Considering Joining the Army Reserve

[GoldenCross]

Hello all!

 

If this is topic is not appropriate for this site, I apologize. I simply felt that this would be a place of great wisdom to ask some questions. Please feel free to remove, if need be.

 

I'm one of the younger guys on the Forum, being 22 years old. I'm completing my undergraduate in June and am currently searching for a career.

 

Long story short, I considered doing ROTC before college, but the idea didn't fly with my parents, who are very protective. Looking back on it now, I was terribly underinformed, so I didn't go through with it.

 

Throughout my four years as a college student, I have thought about joining the Reserves after school, but it was a way's away. Now, I'm finally here and I need to start figuring some things out and make some decisions as an adult.

 

Everyday I'm becoming more and more interested in either enlisting in the Army Reserve or applying for OCS in the Reserve. However, I want to make an informed decision before I do anything. I felt like asking around here because I know many of you guys here have been in or are in the service, and would be the best ones to go to for real, unbiased information. I'm doing my best to talk to as many experienced people as possible, and eventually, I may go talk to a recruiter.

 

It may be tough to cover all of the bases, but I was wondering if some of you could offer your opinions on joining, especially on whether to go enlisted or OCS.

 

Thanks a lot everybody! I appreciate any help you can give!

[Manchu Warrior]

In my humble opinion the best officers had been enlisted first. And I do believe that you can go in as an E4 because you have a degree. Also make sure that what ever you want is written in your contract and don't fall for, "Just ask for it when you get to basic." Good luck with what ever you decide to do!

[willysmb44]

• Be prepared to deploy a lot. The DoD has been using Reserve forces a lot since the 90s, some have argued way beyond what they were ever intended for. People I served on active duty with I kept in touch with have been to the sandbox 2-3 times since 9/11, while a couple of reservist friends have gone more than three times that amount in some cases. I think reserve forces are far more likely to deploy these days (remeber, when you're active, you move from unit to unit, but in the reserves, you're normally with the same unit for your career).
  
• Don't count on even getting an OCS slot. I had plenty of enlisted people under my command who joined up for OCS and never got the chance to even fill out an application.
  
• Even if you get things in writing from the recruiter (which is so important), even then it might not help.
  

[AustinO]

It is stupid to go enlisted with a college degree. Go to OCS or be prepared to deal with the green weenie. If you enter as enlisted and want to go officer you will be competing with a lot of highly skilled combat vet career soldiers. I agree with Manchu that a lot of great officers started enlisted, but I don't think that's reason enough to limit your possibilities in the current Army climate.

Seconding everyone elses opinions of recruiters. They have quotas, they need bodies, and they pillow talk. They will screw you if you don't make them work for you. If you don't like the first recruiter you talk to, tell them to F off and go to another station.

 

What will your degree be in?

[GoldenCross]

In my humble opinion the best officers had been enlisted first. And I do believe that you can go in as an E4 because you have a degree. Also make sure that what ever you want is written in your contract and don't fall for, "Just ask for it when you get to basic." Good luck with what ever you decide to do!

 

Thanks a ton for your input Manchu! I actually spoke to a guy yesterday who was enlisted a few years back and he said the same thing about officers who were enlisted first. I will definitely keep that tip about the contract in mind if I decide to go in!

[GoldenCross]

• Be prepared to deploy a lot. The DoD has been using Reserve forces a lot since the 90s, some have argued way beyond what they were ever intended for. People I served on active duty with I kept in touch with have been to the sandbox 2-3 times since 9/11, while a couple of reservist friends have gone more than three times that amount in some cases. I think reserve forces are far more likely to deploy these days (remeber, when you're active, you move from unit to unit, but in the reserves, you're normally with the same unit for your career).
  
• Don't count on even getting an OCS slot. I had plenty of enlisted people under my command who joined up for OCS and never got the chance to even fill out an application.
  
• Even if you get things in writing from the recruiter (which is so important), even then it might not help.
  

 

 

Thank you very much for your reply! Just to make sure I understood correctly, the trend seems to be that Reservists are being deployed more frequently than active duty?

 

Glad you mentioned the competitive nature of OCS. That's interesting!

[GoldenCross]

It is stupid to go enlisted with a college degree. Go to OCS or be prepared to deal with the green weenie. If you enter as enlisted and want to go officer you will be competing with a lot of highly skilled combat vet career soldiers. I agree with Manchu that a lot of great officers started enlisted, but I don't think that's reason enough to limit your possibilities in the current Army climate.

Seconding everyone elses opinions of recruiters. They have quotas, they need bodies, and they pillow talk. They will screw you if you don't make them work for you. If you don't like the first recruiter you talk to, tell them to F off and go to another station.

 

What will your degree be in?

 

 

Yeah, I thought about that too..

 

Caught between it being dumb to go enlisted with a degree and not even getting a chance to apply for OCS. Haha, what's a guy to do?

 

Thanks for the heads up on recruiters. I figured as much. I'll have to be careful then hahaha

[Manchu Warrior]

It is stupid to go enlisted with a college degree. Go to OCS or be prepared to deal with the green weenie. If you enter as enlisted and want to go officer you will be competing with a lot of highly skilled combat vet career soldiers. I agree with Manchu that a lot of great officers started enlisted, but I don't think that's reason enough to limit your possibilities in the current Army climate.

Seconding everyone elses opinions of recruiters. They have quotas, they need bodies, and they pillow talk. They will screw you if you don't make them work for you. If you don't like the first recruiter you talk to, tell them to F off and go to another station.

 

What will your degree be in?

There were two soldiers that I went through basic with that had four year degrees. They were both going enlisted because they did not want to make what they thought was a much bigger commitment by going to OCS before they even knew if they liked, or were even cut out for the military life style, it made sense to me. And actually one them was a washout late in our cycle. And it wasn't because he was a bad soldier, he was actually rather squared away, he just came to the conclusion that being an infantryman in the US Army was not for him and he went home.

[Manchu Warrior]

Thanks a ton for your input Manchu! I actually spoke to a guy yesterday who was enlisted a few years back and he said the same thing about officers who were enlisted first. I will definitely keep that tip about the contract in mind if I decide to go in!

You are welcome. And again good luck with what ever you may decide!

[willysmb44]

Manchu Warrior made a good point on prior service folks being officers. I generally agree with that, but you take folks one at a time. I served with a 2LT who'd been a Ranger and was now cast into a support branch. He never fit in and couldn't go from "hard charging grunt" to logistics leader. He didn't do well at all. On the flipside we had a kid who looked like he was 14 years old, straight out of ROTC. Not much to look at, but MAN was he squared away, you don't teach people that, he picked it up along the way. Great leader and never served a day in his life beforehand. I lost track of him but I hope he's at least a Major now.

Thank you very much for your reply! Just to make sure I understood correctly, the trend seems to be that Reservists are being deployed more frequently than active duty?

That's been my observation. Of the officers I kept in touch with, the reservists have gone to the sandbox many times more than the active ones.

Glad you mentioned the competitive nature of OCS. That's interesting!

Well, don't quote me on that. I went ROTC but served with plenty of OCS and academy types (only met one West Pointer I thought wasn't a brown-nosing ladder-climber), and the OCS grads lorded their experience over us "mere ROTC cadets" all the time. I had to often remind several of them that no matter how any of us got to the 'gold bar of obedience', we were all "mere LTs" at the end of the day.

[Manchu Warrior]

Manchu Warrior made a good point on prior service folks being officers. I generally agree with that, but you take folks one at a time. I served with a 2LT who'd been a Ranger and was now cast into a support branch. He never fit in and couldn't go from "hard charging grunt" to logistics leader. He didn't do well at all. On the flipside we had a kid who looked like he was 14 years old, straight out of ROTC. Not much to look at, but MAN was he squared away, you don't teach people that, he picked it up along the way. Great leader and never served a day in his life beforehand. I lost track of him but I hope he's at least a Major now.That's been my observation. Of the officers I kept in touch with, the reservists have gone to the sandbox many times more than the active ones. Well, don't quote me on that. I went ROTC but served with plenty of OCS and academy types (only met one West Pointer I thought wasn't a brown-nosing ladder-climber), and the OCS grads lorded their experience over us "mere ROTC cadets" all the time. I had to often remind several of them that no matter how any of us got to the 'gold bar of obedience', we were all "mere LTs" at the end of the day.

Just to make it clear. I in noway meant to imply that the only good officers I served with had been enlisted first. And I apologize if that is the way I made it sound. In fact the very best officer, without a shadow of doubt, that I served with in the US Army was a Captain Towers. He was an artillery officer that I was assigned to when I worked in the Battalion TOC. He had never been enlisted and was in fact a West Point grad. And I will say it again he was a great officer, and an even better human being. Captain Towers really took care of his people and I was beyond proud to have served in his chain of command.

[GoldenCross]

Again, thanks a million for your help guys. You sure have some good examples. It's difficult to put one label on an idea since there are so many ways that things can go.

 

I'm glad to hear these stories though, they will help me make a decision, that's for sure. It's going to be a tough one, but hopefully rewarding if I go through with it! I'm pretty excited to learn more.

[rr01]

Why limit yourself to the Army? Purely rhetorical but why not one of the other Reserve forces? Are there units nearby or does any of this have to do with paying student loans? Questions for you alone which don't need to be answered to me or anyone else.

As far as joining at all follow your own gut. I have served and continue to do so through Civil Air Patrol the entire spectrum of officers of which both extremes are most memorable. Don't dally but don't join unless you get to put on the bars. Once in get as much professional development as you can and be as involved with your unit as time permits. If you deploy, well you already know that is what the military does. As far as allaying your parents concerns not everyone who marches off to war gets killed. You WILL come back a different man but far better than the one who left home; and you will be much better prepared to serve your own community when you get back.

Good luck and be sure to sign up for Airborne the day after you put on your bars!!!!!

[teufelhunde.ret]

Why limit yourself to the Army? Purely rhetorical but why not one of the other Reserve forces? Are there units nearby or does any of this have to do with paying student loans? Questions for you alone which don't need to be answered to me or anyone else.

 

I do agree and was about to ask why??? :think: All the Armed Forces offer differing program in the Reserves, you owe it yourself to find out!

 

I believe you have two Reserve units in Chicago?

 

Re the Marine Reserve, forum moderator "Jeremiah" is a member of the active Marine reserve, after an active duty tour. Drop him an email / PM to find out more.

[Rakkasan187]

If you want to go in the Reserves you may also want to think about this:

 

You say that you are 22 yrs old right now. OK...., If you join the Reserves, serve 20 years, that will make you 42 yrs old when you may possibly want to "retire". You won't be able to get a retirement paycheck for at least another 20 years, from the Reserves that is.

 

It is something to think about. I served on both active and reserve status, I did 10 yrs active, 12 yrs reserves. I got off active duty because of a great job opportunity for one, and two, I was tired, and quite honestly, my body was broken. Serving 10 years as an infantryman takes a toll on your body after a while. I wanted to continue my service in the military and opted to go reserve and still have my profession as a civilian, (Firefighter/Medic). Weekend drills I received a paycheck, as well as my two weeks of annual training, so they compensated when I was not with the fire department.

 

With the injuries suffered while on active duty, I was rated at 40% disability by VA.

 

I was mobilized the day after 9/11, and remained on active duty until July 2005. This of course helped me add retirement points for when I received my "20 year letter", but again I cannot touch my retirement until I am 60 yrs old. In my case another 14 years.

 

I was injured in the line of duty as a fireman and retired from the department with 11 years of service. My pension from the city will start in 6 years at age 52. I was lucky to be able to find another stable job with excellent benefits for myself and wife.

 

Every situation is going to be different, but I would also strongly encourage you to look at going full time in the military. A lot of the servicemembers that I instruct now are at 20 plus years in the military and for them they are opting to staying in 30 years. The current unemployment statistics across the US are what is driving some to stay in as long as they can. They are getting good pay and benefits for themselves and families, and they are also able to attend school and get degrees, but they also have to look at competing with younger college kids for the few jobs that are available, and so for most with 28 yrs in, they are deciding to stay.

 

You also have to think that at 22 yrs old, you can't have your parents decide what is best for your future. I understand overprotecting parents, but you have to think of it this way: If your folks discourage you from doing something you would like to try, and you never do it because of what they tell you, you may possibly regret it in the long run, and consequently you may blame your parents and be angry towards them.

 

My folks were the same way, but I convinced them that the decision was mine to make, and if I had regrets, it would be on me, and me alone. To this day, they agree that they were glad they did not interfere with my decision to enlist.

 

Do what you want to do, but look at all the options. If I could do it all over again, I would ahve stayed my 30 years on Active duty. I have no regrets about the path that I took.

 

Good luck in whatever choice you make.

 

 

Leigh..

[capa]

Times are WAAAY different now, but when I enlisted in the Marine Corps Reserves in the 1980s I was wanting to be an enlisted man while going to college with the goal of OCS after-to be a better officer. Well I did my 4 years and got out after discovering photography as a career. To this day, I wish that I had simply done 4 years active in the Fleet then gone to college. That aside, I do not believe that being an enlisted man first in and of itself makes you a better officer. I would not advise doing it for that.

I could be way off, but I sense that perhaps you are just not sure and think that the Reserves is a way to dip you toe in the water? No judgement if that be the case but it's better to be honest with yourself especially considering what the other forum members like Lee have pointed out.

I would be curious what are the commissioning rates for Reservists? Your answer might be in there somewhere...

Good luck!

[m1ashooter]

The force structure is going to take a huge hit in the near furture and slots in the guard and reserves will be in high demand as those on active duty are forced out and look to join reserve and guard billets.

 

This is going to a repeat of the early 90's as units are deactivated and a lot of really good people are put on the beach.

 

So if you are interested get in while you can.

 

You might want to check out the USCG. I have a reservist friend in The CG, got out of the Army as a Capt years ago, later became a Warrent Officer in the CG reserves. They have a lot of really neat jobs that you can parley into civilian jobs.

[GoldenCross]

Why limit yourself to the Army? Purely rhetorical but why not one of the other Reserve forces? Are there units nearby or does any of this have to do with paying student loans? Questions for you alone which don't need to be answered to me or anyone else.

As far as joining at all follow your own gut. I have served and continue to do so through Civil Air Patrol the entire spectrum of officers of which both extremes are most memorable. Don't dally but don't join unless you get to put on the bars. Once in get as much professional development as you can and be as involved with your unit as time permits. If you deploy, well you already know that is what the military does. As far as allaying your parents concerns not everyone who marches off to war gets killed. You WILL come back a different man but far better than the one who left home; and you will be much better prepared to serve your own community when you get back.

Good luck and be sure to sign up for Airborne the day after you put on your bars!!!!!

 

Excellent points! Yeah, I don't know why, but it is a gut thing for me when it comes to picking the Army. I have been looking at other branches too. If I do go in, I'd definitely look forward to the change that I would go through. That's got to be one of the most rewarding things, having that sense of perspective on life that most people do not have.

 

Were you in the Airborne?? Any particular advantages for suggesting I sign up?

[GoldenCross]

I do agree and was about to ask why??? :think: All the Armed Forces offer differing program in the Reserves, you owe it yourself to find out!

 

I believe you have two Reserve units in Chicago?

 

Re the Marine Reserve, forum moderator "Jeremiah" is a member of the active Marine reserve, after an active duty tour. Drop him an email / PM to find out more.

 

 

Actually I am unfamiliar with the units around Chicago :pinch: Haven't gotten that far yet..

 

Thanks for the suggestion! I'll look into contacting him!

[GoldenCross]

If you want to go in the Reserves you may also want to think about this:

 

You say that you are 22 yrs old right now. OK...., If you join the Reserves, serve 20 years, that will make you 42 yrs old when you may possibly want to "retire". You won't be able to get a retirement paycheck for at least another 20 years, from the Reserves that is.

 

It is something to think about. I served on both active and reserve status, I did 10 yrs active, 12 yrs reserves. I got off active duty because of a great job opportunity for one, and two, I was tired, and quite honestly, my body was broken. Serving 10 years as an infantryman takes a toll on your body after a while. I wanted to continue my service in the military and opted to go reserve and still have my profession as a civilian, (Firefighter/Medic). Weekend drills I received a paycheck, as well as my two weeks of annual training, so they compensated when I was not with the fire department.

 

With the injuries suffered while on active duty, I was rated at 40% disability by VA.

 

I was mobilized the day after 9/11, and remained on active duty until July 2005. This of course helped me add retirement points for when I received my "20 year letter", but again I cannot touch my retirement until I am 60 yrs old. In my case another 14 years.

 

I was injured in the line of duty as a fireman and retired from the department with 11 years of service. My pension from the city will start in 6 years at age 52. I was lucky to be able to find another stable job with excellent benefits for myself and wife.

 

Every situation is going to be different, but I would also strongly encourage you to look at going full time in the military. A lot of the servicemembers that I instruct now are at 20 plus years in the military and for them they are opting to staying in 30 years. The current unemployment statistics across the US are what is driving some to stay in as long as they can. They are getting good pay and benefits for themselves and families, and they are also able to attend school and get degrees, but they also have to look at competing with younger college kids for the few jobs that are available, and so for most with 28 yrs in, they are deciding to stay.

 

You also have to think that at 22 yrs old, you can't have your parents decide what is best for your future. I understand overprotecting parents, but you have to think of it this way: If your folks discourage you from doing something you would like to try, and you never do it because of what they tell you, you may possibly regret it in the long run, and consequently you may blame your parents and be angry towards them.

 

My folks were the same way, but I convinced them that the decision was mine to make, and if I had regrets, it would be on me, and me alone. To this day, they agree that they were glad they did not interfere with my decision to enlist.

 

Do what you want to do, but look at all the options. If I could do it all over again, I would ahve stayed my 30 years on Active duty. I have no regrets about the path that I took.

 

Good luck in whatever choice you make.

Leigh..

 

 

Leigh,

 

I greatly appreciate your lengthy response! I'm really glad I could hear your story. This will give me something to consider when laying all of the facts out on the table later on.

 

You're right, I think at this point, my decisions as an adult will reign priority over my parents. It will be a hurdle nonetheless. (A pretty big one at that hahaha) But frankly, it's time.

 

I think I will need to think about Active Duty more too. Perhaps it would be a more reasonable option.

 

Thanks!!

[Rakkasan187]

If you do decide to go on Active duty, think of it as job security. The Army is downsizing and they only want the best, so if you consider active duty, you must strive to be the best in all you do. Joining the military is like baking a cake or building a model. If you follow the directions, everything will come out fine.

 

At least thats how I viewed my 22 yr career and I retired as a Senior NCO.

 

Leigh..

[GoldenCross]

I could be way off, but I sense that perhaps you are just not sure and think that the Reserves is a way to dip you toe in the water? No judgement if that be the case but it's better to be honest with yourself especially considering what the other forum members like Lee have pointed out.

 

 

You hit the nail on the head if you ask me! That's going to be the decision maker, no doubt. I shouldn't sugar coat things for myself. For this reason, I'm glad I have you guys to consult. Thank you for your advice!

[GoldenCross]

The force structure is going to take a huge hit in the near furture and slots in the guard and reserves will be in high demand as those on active duty are forced out and look to join reserve and guard billets.

 

This is going to a repeat of the early 90's as units are deactivated and a lot of really good people are put on the beach.

 

So if you are interested get in while you can.

 

You might want to check out the USCG. I have a reservist friend in The CG, got out of the Army as a Capt years ago, later became a Warrent Officer in the CG reserves. They have a lot of really neat jobs that you can parley into civilian jobs.

 

 

That's a good point, it makes sense!

 

Good to know! I'll study up on the CG, for sure!

 

Thank you for your help!

[GoldenCross]

Joining the military is like baking a cake or building a model. If you follow the directions, everything will come out fine.

 

Sounds easy enough

 

This may be a couple of ridiculously simple questions, but when does one consider themselves retired? As soon as their contract ends? I just don't know if there is any "fine print" things to consider.

 

And the amount of years depends on your job/needs of the army, correct?

[Rakkasan187]

There are different situations when you retire.

 

When you receive a "20 yr letter" in the reserves, that means that you are eliglible to retire at the 20 yr mark, and that you have obtained the required "points" so to speak but you will not receive benefits until 60. You can still remain in the Reserves an build more points towards your final retirement, or you can stay in longer and keep accruing points that will help determine your final retirement stipend. You have to accrue so many "points" in a year in order for that ytear to count towards retirement. If you miss a few weekend drills and you do not make them up, then that time will not be credited. Good years in the reserves you must earn so many points. I would have to get out my papers to see what the requirements are, but that is the general idea.

 

On active duty, anything over 20 years active service is consider "retired". If you submit your papers they will compute your leave time, and transitional time. When a final date is reached and you recieve your DD214 and discharge certificate then you are almost done. There was a recent incentive program that was being offered to Soldiers who wanted to retire at 15 years of service. I am not sure what the stipulations were, but as the Army starts to draw down and get rid of excess and Soldiers who are not cutting the grade, the Army will look at incentives to encourtage those who desire to get out before 20 years. I am not sure if the individual will get full benefits or not. I have not spoken to anyone who has looked into this option.

 

I work at the United States Army Sergeants Major Academy, and the majority of the Senior NCO's that are here are well over 20 years, and the majority will remain on Active duty for at least 30 years and some even more. The current unemployment stats as I mentioned are the incentive for most of these folks to stay in. Also they worry about competeing with younger kids such as yourself for the jobs out in the civilian world. Some employers hire Soldiers because of experience, education, ect, while others hire young guns because they are energetic, and they have potential of staying with a corporation for many years. There are some 30 year vets who are just looking to enhance their retirement benefits with a part time job.

 

Again, each situation is going to be different. One thing that I have discovered is that you have to have a plan, and a back up plan. Things happen, and you may have to fall back on alternate options. I was lucky to have several alternate options when I was injured in the Fire department. I was fortunate enough to still have the knowledge and experience that was being saught after at the Sergeants Major Academy.

 

The first real sign of being retired from Active duty is your first retirement check on the first of every month. The VA also pays disability benefits on the first of each month.

 

Leigh