Canteen, 2 QT, Bladder, 1st & 2nd Pattern, 1962 - 1964 period

[Justin]

Does anyone have any photos (or video clip) of 1st and 2nd pattern 2 qt canteen sets in use? I've seen a few clips of the 2nd patterns in use and have a picture or two saved somewhere also there was nice color footage during Vietnam in HD of one being used, so more interested in 1st pattern sets.

2nd pattern:

Thanks, Justin

[14alpha]

Here's one of just the pouch in use, couldn't find anything else except for what you posted. Hope this helps.

[Justin]

Here's one of just the pouch in use, couldn't find anything else except for what you posted. Hope this helps.

Thanks. I see a 3rd pattern, but not a second or first?

[Justin]

I fixed yout title, please confirm it is as you wanted.

 

Exactly which canteens are you refering to as 1st and 2nd pattern?

Thank you Craig.

 

Here's what I am refering too.

 

On the left, 1st pattarn which is similar to the WWII "Jungle" Canteen. I believe they are 61-62 era, and second pattern on the right which is 63-64 era. I have seen 2ed patterns in use, but I'd like to see some more photos of them, I do not recall seeing a 1st pattern.

[craig_pickrall]

I did a look for photos of the canteens in use. So far I haven't found any. I know I have books showing them in use but I have never copied any of these photos.

 

I don't have the specs for the first pattern but the specs for your second pattern was issued 22 JAN 1963 and cancelled 23 JAN 1967.

 

I don't know if you are aware of this but the Aussies copied the first pattern but the cover is made of rubberized camo material. It was populsr with SF. There was also an Aussie raincoat made of camo material that was popular with SF.

[Justin]

I did a look for photos of the canteens in use. So far I haven't found any. I know I have books showing them in use but I have never copied any of these photos.

 

I don't have the specs for the first pattern but the specs for your second pattern was issued 22 JAN 1963 and cancelled 23 JAN 1967.

 

I don't know if you are aware of this but the Aussies copied the first pattern but the cover is made of rubberized camo material. It was populsr with SF. There was also an Aussie raincoat made of camo material that was popular with SF.

Thanks for the info Craig. Yes I am aware of the Aussie copies. I recently added a first pattern set to my collection and it got me looking for photos of them in use, but I have not been able to find yet.

[sgtmonroe]

I recently added a first pattern set to my collection and it got me looking for photos of them in use, but I have not been able to find yet.

How is your set marked? Is it one of the FY1962 test sets (indicated by a "J" in the stock number) or one of the FY1963 standardized sets?

 

The first FY1962 test sets (made by ILC) were all shipped to the Counter Insurgency Warfare School - so theoretically none of them would have seen service in Southeast Asia (that it not to say that some might have been carried with an advisor on to SEA). It was standardized, as Craig pointed out, on 22 January 1963. Some of the FY1963 sets had to have made it to SEA as feedback of their use made it to Natick and led to the revisions seen on the 28 October 1965 standardized version (the one you are referring to as a "2nd pattern").

 

The only two images I am 100% sure have the 22 January 1963 standardized version pictured were taken CONUS during a USSF demonstration.

[Justin]

How is your set marked? Is it one of the FY1962 test sets (indicated by a "J" in the stock number) or one of the FY1963 standardized sets?

 

The first FY1962 test sets (made by ILC) were all shipped to the Counter Insurgency Warfare School - so theoretically none of them would have seen service in Southeast Asia (that it not to say that some might have been carried with an advisor on to SEA). It was standardized, as Craig pointed out, on 22 January 1963. Some of the FY1963 sets had to have made it to SEA as feedback of their use made it to Natick and led to the revisions seen on the 28 October 1965 standardized version (the one you are referring to as a "2nd pattern").

 

The only two images I am 100% sure have the 22 January 1963 standardized version pictured were taken CONUS during a USSF demonstration.

Great info.

 

Mine is marked:

 

CANTEEN, COLLAPSIBLE, 2 QUART CAPACITY

FSN 8465 - J22 -0002

INTERNATIONAL LATEX CORP.

CONTRACT NO. DA 19-129 OM - 2044 0.1. 6121

[sgtmonroe]

The "J" in the stock number indicates it was one of the sets procured by QMR&E (later renamed Natick Labs) from ILC for the USSF Counter Insurgency Warfare School. At the time it had been classified Limited Procument Type to allow it to be procured for use while, at the same time, testing could be completed at Fort Clayton.

[MattD]

Justin

 

Do you have Shelby's Book "Special Forces at War"? There is a pic of some SF guys on patrol-wearing Beo-gam camo. One is bending over and you can see the 1st pattern 2 qrt on his rucksack

[Justin]

Justin

 

Do you have Shelby's Book "Special Forces at War"? There is a pic of some SF guys on patrol-wearing Beo-gam camo. One is bending over and you can see the 1st pattern 2 qrt on his rucksack

 

Nope, don't have that one. Thanks

[Allen Dail]

Hello Justint these are the few pics I could find.

The first two photos are form the magazine Vietnam Combat Winter 1987. The 1st pic from page 26 the soldier in front of the radio operator has the canteen.

2nd pic page 42

 

This pic is from the magazine Vietnam CombatVol 1 No3 winter 1986

Page 36-37 Looks like the soldier has a later two quart canteen in an earlier carrier or a one quart canteen not 100% sure on that.

Page 36-37 Looks like the soldier has a later two quart canteen in an earlier carrier or a one quart canteen not 100% sure on that.

 

This pic is from US Infantry-Vietnam Squadron Signal combat troops no 6 1983 isbn 0-89747-151-2 page 23

 

Both of the Dog handlers have the canteens.

Hope this helps

Allen

[Justin]

Excellent! The first picture is great, just what I was looking for. Thanks!

[Allen Dail]

Excellent! The first picture is great, just what I was looking for. Thanks!

Glad to be able to help

Allen

[sgtmonroe]

Another one I came across today...sorry no date, but obviously early advisor-period...images is captioned:

Australian AATTV advisor Lt. John Scales and MACV advisor Captain James Garvey conduct weapons training at the Vietnamese Ranger Center at Duc My.

[Justin]

Another one I came across today...sorry no date, but obviously early advisor-period...images is captioned:

Australian AATTV advisor Lt. John Scales and MACV advisor Captain James Garvey conduct weapons training at the Vietnamese Ranger Center at Duc My.

 

Thanks!

[Bob Hudson]

 

The first FY1962 test sets (made by ILC) were all shipped to the Counter Insurgency Warfare School - so theoretically none of them would have seen service in Southeast Asia (that it not to say that some might have been carried with an advisor on to SEA). It was standardized, as Craig pointed out, on 22 January 1963. Some of the FY1963 sets had to have made it to SEA as feedback of their use made it to Natick and led to the revisions seen on the 28 October 1965 standardized version (the one you are referring to as a "2nd pattern").

 

 

No pictures of these in Vietnam, but the vet I got them from carried these when he was with MACV in 64-65. He retired as soon as he got back to the states and just tossed these into a footlocker.

 

 

 

 

[BigMoose]

One of the reasons you don't see them often, is the canteen made for them got a hole poked in it if you even looked crosswise at it. It certainly wasn't hard to accomplish that feat.

 

If you see the covers used, it is almost always with the modern 2qt canteen in them.

 

When I find them, I never find the canteen, usually empty or with the more modern canteen in it. (Found one with a 1982 2qt in it)

[Bob Hudson]

Well I tested these and both hold water! I talked to the vet today and he just happened to mention that he was sent to the Counter Insurgency School before he went to Vietnam.