Vietnam gear

[Mashsig]

BTW - thank you for sharing the photos of your Ammo case collection - very nice.

 

You have the one that I always wanted but could never find.

[ikar]

Here's the belt I would most commonly wear on my second S.E.A. tour.

 

 

The ammo packs were, I think, rubberized canvas. Sometimes I would leave them off when carrying a .38, but not always, just in case we had to be issued an M-16 also. He holster was fitted with a cord to counter the holster's fatal design flaw, its swivel. I saw too many guys get to a situation, reach for their weapon, and find out the holster fell somewhere behind them. We also carried a bayonet of some form of knife, mostly for use against snakes, standard .38 ammo pouch (or just put the extra ammo in your pocket, not advisable), a portable radio and some form of first aid pouch.

[cavscout6b]

Focusing on the original question; the ammo pouches, butt-pack, and field dressing on the M56 gear have a specific location. Everything else is fair game.

-The ammo pouches & butt-pack are used as attachments to the suspenders/belt, so they REALLY need to be in the "textbook" location to work correctly. The field dressing should always be in the same position, to easily locate it for administering first-aid to a wounded comrade. (Remember: the field dressing is for YOU. If you help a buddy, you use THEIR dressing, not your own. Vital time would be wasted having to look for a field dressing in another location.)

-There maybe some units that specified positions of gear, but that usually doesn't last long in the field. Even the Army realizes that a soldier with a 32" waist cannot put the same amount of gear on a belt that someone with a 38" spead can.

[Mashsig]

hotlead - I sincerely apologize to you!

 

I realized this afternoon what my error (typo) was. Instead of your user name - "hotlead" - I incorrectly typed "hothead".

 

I normally cut and paste the user name when I respond to a post to avoid this type of problem.

 

It was not my intention to alter your user name.

 

I then compounded my 1st error by cutting and pasting the user name that I incorrectly typed in my first response to you into my 2nd response.

[Mashsig]

Here's the belt I would most commonly wear on my second S.E.A. tour.

 

 

The ammo packs were, I think, rubberized canvas. Sometimes I would leave them off when carrying a .38, but not always, just in case we had to be issued an M-16 also. He holster was fitted with a cord to counter the holster's fatal design flaw, its swivel. I saw too many guys get to a situation, reach for their weapon, and find out the holster fell somewhere behind them. We also carried a bayonet of some form of knife, mostly for use against snakes, standard .38 ammo pouch (or just put the extra ammo in your pocket, not advisable), a portable radio and some form of first aid pouch.

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Ikar - I take it from your post that you were in the Air Force? (The holster and ammo pouch were standard Air Force issue for "red caps" in Vietnam.)

 

The double 20 rd M-16 Ammo pouch shown on your belt appears to be the Air Force issued rubberized canvas 2 pocket ammo pouch.

 

Did you ever see or use the Air Force vest - which had 20 rd M-16 magazine pouches on the back of the vest near the bottom?

[Mashsig]

"... Even the Army realizes that a soldier with a 32" waist cannot put the same amount of gear on a belt that someone with a 38" spead can."

 

Roger that "cavscout6b" - there is a guy on the internet now who has posted his various belt, and vest layouts - he refers to the "spread" as "real estate".

[hotlead]

hotlead - I sincerely apologize to you!

 

I realized this afternoon what my error (typo) was. Instead of your user name - "hotlead" - I incorrectly typed "hothead".

 

I normally cut and paste the user name when I respond to a post to avoid this type of problem.

 

It was not my intention to alter your user name.

 

I then compounded my 1st error by cutting and pasting the user name that I incorrectly typed in my first response to you into my 2nd response.

It's cool, s**t happens. I'm over it.

 

Still waiting on that documentation......;-)

[Trooper B.A.R]

Hear are two early examples from my collection, both are set up by "Heavy Hints for Light Packs" booklet. Which if I am not mistaken dates late 50's early 60's. Often the shovel was not worn on the m56 gear, and carried on the rucksack, or not at all, same goes for the butt pack, and more canteens or m56 pouches were added.

Good examples in the pix. That's how remember, I set it up, but dropped the shovel and added another canteen. Under the first aid pouch, taped knife and sheat, right shoulder carried grenade. Most of the guys set themselves the same. I don't remember anyone that didn't carry 2 canteens on patrol.

As to any rules, etc. we were free to set up for comfort. I also can't remember anyone carry a bayonet. We all had knives taped to left front suspenders. Ammo, we carried as much as possible.

[sgtmonroe]

Still waiting on that documentation......;-)

 

Checked my copies of MIL-C-40159 (A=1962, B=1966, C=1970, D=1973, and D Notice 1=1977) for you. None of the Military Specifications indicate "what goes in the case" other than "ammunition." I can say that between 1962 and 1977 (when the case was cancelled) neither the specs nor the drawings indicate any change in overall size of the case.

[cavscout6b]

I also can't remember anyone carry a bayonet. We all had knives taped to left front suspenders. Ammo, we carried as much as possible.

I had an uncle that served during Vietnam. Although he wasn't infantry, his outfit did serve time in the field. He said pretty much the same thing: Guys on dismounted patrols usually carried some kind of knife. Few carried bayonets, and those were usually hung on the belt. Many carried knives purchased from the PX or catalogs. (He bought & used a fighting knife, while unmarked Ka-Bar's, Navy fighting knives, and similar styles seemed popular.) A few opted for a machete. Civilian skinning/hunting knives were rare. They cost more, weren't really practical, and prone to theft. He saw pilot survival knives being used, but not by anyone he personally knew.

[hotlead]

BTW - thank you for sharing the photos of your Ammo case collection - very nice.

 

You have the one that I always wanted but could never find.

Yessir.

 

If you mean the LINCLOE pouch, I've picked up two more since I took that pic. The one on the left is unissued, and the other has only some storage and handling wear. Neither has ever had the internal flaps snapped, and the unissued one has no evidence of the belt keepers being closed.

 

 

 

[ikar]

Mashig, I was in the Air Force. I did two tours in S.E.A. in Law Enforcement and when necessary drove armored vehicles with Air Base Defense. I was lucky enough to get these from someone heading home and used them more often than my issued ammo pack. Sometimes we had to use a couple borrowed CJ5 jeeps and it was easier getting in and out with the soft packs. This was also true when driving a M-113 or M-706.

 

A few of us were lucky enough to acquire aircrew survival vests which we loaded with extra day/night flares and things. There were all sorts of variations, sewn in holster, added ammo pouch in the front and so on. They were hard to come by. The one you describe, I never saw. It was probably used by the rescue squadron or det. and because of the limited number of personnel they had, were watched carefully.

 

 

[Sabrejet]

The amount of stuff a guy could carry on his belt was largely determined by his waist size. Someone with a small waist would need to adjust the belt accordingly. The shorter the belt, the less space for attaching / hanging items off of it. A larger waist = longer belt, therefore more space to attach stuff....know what I mean?

[cavscout6b]

Ikar -- I can't quite tell from the first photo; Is that a GI patrol cap, or one of the "bush" styles with the left brim snapped up? Seems to me that some of the AF Combat Security teams used the bush hats as "distictive" headgear.

 

BTW: What the hell happened to that guard shack? LOL

[ikar]

That's a bush hat. It was standard squadron wear for almost everybody except certain Base Defense assignments, K-9, and Phantom Patrol. At night almost nobody wore it except the guys at the gates. When the sun went down the preferred hat was a cammoflaged ball hat. Sometimes I used a starlight scope and then I would use the flop hat (boonie to some), to keep the glow of the scope's eye piece hidden as much as possible.

 

Here's a couple examples:

 

 

 

 

 

 

About the shack...sometimes there would be knife or bayonet throwing practice with patrols and the local marine also assigned to the gates out in the middle of nowhere. On cold nights, some wood might disappear for a fire. The flight chief might say something about it but considering you are standing under a large perimeter lamp, a fire wouldn't make much difference to someone watching you. Besides, you could always use the fire to cook some edible food you brought with you instead of the box nasties from the inflight kitchen.