What patch reference book do you use?

[patches]

For every "dedicated" patch reference book there are others which contain detailed images of patches as a part of their overall content. Impossible to list them all here, but, for example, Ken Lewis' (General Apathy) "Doughboy to GI"...Gary Howard's "America's Finest" (Airborne patches and ovals etc) Jon Maguire's books on USAAF flight jackets etc. etc....there's a whole bunch of them out there. You'll need a big bookcase and plenty of $$$ to accomodate them all!

 

Correctomundo Ian :thumbsup: , these books you mentioned above and more, like items direct from the source, such as Armed Forces unit yearbooks, Armed Forces Basic/Boot Training yearbooks, Armed Forces Periodicals of yesteryear, to name a few, would you believe I have concrete proof that a 503rd Parachute Infantry ROCK pocket patch could be worn as a Shoulder Combat Patch ? yes it could, the source ? a photo of an Officer at his desk, seen in a 1950s unit yearbook, there it is the 503rd ROCK pocket patch on his Right Shoulder. As one can see, these items that I mentioned can be of unfathomable help.

[mortaydc60]

Correctomundo Ian :thumbsup: , these books you mentioned above and more, like items direct from the source, such as Armed Forces unit yearbooks, Armed Forces Basic/Boot Training yearbooks, Armed Forces Periodicals of yesteryear, to name a few, would you believe I have concrete proof that a 503rd Parachute Infantry ROCK pocket patch could be worn as a Shoulder Combat Patch ? yes it could, the source ? a photo of an Officer at his desk, seen in a 1950s unit yearbook, there it is the 503rd ROCK pocket patch on his Right Shoulder. As one can see, these items that I mentioned can be of unfathomable help.

 

 

 

When I first started collecting over 60 years ago by far the best reference and help was the Joel and Arnoff catalog and the later small addition which was just afew pages. Well organized and in color; and had what you would find in the typical Army and Navy store of the day. Mort

[Patchhouse2]

From my personal experience, I am not sure there is a conclusive single source reference on shoulder sleeve insignia. As I recommendation I would encourage everyone to look at things by experience levels:

 

- Novice / Beginning collectors.

 

-- Richard Smith's 2 books are the cornerstone of any reference library in my view. These are the only SSI books I know of that contain a history of insignia in them now available. They are in color and basically stick with authorized insignia. Downside, out of print but can stilled be located.

 

-- ASMIC's pubs on patches are also great reference and a must have. Downside, in B&W and dated. Regardless, an inexpensive reference and a good supplement to Smitty's book. (NOTE. A good reason to join ASMIC .... avail oneself to the pub's that are available).

 

-- Washignton's books. A grain or two of caution when using these but not a bad reference. I believe these are also out of print but can be located.

 

-- Chris Aleck's book. A good reference, inexpensive. Positive point. Relatively current. Downside. Black and white and only authorized insignia.

 

-- What everyone has not yet mentioned so far are the 4 National Geographics. (a) One from 1919 (WWI medal primarily). ( 3 from World War II covering patches, medals, metal insignia, etc.. These to me are also must have's and a cornerstone next to Smitty's book.

 

-- ASMIC Trading Posts. Another reason to join ASMIC. Get these, gather what one kind of past issues. Outstanding references containing a ton of information.

 

-- ASMIC's motto catalog. While most think this is only good for DIs / unit crests, it can be used for many other purposes to include the ID of PP's with motto's on them.

 

- Intermediate collectors:

 

-- Keller's books (all 4 to date).

 

-- My book (Army Service Commands of WWII - Their History and Insignia). This was included in a discussion thread in the book section sometime ago. Many variations of Service Command SSIs that most collectors do not know about.

 

-- Smitty's book (as authored by Steve Johnson) on State Guard insignia. Another excellent reference.

 

-- Books published by the Center of Military History. Many of these are old and out of print but great references if one can locate them.

 

- Intermediate / Advanced collectors: Whatever else one can find (e.g., unit histories, other books, etc.).

 

- Speciality areas:

 

-- Speciality areas like chevrons, metal insignia and flashes / ovals are also addressed by several excellent references. The CD dicsussed in other threads on flashes / ovals as well as William (Bill) Emerson's books are outstanding in these areas.

 

-- For things like DIs. ASMIC pub's are great as well as many others that exist. Confident those who are DI collectors can expand on this topic.

 

-- For Air Force collectors. Jerry Polder's books are great. Understand some of these may be hard to locate but I have heard many positive comments about them.

 

-- Army AF collectors. A great supplement to one's library are the two volumes titled "Pinks and Greens." Outstanding information and images. Equal to Keller's books in quality. A ton of info.

 

-- Dress for Duty. Comes in 2 volumes. Covers insignia of women in the armed services and home front organizations (actually more than just insignia). Well done and a great insignia. Book my Jill Halcomb Smith.

 

Morgan's books are relatively available but, in my mind, MUST be used with a high degree of caution. My issue with them is the large amount of novelty and "unauthorized" insignia embedded in the two different editions. The reference does not distinguish between authorized, novelty or unauthorized. Some fakes are illustrated as well as some incorrect association of tabs with SSIs. Bottom line. OK but DO NOT rely on it as a quality and good reference (my opinion).

 

Trust this is help. Again. my views of the world but a view I would recommend to a collector. Good references are a must. Others do exist. I also personally know several other potentially outstanding references are in development / pending publication. Watch for these over the next 12 - 24 months. Many of these will add a new depth to collecting SSI s and fill several voids in needed information.

 

A book soon to be out is Ross Ford's book on WWI era insignia. I saw a draft of the book at SOS. Appears to be nice book that many could use.

 

Mike

[JimmCapp]

My Smith & Pelz book is well used also.

My patch mentor Jim Hess introduced me to it not long after it was published and told me he knew the author.

There are some other nice books out since then as well, like the Keller volumes, which I love too.

[ASMIC2971]

All good books mentioned so far. One quick question though. What is the 4th Keller's book? I know about the Armies/Corps book and both Infantry Divisions.

 

Drew

[Teamski]

All good books mentioned so far. One quick question though. What is the 4th Keller's book? I know about the Armies/Corps book and both Infantry Divisions.

 

Drew

 

Keller's 4th book is "Emblems of Honor" about armor and cav patches.

 

I concur that the best books to get hands down are both Richard Smith books, although the 1946-1989 one is pretty out of date but chocked full of good info, and Chris Aleck's book which is by far the most up to date. Once you get into collecting, Keller's books are good follow-ups. Morgan's and Stein's books have fantasy patches that were never worn including regimental pocket patches. No good for starting collectors.

 

-Ski

[ASMIC2971]

Thanks Ski!

[Jim Baker]

Very surprised that no one mentioned the ASMIC patch pamphlets; these are my most used and contain many variations. Main negative is that they are not in color and are drawings not photos. Until recently when the above mentioned books came out like Steins,Browns ,Morgans and Kellers the ASMIC books were my go to source. Mort

 

 

Considering their resources and the very knowledgeable membership of ASMIC, I have never understood why they have not put out a photographic resource (or several) for patch collectors. It seems they could rival anything ever published, past or present.

 

I will say the Trading Post is much improved over the last few years. In this day and age, younger collectors (actually any collectors I know) like color photos.

[uplandmod]

Considering their resources and the very knowledgeable membership of ASMIC, I have never understood why they have not put out a photographic resource (or several) for patch collectors. It seems they could rival anything ever published, past or present.

 

I will say the Trading Post is much improved over the last few years. In this day and age, younger collectors (actually any collectors I know) like color photos.

You have a great point here, when I first started to buy books in the 1990s I was shown the ASMIC DUI book and it had no pictures in it but descrptions of each one. It turned me off about ASMIC books until recently. The art design of these books so dated eventhough it had the best info available. I am one of those young collectors who needed to see colored pictures!

Leonardo

[patches]

In the rear flap of the dust jacket of the 4th book, it says a 5th book will be put out, this one dealing with Infantry, Artillery, and other Combat, Combat support unit Pocket patches, smal leval unit shoulder patches from these units, plus Airborne Infantry, to include ovals, cap patches, ETC, is as of yet not been released, thats to bad, I do hope the project has not been shelved, as it promises to be good.

[Insigina Hunter]

My first two books were both the "Silver Wings Pinks and Greens" books then I bought Christopher P. Brown titled "US Military Patches of WW II ... and today I was the lucky winner of Richard Smiths book for $10.50 (what A steal!) Next it will be the volumes of Keller and Keller books.

[Teamski]

My first two books were both the "Silver Wings Pinks and Greens" books then I bought Christopher P. Brown titled "US Military Patches of WW II ... and today I was the lucky winner of Richard Smiths book for $10.50 (what A steal!) Next it will be the volumes of Keller and Keller books.

 

 

Which Smith book? The WWII one or the post WWII one?

 

-Ski

[Insigina Hunter]

Which Smith book? The WWII one or the post WWII one?

 

-Ski

 

The World War Two book ... I only collect patches from that era at the moment.

[Dave]

A book soon to be out is Ross Ford's book on WWI era insignia. I saw a draft of the book at SOS. Appears to be nice book that many could use.

 

Mike

 

 

Mike:

 

Thanks for the thorough post!

 

What is Ross' book going to be on? There's a need for a solid book on Army SSIs from WW1...will his book cover those, or be more along the lines of general WW1 insignia?

 

Thanks

 

Dave

[Patchhouse2]

Dave,

 

The color plates I saw on Ross's book were all about WWI patches. I believe he is trying to document when the patches were first used / approved. I know in going through a number of TIOH files on different research trips several months ago, most of the WWI era patches were approved "in country" by General Pershing's AEF HQ. It was not until the 1920's that the War Department began reviewing / approving insignia designs. I am not sure if Ross's focus is what the War Department approved or if he goes back to what he can find on the AEF approvals.

 

I would have to find my notes but I do not believe the Army began to standardize the colors (e.g., "cable" as they call it on the drawings) as well as the insignia size until the mid to late 1930's. Standardization is probably a very broad term here but my thought is the Army was trying to reign in just how big insignia could be as well as the colors. A good example is the 1st Army insignia. Outside of the 1st and 2d Cav Division SSIs, most SSIs out of the 1930's started to take on somewhat of a standard size, look and feel.

 

Ross's book should be a big help for collectors, filling a void on what were the standards on the early use of SSIs. Hope this helps.

 

Mike

[Dave]

Dave,

 

The color plates I saw on Ross's book were all about WWI patches. I believe he is trying to document when the patches were first used / approved. I know in going through a number of TIOH files on different research trips several months ago, most of the WWI era patches were approved "in country" by General Pershing's AEF HQ. It was not until the 1920's that the War Department began reviewing / approving insignia designs. I am not sure if Ross's focus is what the War Department approved or if he goes back to what he can find on the AEF approvals.

 

I would have to find my notes but I do not believe the Army began to standardize the colors (e.g., "cable" as they call it on the drawings) as well as the insignia size until the mid to late 1930's. Standardization is probably a very broad term here but my thought is the Army was trying to reign in just how big insignia could be as well as the colors. A good example is the 1st Army insignia. Outside of the 1st and 2d Cav Division SSIs, most SSIs out of the 1930's started to take on somewhat of a standard size, look and feel.

 

Ross's book should be a big help for collectors, filling a void on what were the standards on the early use of SSIs. Hope this helps.

 

Mike

 

Mike:

 

Thanks a bunch! I certainly look forward to seeing it when it's ready for "prime time"!!! :thumbsup:

 

Dave