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USAAF and USN WW2 era hallmarks

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Here is a scarce one. I've only found it on a small 1-1/2" pilot wing. Anyone know if Dodge made anything larger or different than the Pilot version. post-3515-1215393908.jpg

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AE Co.

 

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Always looking for Wings & Named Air Medals!

Motto: To Collect, Preserve, and Remember!

 

 

 

 

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Robbins "Flying R"

 

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Paul Conrad
Still looking for quality wings!

www.conradwings.com
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I am bored prefixing everything I say with "I think" or "in my opinion".
Everything I say is my opinion; the only thing of which I am certain is that there is very little of which one can be certain.

 


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Orber

 

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Paul Conrad
Still looking for quality wings!

www.conradwings.com
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I am bored prefixing everything I say with "I think" or "in my opinion".
Everything I say is my opinion; the only thing of which I am certain is that there is very little of which one can be certain.

 


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Luxenberg

 

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Paul Conrad
Still looking for quality wings!

www.conradwings.com
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donation2017.gifdonation2018.gifdonation2019.gif

I am bored prefixing everything I say with "I think" or "in my opinion".
Everything I say is my opinion; the only thing of which I am certain is that there is very little of which one can be certain.

 


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Josten

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Paul Conrad
Still looking for quality wings!

www.conradwings.com
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donation2013.gifdonation2014.gifdonation2015.gifdonation2016.gif
donation2017.gifdonation2018.gifdonation2019.gif

I am bored prefixing everything I say with "I think" or "in my opinion".
Everything I say is my opinion; the only thing of which I am certain is that there is very little of which one can be certain.

 


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AE & Co

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Paul Conrad
Still looking for quality wings!

www.conradwings.com
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donation2013.gifdonation2014.gifdonation2015.gifdonation2016.gif
donation2017.gifdonation2018.gifdonation2019.gif

I am bored prefixing everything I say with "I think" or "in my opinion".
Everything I say is my opinion; the only thing of which I am certain is that there is very little of which one can be certain.

 


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NS Meyer Hallmarks (reproduced with permission) ASMIC Trading Post Jan-Mar 1986

 

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So as not to repost everything check ot this thread http://www.usmilitariaforum.com/forums/ind...showtopic=16492 on our own forum and this one

http://www.wehrmacht-awards.com/forums/sho...highlight=meyer at thta OTHER forum :)


Paul Conrad
Still looking for quality wings!

www.conradwings.com
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donation2013.gifdonation2014.gifdonation2015.gifdonation2016.gif
donation2017.gifdonation2018.gifdonation2019.gif

I am bored prefixing everything I say with "I think" or "in my opinion".
Everything I say is my opinion; the only thing of which I am certain is that there is very little of which one can be certain.

 


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These are the four types of K.G. Luke hallmarks I have catalogued. First up is the one most commonly found on the full size wings and Officers Submarine pins. The K.G. Luke is raised and the STERLING is impressed. The STERLING mark is almost allways underneath the maker mark.

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"YOU CAN NEVER HAVE TOO MUCH RED WINE, TOO MANY BOOKS, OR TOO MUCH AMMUNITION."

Rudyard Kipling

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This is the mark most commonly encountered on almost all rank and branch insignia. The hallmark is raised and in most cases rather crudely done. The crudeness is a feature of almost all wartime K.G. Luke hallmarks. There are the occasional marks that are well rendered but they are the exception.

These are the four types of K.G. Luke hallmarks I have catalogued. First up is the one most commonly found on the full size wings and Officers Submarine pins. The K.G. Luke is raised and the STERLING is impressed. The STERLING mark is almost allways underneath the maker mark.

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"YOU CAN NEVER HAVE TOO MUCH RED WINE, TOO MANY BOOKS, OR TOO MUCH AMMUNITION."

Rudyard Kipling

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This mark is most commonly seen on Cap Badges and I have also seen it used on an infantry officers branch insignia.

This is the mark most commonly encountered on almost all rank and branch insignia. The hallmark is raised and in most cases rather crudely done. The crudeness is a feature of almost all wartime K.G. Luke hallmarks. There are the occasional marks that are well rendered but they are the exception.

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"YOU CAN NEVER HAVE TOO MUCH RED WINE, TOO MANY BOOKS, OR TOO MUCH AMMUNITION."

Rudyard Kipling

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This is the only mark I have seen that is impressed. It is seen on silver captains bars(that are not marked STERLING for some reason even though they are) and 1st Lt bars. I have also seen it used on a USMC officers collar EGA but so far on nothing else..

This mark is most commonly seen on Cap Badges and I have also seen it used on an infantry officers branch insignia.

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"YOU CAN NEVER HAVE TOO MUCH RED WINE, TOO MANY BOOKS, OR TOO MUCH AMMUNITION."

Rudyard Kipling

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ROBBINS Co. early 50s

 

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Always looking for Wings & Named Air Medals!

Motto: To Collect, Preserve, and Remember!

 

 

 

 

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Keystone Publishing Company - The Jeweler's Index for 1922

http://www.chicagosilver.com/jmarks1.htm

 

US military badge hallmarks

http://www.wartimecollectables.com/zhallmarks.htm

 

Collecting American wings - The Orber Company of WWII.

http://www.wartimecollectables.com/zorber_wing_article.htm

 

Manufacturers of U.S. Metal Emblems - Alphabetical W.W.I to Present (See Thread #1)

http://www.wehrmacht-awards.com/forums/sho...ead.php?t=84409

 

The Online Encyclopedia of American Silver Marks

http://www.silvercollecting.com/

 

Online Encyclopedia of Silver Marks, Hallmarks & Makers' Marks

http://www.925-1000.com/

 

Reproductions & Fakes -U.S. Airborne & Elite Unit Insignia by Les Hughes

http://www.insigne.org/Fakes-I-Abn.htm


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There is a great deal of information relative to hallmarks/backmarks posted on the following websites:

 

Keystone Publishing Company - The Jeweler's Index for 1922

http://www.chicagosilver.com/jmarks1.htm

 

US military badge hallmarks Has a couple of mistakes but overall it is helpful.

http://www.wartimecollectables.com/zhallmarks.htm

 

Collecting American wings - The Orber Company of WWII.

http://www.wartimecollectables.com/zorber_wing_article.htm

 

Manufacturers of U.S. Metal Emblems - Alphabetical W.W.I to Present (See Thread #1)

http://www.wehrmacht-awards.com/forums/sho...ead.php?t=84409

 

The Online Encyclopedia of American Silver Marks

http://www.silvercollecting.com/

 

Online Encyclopedia of Silver Marks, Hallmarks & Makers' Marks

http://www.925-1000.com/


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I know through previous threads there has been ongoing questions surrounding the authenticity and legitimacy of LG Balfour wings that also have an "S" struck below the LGB hallmark. Back in the mid-90's I was able to purchase two complete salesman sample cases of Balfour insignia which came directly from the son of a Balfour salesman who worked for Balfour during WW2 and beyond. One case contained AAF wings (shown) and the other US Navy insignia including some wings. All of the AAF silver wings were hallmarked either "LGB" or "Balfour" (boxed) depending on size, and virtually (all) were also struck with a "S" below the Balfour hallmark. As you can see from my images, there is a beautiful Balloon trio present in the case, and I believe a Balloon wing was an example in question in a previous thread? All of these wings are absolutely pristine. I'm not sure how many of these sample cases existed, but I'm sure there were probably several. I was fortunate to obtain one that had remained untouched and perfectly intact. My images show the actual case of AAF wings, including a letter from the son detailing the cases, including mention of the "S" hallmark on them. My deduction is that the "S" was used on (sample) insignia made by Balfour. Who knows if they made samples hallmarked in this way of all of their insignia or not? Hopefully this helps add some concrete information surrounding this discussion. Dave

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Military Aviation Artifacts

Specializing In Authentic U.S. Military Aviation Memorabilia

http://www.militaryaviationartifacts.com

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What a terrific posting. Answers a lot of questions with one picture. Thanks for sharing your knowledge and for nailing it shut with the picture!!

 

Paul

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A question...can't tell from your picture if the Observer and Flight Surgeon wings are the finely feathered designs that are distinctly different from most of the others?

 

Also, are the Command Pilot and Senior Pilot wings the first pattern similar to that used by AMCRAFT?

 

Also, can you make any assumption about the use of the Balfour vs. LGB hallmark on these wings? The basic question I have about the two marks is how they chose to use which mark on which wings.

 

Paul

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Hi Paul,

 

The Flight Surgeon, Technical Observer and Observer wings are all the fine feathered variations. The Command and Senior Pilots are the large / tall shield first pattern which is similar to the Amcraft design. I believe the (boxed) "Balfour" was used primarily for the 2" and smaller wings, though there appears to be exception to that in the full size Navy wings ~ go figure? Why they used "LGB" vs "Balfour" and when, I do not know? Dave

 

A question...can't tell from your picture if the Observer and Flight Surgeon wings are the finely feathered designs that are distinctly different from most of the others?

 

Also, are the Command Pilot and Senior Pilot wings the first pattern similar to that used by AMCRAFT?

 

Also, can you make any assumption about the use of the Balfour vs. LGB hallmark on these wings? The basic question I have about the two marks is how they chose to use which mark on which wings.

 

Paul


Military Aviation Artifacts

Specializing In Authentic U.S. Military Aviation Memorabilia

http://www.militaryaviationartifacts.com

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Hello Dave,

Thank you for sharing your beautiful and documented case of Balfour badges. Your opinion that the stamped "S" stands for 'Sample' may very well be correct. However, if that is true, then what are the wings made with? Since they don't possess a government required precious metal marking like Silver, Sterling, Gold Washed, or 1/20th 10KGF, are we to assume the samples are made of a lesser composite or pot metal? I'm throwing this idea out there as more of a question, than a statement.

 

Russ

 

PS. Any chance of getting a couple of close-up views of the back of your Balloon Pilot wings for comparison?


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Hi Russ,

 

I will work on getting you a close-up of the Balloon wing in the short term :thumbsup: Regarding the metal type of the AAF wings, I am very sure these wings are indeed sterling silver, though not marked. They have the same weight and "feel" of other sterling marked Balfour wings that I have had in comparison. My thought regarding why they were not hallmarked as sterling, was possibly the "S" was struck instead given that these particular pieces may have never been intended to be sold or worn? Not sure of that as a fact, just a thought. All of the Navy wings and insignia are hallmarked 1/20 10K GF and the like. Dave


Military Aviation Artifacts

Specializing In Authentic U.S. Military Aviation Memorabilia

http://www.militaryaviationartifacts.com

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Hi Russ,

 

I will work on getting you a close-up of the Balloon wing in the short term :thumbsup: Regarding the metal type of the AAF wings, I am very sure these wings are indeed sterling silver, though not marked. They have the same weight and "feel" of other sterling marked Balfour wings that I have had in comparison. My thought regarding why they were not hallmarked as sterling, was possibly the "S" was struck instead given that these particular pieces may have never been intended to be sold or worn? Not sure of that as a fact, just a thought. All of the Navy wings and insignia are hallmarked 1/20 10K GF and the like. Dave

 

Do any of the wings have the riveted center device or are they one piecers? Also, how thick are they compared to other Balfour wings?

 

Super nice collection of wings there!

 

Thanks for sharing.

 

Patrick

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Hi Patrick,

 

The Flight Surgeon, Gunner and Bombardier wings are all riveted. They are identical in every way to any other WW2 Balfour wing made, except for the "S" hallmark. Dave


Military Aviation Artifacts

Specializing In Authentic U.S. Military Aviation Memorabilia

http://www.militaryaviationartifacts.com

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Beautiful set!

 

Great information, thanks for sharing.

 

Cheers,

 

John


...and on the eighth day, God created the radial engine...

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