968-1969 3RD PATTERN VNMC TS WHICH WAS MADE IN A GREEN SHADE VERSION AND AN OLIVE GREEN SHADE VERSION),  ALSO THE SAME SITUATION WITH THE (1970-1975 5TH PATTERN VNMC TS WHICH WAS ALSO MADE IN A GREEN SHADE VERSION AND AN OLIVE GREEN SHADE VERSION).

 

 

[whittond]

ALL OF THE VNMC ADVISOR TIGER STRIPE UNIFORMS I HAVE PICTURED IN THE UNIFORM PATTERN PHOTOS ARE ALL MINT CONDITION, UNWASHED, UNWORN CONDITION UNIFORMS WITH EXCEPTION TO THE ONE FRONT VIEW 1968-1969 3RD PATTERN VNMC ADV SHIRT (CAPT KAMMEIER), IT WAS WASHED ONCE AND WORN JUST BEFORE HEADING BACK TO THE US.   ALL OF THE OTHER TIGER STRIPE VERSIONS SHOWN, BOTH FRONT AND BACK VIEWS WERE THE GOING HOME UNIFORMS THAT WERE NEVER LAUNDERED OR WORN (CLOSET HANGERS).

 

THE TWO 1966-67 ERDL CAMO UNIFORMS SHOWN WERE BOTH WASHED / COMBAT WORN. 

[whittond]

ONE OTHER IMPORTANT NOTE ABOUT THE UNIFORMS THE US MARINE, VNMC ADVISORS WERE ISSUED AND WORE:

 

THE 1962 - 1968, 1ST PATTERN THROUGH 2ND PATTERN VNMC TIGER STRIPE ADVISOR UNIFORMS WERE ALL VNMC ISSUED UNIFORMS AND VNMC QUARTER MASTER MARKED.  THE ONLY EXCEPTION TO THIS WAS SPECIALIZED UNIFORMS OR FIELD GEAR ITEMS SUCH AS A 1964-1969 US JUNGLE STYLE MADE UNIFORM, OR INFANTRY / MAP MADE VEST. 

 

THE 1968-1975, 3RD PATTERN THROUGH 6TH PATTERN VNMC TIGER STRIPE ADVISOR UNIFORMS WERE ALL TAILOR SHOP MADE FROM LARGE BOLTS OF TS MATERIAL FOR THE ADVISOR.  ON SOME RARE OCCASIONS THE TAYLOR SHOP WOULD PLACE THEIR LABEL INSIDE THE FIELD UNIFORM.

[whittond]

PICTURED BELOW ARE TWO SUCH BOLTS OF 1968 VNMC 3RD PATTERN TIGERSTRIPE MATERIAL THAT LCDR HINES (VNMC MEDICAL COMPANY AND NEWLY FORMED MEDICAL BATTALION SENIOR ADVISOR) AND FIRST USN/MC MEDICAL OFFICER ASSIGNED TO THE VNMC, BROUGHT HOME THAT HE NEVER USED FOR ANYTHING.

(PRIOR TO LCDR HINES ARRIVAL IN 1967, FROM 1954-1967 THE VNMC MEDICAL COMPANY HAD A SENIOR USN CORPSMAN / HOSPITALMAN, 2ND CLASS PETTY OFFICER - CHIEF PETTY OFFICER, ASSIGNED TO THE VNMC). 

 

ONE COMPLETE UNIFORM WITH HEADGEAR (BOONIE HAT AND USMC STYLE FIELD COVER) CAN BE MADE OUT ONE ONE CLOTH BOLT.

[whittond]

 I AM ALWAYS LOOKING FOR ADDITIONAL 1954 - 1975 US MARINE VIETNAM ADVISOR ( VNMC / RSSZ / ARVN / MACV-SOG / CAP / CAG ) ITEMS FOR MY COLLECTION.

 

I HAVE ALSO BEEN ASSISTING FOR MANY YEARS NOW, OTHER COLLECTORS WITH VERIFING THE AUTHENTICITY OF THEIR VNMC US MARINE ADVISOR UNIFORMS, OR A UNIFORM THEY ARE CONSIDERING BUYING, AND PROVIDING WHAT INFORMATION I MAY HAVE ON AN ADVISOR'S UNIFORM THEY OWN (TOUR INFO / PHOTOS / ETC).

 

I HAVE A 99.5% COMPLETE ROSTER OF US MARINE, VNMC ADVISORS FROM 1954-1975, THAT COVERS THEIR ADVISOR TOUR YEARS, THEIR RANK/RANKS HELD, AND THE VNMC UNIT/UNITS (Co/Bn) THEY ADVISED.            THIS INFORMATION WAS COMPILED FROM THE VNMC, MARINE ADVISORY UNIT HQs, OFFICIAL DOCUMENTS / COVAN NEWS LETTERS / HQMC PERSONEL REPORTS / LOG BOOKS / TRAVEL ORDERS / AFTER ACTION REPORTS(AARs) / ADVISOR NOTE BOOKS / ADVISOR PERSONAL LETTERS AND FROM THE ADVISORS THEMSELFS.

 

I ALSO HAVE SOME VERY LIMITED INFORMATION ON US MARINE ADVISOR'S THAT SERVED WITH SOUTH VIETNAMESE UNITS (RSSZ / ARVN / MACV-SOG / CAP / CAG), 1964-1973.

[whittond]

HERE ARE SOME RANK PLATES FOR THE ARVN & VNMC RANK INSIGNIA WORN ON VNMC ADVISOR UNIFORM RIGHT SIDE SHIRT POCKET FLAPS AND BERETS/BOONIES/COVERS, NOT ALREADY COVERED IN THE ABOVE SECTIONS.

 

1964-1967 ARVN (ARMY) PIN ON / CLUTCH BACKED RANK IS RARELY SEEN BEING WORN ON A VNMC ADVISOR'S: BERET, BOONIE, USMC STYLE UTILITY COVER, SHIRT.

 

1968-1970 ARVN (ARMY) PIN ON / CLUTCH BACKED RANK IS MORE COMMONLY SEEN BEING WORN ON A VNMC ADVISOR'S: BERET, BOONIE, USMC STYLE UTILITY COVER, SHIRT (POCKET FLAP, OR CENTER CHEST AREA).

 

1969-1971 ARVN (ARMY) DIRECT EMBROIDERED RANK IS MORE COMMONLY SEEN BEING WORN ON A VNMC ADVISOR'S: SHIRT RIGHT SIDE POCKET FLAP. 

 

1971-1975 VNMC DIRECT EMBROIDERED, OR SEWN ON COLLAR RANK IS MORE COMMONLY SEEN BEING WORN ON A VNMC ADVISOR'S: SHIRT RIGHT SIDE POCKET FLAP, BOONIE, USMC STYLE COVER.

 

 

[Dave T]

Like everyone else...WOW!! Fantastic collection!

Also great educational thread! Thanks for posting and taking the time to create!

[dmar836]

Welcome to the forum. Thanks for sharing your collection.

Great info here!

Dave