PATHFINDER PATCH

[SLEV2252]

Hi Guys,can can anyone confirm if this patch is genuine or fake,or maybe theater made.Any observations would be appreciated.

Thanks,Steve.

[BILL THE PATCH]

i know others will chime in also, but to me it looks like a repo patch made in england in the late 70's early 80's. i have some other patches like that. but was tols they are repo's i copuld be wrong it's just my two cents. i hope i'm wrong for your sake. there were brit made pathfinder patches made during the war but not like this one.

[tredhed2]

The wool is too coarse (and the incorrect color), the cables too thick, too many loose cables on the reverse, the cloth backing inconsistent w/ period originals. This is an insignia made well after WW II for the collector's market.

 

If you search pathfinder in this arena, you will find lots of info. Here is one example:

 

http://www.usmilitariaforum.com/forums/ind...p;hl=pathfinder

[Sabrejet]

Looks like a Paki product to me. I have a British-made WW2 example...much finer quality.

 

Sabrejet

[SLEV2252]

Thanks for the observations,i think this one will be going back for a refund.

Steve.

[fiveodeuce]

Hello,

I do believe this a reproduction, I'm going to show an original of the version they tried to copy (it's a little rough). This is the hardest type of british made pathfinder wing to find.

James

[fiveodeuce]

back

[JR KENMARK]

The one originally shown is a reproduction/fake.

 

The one James shows is a beauty and he is right, A tough one to find.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

No man is a failure who has friends.-Clarence

[treetop]

I believe that the original wing shown is from Pakistan. The Paki's have made some nice repros and are sure to fool someone. The one shown by Jim is beautiful. I have about 30 PF wings but no original WWll model. I do have a beautifully made WWll repro on dark blue wool.

[Patchcollector]

Hi Guys,can can anyone confirm if this patch is genuine or fake,or maybe theater made.Any observations would be appreciated.

Thanks,Steve.

 

 

I'm no expert by any means,but just because a theatre made patch doe not conform to another members patch,doe'snt necessarily mean that it is a fake.

These were theatre made in peoples houses by individuals that had different materials,and techniques,for heavens sake!Also,some were worn more than others,exposed to the elements more than others,etc...The color and "coarseness" of the material looks very close to the other one pictured,and the size of the "cables" don't appear to be too different as well.One does definitely

look more "salty" than the other,but that is not unusual.My advice is to post it on the British Badge Forum.I joined up there some time back after I posted a Chindits patch on here,not knowing it was not allowed.I was told it was a fake here too,but the guys at the British forum all confirmed that it was indeed genuine,and many offered to buy it from me!The chaps there are very helpful and knowledgeable,try posting it there before you return it,you never know!

[Allan H.]

I'm no expert by any means,but just because a theatre made patch doe not conform to another members patch,doe'snt necessarily mean that it is a fake.

These were theatre made in peoples houses by individuals that had different materials,and techniques,for heavens sake!Also,some were worn more than others,exposed to the elements more than others,etc...The color and "coarseness" of the material looks very close to the other one pictured,and the size of the "cables" don't appear to be too different as well.One does definitely

look more "salty" than the other,but that is not unusual.My advice is to post it on the British Badge Forum.I joined up there some time back after I posted a Chindits patch on here,not knowing it was not allowed.I was told it was a fake here too,but the guys at the British forum all confirmed that it was indeed genuine,and many offered to buy it from me!The chaps there are very helpful and knowledgeable,try posting it there before you return it,you never know!

 

 

In this case, it has been pretty well established that the patch that initiated this thread is indeed a reproduction. Of course, there are always people out there who are more than happy to believe that these patches are rare, theater made examples, and if Pakistan is "in theater," then they are right. Those sellers who are looking to pass spurious pieces like this are more than happy to find those gullible buyers as they make a huge profit for patches that can quickly be replaced with the next shipment from Paki-land.

I do agree that it never hurts to get a second opinion, but you really need to make sure that you are getting counsel from those whose opinions mean something. I am not disparaging the gentlemen on the other forum mentioned above, but making sure that the credentials of those making the pronouncements are sufficient to merit listening to.

Allan

[vostoktrading]

Steve, This looks like a fake to me. Jon.

[Patchcollector]

In this case, it has been pretty well established that the patch that initiated this thread is indeed a reproduction. Of course, there are always people out there who are more than happy to believe that these patches are rare, theater made examples, and if Pakistan is "in theater," then they are right. Those sellers who are looking to pass spurious pieces like this are more than happy to find those gullible buyers as they make a huge profit for patches that can quickly be replaced with the next shipment from Paki-land.

I do agree that it never hurts to get a second opinion, but you really need to make sure that you are getting counsel from those whose opinions mean something. I am not disparaging the gentlemen on the other forum mentioned above, but making sure that the credentials of those making the pronouncements are sufficient to merit listening to.

Allan

 

 

When it comes to whether a patch is a repro or not,the only patches that I can say with 100% certainty are not repos are the ones that I earned and received when I was in the military.

All the others in my collection,no matter how good they "look" ,I cannot vouch for them,as I did not receive them personally.Some on this forum pronounce patches repros as if they were

present when the patch was made!A patch that is 70 years old,has been worn,and washed, and made during wartime under less than ideal conditions by hand can have some fairly major variations in

color,materials used,etc...I merely suggested that,due to these factors being present,it would be wise to get an opinion that is closer to the source.In this case,The British Badge forum,because the patch

being discussed is said to be from England.By the way,since several members here have found the term "Japanese",and "Japanese-made" to be offensive,might the same be said about such terms as "Paki",or Paki-land"?I'm not from Pakistan nor trying to be too "PC",but just thought that I would mention it.

[Bluehawk]

I'm more convinced than ever that one truly does need to study a full long lifetime, still not seeing all there is to see, in order to identify such things correctly.

 

That's the exciting part of it all...

 

[pac_bob]

When it comes to whether a patch is a repro or not,the only patches that I can say with 100% certainty are not repos are the ones that I earned and received when I was in the military.

All the others in my collection,no matter how good they "look" ,I cannot vouch for them,as I did not receive them personally.Some on this forum pronounce patches repros as if they were

present when the patch was made!A patch that is 70 years old,has been worn,and washed, and made during wartime under less than ideal conditions by hand can have some fairly major variations in

color,materials used,etc...I merely suggested that,due to these factors being present,it would be wise to get an opinion that is closer to the source.In this case,The British Badge forum,because the patch

being discussed is said to be from England.By the way,since several members here have found the term "Japanese",and "Japanese-made" to be offensive,might the same be said about such terms as "Paki",or Paki-land"?I'm not from Pakistan nor trying to be too "PC",but just thought that I would mention it.

 

 

I'd have to agree with Allan and the others that this is a copy. The loose and sloppy thread on the back is a style found in a number of copies of rare patches. I personally got fooled on a 1st Tactical Air Force patch of this type a few years ago. However, to be safe, I would follow PatchCollector's suggestion to pop it on the British Badge forum, as well as seeking the opinions of Dave Johnson, Mort Cohen, and Bill Scott, who have far more experience than many in evaluating patches.

 

Bob Capistrano

[Allan H.]

By the way,since several members here have found the term "Japanese",and "Japanese-made" to be offensive,might the same be said about such terms as "Paki",or Paki-land"?I'm not from Pakistan nor trying to be too "PC",but just thought that I would mention it.

 

I'll consider your point, but with all of the Pakistanis that I have known and worked with while in military service, I can't say that I have ever had one of my Paki allies complain or give me any other indication that they felt offended in some way by the term. That being said, I have worked with a large number of Japanese in my civilian occupation and have heard them use the term "Japanese" many times themselves. I am not saying that I use the term, just that in the name of political correctness, we have villified the term to the point that we can't use it while the Japanese scratch their heads and wonder why. :think: Should we also ban terms like "Ruskie?" It's the Russian language form of "Russian."

 

Allan

[Sabrejet]

Hmmmm....so should we also exclude the term "Brit-made", as used by many posters on this forum when describing the origin of their patches?

 

Sabrejet :think:

 

BTW: I don't do PC!

[Patchcollector]

I'll consider your point, but with all of the Pakistanis that I have known and worked with while in military service, I can't say that I have ever had one of my Paki allies complain or give me any other indication that they felt offended in some way by the term. That being said, I have worked with a large number of Japanese in my civilian occupation and have heard them use the term "Japanese" many times themselves. I am not saying that I use the term, just that in the name of political correctness, we have villified the term to the point that we can't use it while the Japanese scratch their heads and wonder why. :think: Should we also ban terms like "Ruskie?" It's the Russian language form of "Russian."

 

Allan

 

 

I agree with you,I was just referring to the thread that discussed the term "Japanese" made and many members immediately jumped in and said it was offensive,

so when I saw the term "Paki" made,I thought of that earlier thread!It doe'snt bother me,I'm sure that the Japanese and the Pakistanis have their own shortened

forms of describing us! I guess if there was any "point" to my comment,it was that if someone is going to complain about another using a shortened version

of a word to describe a people,then perhaps the complaint should cover all peoples,and not just one,for consistencies sake,if nothing else.

[blkjack07]

BTW: I don't do PC!

Good for you, Sabre.... I suspect that a lot of folks on this forum don't.