Tried to put these in the reference section. Here are some visors from my collection.

 

Mario

more

and more

enlisted

Aargh! some exceedingly nice hats here! And some very rare ones as well!

 

CB

Hi Gentlemen,

I recently acquired this visor and need help with the time line ID. The seller claimed that it was Span Am but, I don't believe this to be true. It looks very much like WWI but, the visor is not quite right. Any opinions are welcome and I thank everone for there input.

OOOps, here is the front!! Sorry

Looks like a squarshed down bell crown with the wrong insignia to me. I would say post Span-Am but pre WWI.

Looks like a squarshed down bell crown with the wrong insignia to me. I would say post Span-Am but pre WWI.

 

Wellll, what you have here is the ca 1903-1911 (or so) officer's drab wool visor cap. It is missing the chinstrap and side buttons, and the eagle appears to be a bit oversized -- probably more WW1 era. It is not crushed -- these caps lacked the stiffener common later on. I have attached a pic of mine to compare. ( I think mine has a replaced chinstrap, but I am not sure.)

Similar caps were made in the various colors to match the other uniforms of the era. Here's the wool one above, again, along with an OD cotton one adopted about 1909 -- note that it doesn't have the ribbed mohair band. (There may also have been an ealier khaki version, but I have never seen one. There was an EM model, for sure.)

 

Behind is the version worn with the whites. This one has a detachable top for washing. I think this one is really early. The front lacks the grommet for a screwback eagle. In 1903-4, NO eagle was authorized! I assume the owner added the eagle when regs changed. (I do have a wireback gilt eagle which I believe is of the same era.)

And, finally, here are the ealier blue visors. Left front is a company-grade Infantry officers "bell crown" full dress cap. Right front is the dress cap worn by all officers except generals. The band is black mohair. Behind is the dress cap of a general officer -- the band is black velvet. The eagles on all are bullion, as are the chinstraps.

 

Missing are the full dress field grade and general officers caps. These would have had bullion oak leaves and acorns on the visor. The general's would also have oak leaves and acorns on the black velvet band.

 

The dress cap was worn with the dress blue uniform -- blue, with black mohair trim, concealed buttons and branch colored shoulder straps -- until 1912. After 1912 this uniform was worn with the full dress cap. The full dress coat was double breasted with shoulder knots (fringed epaulets for generals) and branch colored collars and cuff bands. The general's cuff bands and collar were black velvet with bullion oak leaves and acorns. Rank was shown on the sleeves. Bullion loops for all but 2LTs and generals. The latter wore stars. (At times, rank was also shown on the shoulder knots.)

Martin encouraged me to post some more of the Pre-WW1 era through WW1 or so. Here they are.

 

First come three officer's visors from the 1912 and later era. Note the new brown visors and chinstraps. The buttons are rimmed 1911 eagle type.

 

To the left and top rear are wool verions. The right hand one is cotton. These are far less common than the wool.

(It is attributed to an Army doctor who served at a camp in the deep south -- Alabama, I think.)

By 1912, the dress blue cap was dropped in favor of the full dress blue visor.

 

The company-grade Infantry cap is, in fact, a conversion from the earlier small bell crown style. Close examination reveals that the portion of the top where the bullion eagle is located has been cut away from the old top and a new, larger top has been substituted.

 

The other cap is a field grade version with bullion oak leaves and acorns embroidered into the leather visor. (Later visors used velvet instead of leather.) The bullion in this case is heavily tarnished, presumably from the leather. The black band indicates one of the staff branches.

And, finally, here are a couple of more, though one is not a visor.

 

Above is a chapeau de bras or fore and aft hat, as the Navy would have called it. These were worn by officers of THE Army Staff and by general officers with the full dress uniform. This one may date earlier since the button is the rimless 1902 style.

 

Below is BG (later MG) Charles Justin Bailey's dress/full dress blue visor. Note the oak leaves and acorns on both the visor and the velvet band. Bailey was promoted to BG in 1913 and later commanded the 81st Division overseas in the AEF. He is credited with being responsible for the 81st being the first to wear SSIs in WW1 -- the Wildcat!

 

Bailey's cap has undergone extensive restoration. The band had been cut off on either side of the eagle and lost. I had a new band made in Pakistan using a pattern xeroxed from the cuffs of Bailey's full dress coat some 20+ years ago and I hand sewed it in place. It sure looks better since the restoration.

Gi, those are some mighty nice hats you have posted here. These hats are remarkably difficult to find, especially in nice condition. I like the tropical white myself! Once saw a Philippine made example years ago and wasnt able to snag it. May never see another.

 

CB

I'm glad someone enjoyed the posting. I was beginning to think it was too esoteric for the Forum.

 

G

Aargh! some exceedingly nice hats here! And some very rare ones as well!

 

CB

Thanks. I am working on finding some early Wool and cotton enlisted stiff crown and floppy crown visors now.

 

Very Nice!

 

G

Can you add some info, i.e. dates and branches - then we'll move the into reference.

I'm glad someone enjoyed the posting. I was beginning to think it was too esoteric for the Forum.

 

G

I must have missed these earlier, Gil. They're great. I have a couple, none nearly as early or as nice as yours but I'll post a couple pictures of them. The one in the pictures below is late WW-I. It was worn by Capt Holderman at the end of the war and during a short post-war publicity tour. Externally, it's in pretty nice shape. There are a couple tiny moth nips and some scuffing of the edge bead of the visor but that's about it. On the inside, the sweatband is pretty well secured but there is some fraying of the cloth backing of the woolen cover. The pic on the bottom is a fairly well known photo of Holderman wearing, I believe, this hat.

 

Here are a couple others from my meager service hat collection. The one on the left is a late 1920s service hat that belonged to the commander of an Ambulance company is WW-I. After the war, he served in the 26th "Yankee Div" throughout the 20s and early 30s. The one on the right is from the uniform of late 20s-early 30s pilot.

 

Very nice -- thanx for the addition to the thread.

 

G

-First picture left to right. (left) 1902 pattern Infantry field grade officers full dress cap "bell crown".(middle) 1912 pattern Infantry company grade officer full dress cap "flare crown". (right) 1902 pattern Infantry company grade officer full dress cap "bell crown".

 

-Second picture left to right. (left) 1895 pattern officers forage cap. (right) 1902 officers dress cap "bell crown".

 

-Third picture left to right. (left) 1905 pattern officers wool service cap "bell crown". (middle) 1912 pattern officers wool service cap "flare crown". (right) 1907 pattern officers wool service cap "floppy crown".

 

-Fourth picture left to right. (left) 1895 pattern enlisted forage cap. (middle) 1912 pattern Cavalry enlisted full dress cap "flare crown". (right) 1902 pattern Artillery enlisted full dress cap "bell crown".

Thanx. Certainly that'll help those who are not familiar with these caps. You have some real beauties there!

 

G

HELLO ALLS

ANYBODY WHO POST PRE WW1 OR WW1 US NAVY HATS PICTURES

I HAVE ONE BUT I CAN NOT DO THE PICS SMALLER TO POSTED ON THIS FORUM,IF SOMEBODY WOULD LIKE HELP ME SEEING MY PICS I SEND MY MAIL ADDRESS:elcalifa1969@yahoo.es

THE ONLY PIC I CAN POST IS FROM EBAY AUCTION I WIN,THANKS AND I HOPE RESPONSES

FERNANDO(SPAIN)

Amazing hats Guys!!! I have one I was wondering if I can post here for some info on it. I think it may be a transitional......posting a few pics in a bit.