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WAR MOVIE BLUNDERS


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In the film "Saving Private Ryan" one of the American soldiers tell his buddies after the D-Day beach is secured that he has found a Hitler Youth knife. Although I'm sure some of these German political organization knives would have been carried into combat by individual German soldiers, I am rather certain the American soldiers would not have recognized them as being carried by members of the Hitler Youth back in Germany. The American G.I.'s would have more than likely just seen them as German combat knives.

 

I always found this detail unsettling.

Pre war Germany had been covered on numerous occasions in Life Magazine. If you could read you could learn.

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How about the Blue Max? In the opening scene we see George Peppard hauling tail across no man's land and jumping into a shell crater. Have you ever thought to tak e alook at his rifle? SMLE... :hapy0004:

:twothumbup:

 

Wayne

 

Yes for a movie that gave a great effort in building WW 1 aircraft that looked not perfect but very good. Using Enfields as Mauser mock ups by removing magazine and front sight ears was very carless. I assume they used the 1965 era Irish Army as extras. But you could have thought the MGM prop master could have come up with a few Mausers of some make

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In "Platoon" Sergeant Barnes and Sergeant Elias's M16A1s were suppose to represent XM177E2's. Not the long barrel shorties. We didn't use them in Vietnam.

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strayduck230

Maybe this was mentioned, but I didn't see it when I was looking through here. But one huge one that caught my eye was in The Pacific. In the early episodes on Guadalcanal, ALL the marines are carrying 1903A3s. Those were not issued that early, AND never issued in that large of numbers. Thats why we can find so many "mint" ones today. Should have been 1903s.

 

Also when they are are on board leaving Australia, You can see numerous numbers of the "mosquito" or "sniper veil" helmet covers. Again, a VERY late war item, and not seen in combat in large numbers.

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Well, as it's June 6....."The Longest Day" was a star-laden, multi-million dollar production in its day, made less than 20 years after the war when surplus gear must've been cheap and plentiful. But, despite this, John Wayne's paratroopers wear a mish-mash of re-tailored M51 field jackets. The shadows where the pockets have been removed and re-sewn at an angle in attempt to look like M42 jump-jackets are so obvious, as are the shadows where name-tapes once were. Just as well it was a black and white movie! Then there are those bizarre rubber chincups on the jump helmets!! Still a good movie though!

 

Sabrejet :thumbsup:

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Rakkasan187

I recently watched "The Devils Brigade" starring William Holden and Cliff Robertson. In the bar fight scene with the lumberjacks, I noticed one of the American Soldiers wearing an Ike jacket with the Anti Aircraft Missile Command patch on the shoulder. This insignia did not come out until after World War Two.

 

There were other mistakes but that one caught my eye...

 

Leigh..

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canadian bacon
Someone earlier in this post mentioned the Sci-Fi Channel's "SS Doom Troopers". All I can say is I will never get those 2 hours of my life back. Horrible acting, US Sniper using a kar98, 80's era helmets, post war jeeps, unidentifiable web gear (clearly not WWII), just plain AWEFUL!

really i thought it was apart from all the flaws in the equipment it was an ok movie for being a sci-fi channel production :laughing1:

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Third Herd

I watched part of Bury My Heart at Wounded Knee today, an officer in 1876 wearing a Civil War Medal and an Indian Wars Medal with the second style ribbon (1917).

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These are not really "blunders" but some subtle mistakes I've notcied in Saving Private Ryan... Not in any type of order but here we go.

 

First, the helmets. Hard to ingnor the swivel bales on ALL the helmets, and the black hardware chinstraps on the liners. But harder to ignor is the close up on the man praying on the beach in the landing scene. With clamp on Vietnam war chinstraps.

 

During the battle at Ramelle Private Ryan yells out that he is out of ammo, meanwhile all his ammo pouches are still "Stuffed" and are full.

 

DeForest death... DeForest is a injured medic that medic Wade is working on - on the beach buring the opening scene, he is shot in the head through the helmet just after Wade yells out "Ive stoped the bleeding." a few seconds later you see DeForest and the bullet hole is in a different spot on the helmet.

 

Lieutenant DeWindt. DeWindt says that his glider lost 22 men in its crash landing. His glider was already carrying a jeep, The WACO CG-4A glider would normally carry 13 men.

 

Horvath says that he served with Miller at Kasserine Pass (North Africa, February 1943) and at Anzio (Italy, January 1944). As far as I am aware the 2ed Rangers were not in either of those battles?

 

Also Horvath is seen putting sand in a tin can on top of the bluffs of the beach, the can is Marked "France" in what looks like magic marker. Which was not available at that time.

 

The scene where Miller is yelling out the paratroopers "Anybody know a Ryan, Private James Ryan" A soilder that knows Ryan says that he is from C company. While the hole movie he is said to be in B Baker company.

 

Lyle, Lyle is one of the paratoopers part of the small group with Ryan at the end battle at Ramelle. Lyle is seen being killed twice during the battle, the first time while on the first Tiger Tank. His head is seen being blown off by the flak gun that kills a number of the paratroopers on the tank. Lyle is later seen crawling away and is shot in the upper body by a German soldier.

 

Private Toynbe, Private Toynbe is one of the paratroopers part of the small group with Ryan at the end of the battle at Ramelle. Private Toynbe is also seen being killed twice. Like Lyle he climbs on the first Tiger tank, and is scene being shot through the torso by the Flak Gun that also kills Lyle and a number of other papatroopers, Private Toynbe is killed again when he attempted to retreat to a pre-planned fallback position known as "The Alamo."

 

Corporal Henderson, Corporal Henderson is in Easy Co with the 501st. But is helmet has a painted spade for the 506th.

 

Private Ryan is telling Miller a story about his brothers. At the end of the story Ryan says that, that night (Night in the story) was the last time he saw his brother Danny. But in the beginning of the movie we were told that all 4 brothers were in the same unit, (29th infrantry) there's also a photo in the Ryan's house with 4 soilders is GI gear together. Which I would assume is them, and taking some time after they all inlisted.

 

3 days after D-Day Miller is told about the mission. Sean Ryan is killed on Omaha as a member of the 29th infranty. So in 3 days the war department figured out the faith of the 3 brothers, connects the dots, tells the mother, finds out James is not yet reported dead, and sends a rescue mission to find James. In 3 days.. seems kind of fast and unrealistic.

 

That's all for now. I'm sure I am forgetting some stuff I wanted to mention.

 

I watched the movie for the first time in years the other night.

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These are not really "blunders" but some subtle mistakes I've notcied in Saving Private Ryan... Not in any type of order but here we go.

 

First, the helmets. Hard to ingnor the swivel bales on ALL the helmets, and the black hardware chinstraps on the liners. But harder to ignor is the close up on the man praying on the beach in the landing scene. With clamp on Vietnam war chinstraps.

 

During the battle at Ramelle Private Ryan yells out that he is out of ammo, meanwhile all his ammo pouches are still "Stuffed" and are full.

 

DeForest death... DeForest is a injured medic that medic Wade is working on - on the beach buring the opening scene, he is shot in the head through the helmet just after Wade yells out "Ive stoped the bleeding." a few seconds later you see DeForest and the bullet hole is in a different spot on the helmet.

 

Lieutenant DeWindt. DeWindt says that his glider lost 22 men in its crash landing. His glider was already carrying a jeep, The WACO CG-4A glider would normally carry 13 men.

 

Horvath says that he served with Miller at Kasserine Pass (North Africa, February 1943) and at Anzio (Italy, January 1944). As far as I am aware the 2ed Rangers were not in either of those battles?

 

Also Horvath is seen putting sand in a tin can on top of the bluffs of the beach, the can is Marked "France" in what looks like magic marker. Which was not available at that time.

 

The scene where Miller is yelling out the paratroopers "Anybody know a Ryan, Private James Ryan" A soilder that knows Ryan says that he is from C company. While the hole movie he is said to be in B Baker company.

 

Lyle, Lyle is one of the paratoopers part of the small group with Ryan at the end battle at Ramelle. Lyle is seen being killed twice during the battle, the first time while on the first Tiger Tank. His head is seen being blown off by the flak gun that kills a number of the paratroopers on the tank. Lyle is later seen crawling away and is shot in the upper body by a German soldier.

 

Private Toynbe, Private Toynbe is one of the paratroopers part of the small group with Ryan at the end of the battle at Ramelle. Private Toynbe is also seen being killed twice. Like Lyle he climbs on the first Tiger tank, and is scene being shot through the torso by the Flak Gun that also kills Lyle and a number of other papatroopers, Private Toynbe is killed again when he attempted to retreat to a pre-planned fallback position known as "The Alamo."

 

Corporal Henderson, Corporal Henderson is in Easy Co with the 501st. But is helmet has a painted spade for the 506th.

 

Private Ryan is telling Miller a story about his brothers. At the end of the story Ryan says that, that night (Night in the story) was the last time he saw his brother Danny. But in the beginning of the movie we were told that all 4 brothers were in the same unit, (29th infrantry) there's also a photo in the Ryan's house with 4 soilders is GI gear together. Which I would assume is them, and taking some time after they all inlisted.

 

3 days after D-Day Miller is told about the mission. Sean Ryan is killed on Omaha as a member of the 29th infranty. So in 3 days the war department figured out the faith of the 3 brothers, connects the dots, tells the mother, finds out James is not yet reported dead, and sends a rescue mission to find James. In 3 days.. seems kind of fast and unrealistic.

 

That's all for now. I'm sure I am forgetting some stuff I wanted to mention.

 

I watched the movie for the first time in years the other night.

 

Justin check out one of my quote's in the poigniant scene topic i made it on may 15. it deal's in a large degree with SPR. if you like it let me know and i will leave more quote's here in movie blunder's in regard to saving private ryan, ill also elaborate on some of the thing you astutely have pointed out . lets lay it out. many of the thing's i will put down may or may not been said i think. Here just one. german.....2nd SS panzer division das reich is the german unit the boys go up against at the climax of the movie,RIGHT? problem.... the movie takes place what a week week and a1/2 of the the landing's,RIGHT the problem is that the das reich division did not enter the normandy region till some time towards the end of june. In early june they where still in southern france, and moved out the new front towads the middle of june, being attacked most of the way by the french underground, which precipatated a very well known atrosity. When the beloved comander of recconisance battalion was kidnapped and was killed by french marquie. On june 10 when the divsion was trying to make head way, the unit went crazy and killed the inhabatent's of the town of oradour sur glane and raised the the town to the ground, turned out to be the wrong town. to this day it isn't rebuit, it certainly was'nt when it was shown in an episode of the 1971 seriecs The World At War. So there you have it, some of the dummies who they hired where... just into symbolic flashiness,there probibly where one or two guy's who knew there stuff in regard to the german end and in all fairness both the GI's and german's where for the most part excelent in appearance, but the one who really knew there stuff where pobibily poo-pooed all the time. I can see it now when the military historian goes, no Mister Spielberg not the 2nd SS panzer division, but it would be the 17th SS panzer grenadier division that was at the front in early june, and Spielberg goes what? what s the name of that SS unit , and the history guy goes GOETZ VON BELICHINGEN, and spielberg goes whats that? And our man goes the name of the 17th panzer grenadier division , it was named after a german renasance period knight, he was well know in german folk lore ! , and speilberg goes NO... NO...nobody'll know any thing about that ! I like the 2nd SS division better, because there name was DAS REICH, and the people will reconize that, not gotz von belcen or what ever you said, they say UH... look how bad the germans are they even name there units after the third reich. And then the history guy goes YES MR SPIELBERG

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sgtdorango

Patches, im sure you are right about all the SS info, but the timeline might be off....Ive read the SPR book when it came out and after the landings Tom Hanks and the boys had a few more missions/adventures before going to find Ryan, this wasnt even mentioned in the movie at all for editing purposes or not enough time etc...so it might be possible it was late June or maybe even early July...im not sticking up for Speilburg, i know there are lots of hollywood things going on in the movie, although i love the movie for how good it is for a war movie and choose not to pick it apart just thought i would mention the missing scenes and lost time.....mike

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Patches, im sure you are right about all the SS info, but the timeline might be off....Ive read the SPR book when it came out and after the landings Tom Hanks and the boys had a few more missions/adventures before going to find Ryan, this wasnt even mentioned in the movie at all for editing purposes or not enough time etc...so it might be possible it was late June or maybe even early July...im not sticking up for Speilburg, i know there are lots of hollywood things going on in the movie, although i love the movie for how good it is for a war movie and choose not to pick it apart just thought i would mention the missing scenes and lost time.....mike

 

Mike, when Miller is told about the mission its D-Day plus 3, he is killed at the end. The headstone at the very end for Miller says he was killed June 13th.

 

I'm not picking apart the movie in any way. The other night I watched it for the first time in years and now kinda want to start collecting WWII again. Hehe. Just love the look of a Normandy paratrooper!

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Mike, when Miller is told about the mission its D-Day plus 3, he is killed at the end. The headstone at the very end for Miller says he was killed June 13th.

 

I'm not picking apart the movie in any way. The other night I watched it for the first time in years and now kinda want to start collecting WWII again. Hehe. Just love the look of a Normandy paratrooper![/quote

 

Ich bin voellig richtig,wie ich mein deutsche militaerische geschichte wissen.How about this one. remember the part when the guys get into the 101's area and the see a destroyed glider and a sreaming eagle takes the inside. What was inside? it was the corpse of Brigadier general pratt. We all know that pratt was killed on the morning of d-day, in the movie he was givin a differant name, amond or something. the body looked damn good for one who has been dead for 3 or 4 days. Spielberg and company would have us believe that the body of a u.s. soldier would be left where it was for day's unattended to. this we all know is utter nonsense, as our boy's when discovered on the field where imidiatetlly taken away for proper identifcation and burial. Sure! the guys in the 101 just left the body of there assitant divisonal commander in a wrecked glider, slumped in the seat of a jeep. also what about the stench, it being summertime in france and all,Ryan and company did,nt seem to smell the corpse which you know would have been recking, they just standing around like nothing is amiss in the area there standing in. just another observation of more to come.

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sgtdorango

Aha!...i never thought to check the date of death on Millers headstone!...that pretty much blows my theory out of the water!.....mike :thumbsup:

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Well, as it's June 6....."The Longest Day" was a star-laden, multi-million dollar production in its day, made less than 20 years after the war when surplus gear must've been cheap and plentiful. But, despite this, John Wayne's paratroopers wear a mish-mash of re-tailored M51 field jackets. The shadows where the pockets have been removed and re-sewn at an angle in attempt to look like M42 jump-jackets are so obvious, as are the shadows where name-tapes once were. Just as well it was a black and white movie! Then there are those bizarre rubber chincups on the jump helmets!! Still a good movie though!

 

Sabrejet :thumbsup:

 

:lol: :lol: After not having watched it in a good number of years, I caught this on the boob toob the other day and those exact details jumped out at me.

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One of the things I've noticed is how in the modern war movies of WWII the troops are carrying their rifles muzzle down. This carry makes it easier to bring the the rifle up to the shoulder to fire it. Only one thing wrong this carry has only been around since the late seventies or eighties. In WWII newsreels and training films and movies they carried their rifles muzzle up and butt down.

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craig_pickrall

There are plenty of Willie and Joe cartoons that show the rifle muzzle down in the rain.

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There are plenty of Willie and Joe cartoons that show the rifle muzzle down in the rain.

 

Yes but they are marching with sling arms or are carrying them under there arms, their not carrying them muzzle down in a kind of inverted port arms in like the modern soldier does in combat.In WWI and before, through at least when i was in, in the early 80's, the soldier carried his rifle when moving torwards the enemy or moving in an area that the enemy could be incountered, in high port or port arms or with the rifle pointed to the front.this is what 45 acp was talking about.

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Watched Mel Gibson "we were soldiers" again actualy love the movie. yesterday i noticed the japs were useing a Yugo SKS instead of a norinko? Oh and to another thread on here they wore the brass belt buckles in the feild.

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Darktrooper

In Zulu at the Final skirmish at the redoubt, watch some of the rifles, they are bolt action rifles, and not the Lever action Martini Henry's.

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There's that scene in "Band of Brothers" where Winters has just landed in Normandy minus his rifle etc. He gathers some stragglers around him and needs to consult a map with a flashlight. In order to do so without alerting the enemy a raincoat is produced to shield the light. It's taken out of one of the other paratrooper's musette, which it evidently fills! A paratrooper, jumping into combat at night would have his musette stuffed with rations, ammo, dry socks etc., not just a single raincoat!

 

Similarly, in "Saving Private Ryan", after the beach landing scene, Sarge opens his musette which is seen to contain nothing but cans of sand from previous campaigns and then proceeds to add another! Yeah...right!

 

Sabrejet :pinch:

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I agree with both sides of this discussion. I too see many inacuracies in the props and costumes they are using. But like my Dad used to say about the westerns he used to love watching was that its Hollywood, and that is the only place you will find the "famous western 6,000 shooter" as they never needed to reload in a gunfight. You guys have great eyes for detail but its just Hollywood. I would imagine if they outfitted guys with 100% accuracy we could not afford to go to the movies. I saw a special on the making of Gone With the Wind and the scene where Atlanta is burning is a shot of the movie lot being cleered by fire. The director said film this we may be able to use it, The shot is the set of the gates in King Kong being burned. Ya gotta love the movies:)

Bob

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craig_pickrall
Yes but they are marching with sling arms or are carrying them under there arms, their not carrying them muzzle down in a kind of inverted port arms in like the modern soldier does in combat.In WWI and before, through at least when i was in, in the early 80's, the soldier carried his rifle when moving torwards the enemy or moving in an area that the enemy could be incountered, in high port or port arms or with the rifle pointed to the front.this is what 45 acp was talking about.

 

 

Have you ever tried to carry a M1 in inverted port arms? Just a tad awkard.

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Have you ever tried to carry a M1 in inverted port arms? Just a tad awkard.

 

Indeed, the M1 and the carbine would not be carried in this fashion. The movies that we had today make the mistake of having some the actors carrying the weapons as contemperary soldiers do with the butt in the pit of the arm with the muzzle pointed down, hence my catogoriseing of kind of like an inverted port arms. This pratice was started by the british in the 60s with there FN rifle,s.

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