2Dogs Posted July 9, 2010 Share #1 Posted July 9, 2010 I know there is a topic on the forum some where about this oval, but I can't find it. I would like to know when this was worn, or can someone post the link. Thank you for your help. 2 Dogs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SKIPH Posted July 9, 2010 Share #2 Posted July 9, 2010 2DOGS- Not exactly sure when they started or stopped using that background. But, I know for a fact that it was used from 1970-1990. I wore it in both 5th, and 7th SFGA. Still have mine. SKIP Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2Dogs Posted July 10, 2010 Author Share #3 Posted July 10, 2010 Were they embroided or on twill, the one I have is on twill. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SKIPH Posted July 10, 2010 Share #4 Posted July 10, 2010 2dogs-To be honest I have no clue. I'm not a patch collector. All I know was we wore them. If you could give show or explain, I can check mine out and pass it on. Sorry, I honestly don't know the difference. SKIP Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BILL THE PATCH Posted July 10, 2010 Share #5 Posted July 10, 2010 Were they embroided or on twill, the one I have is on twill. i've had a bunch over the years they were all emb on twill i far as i can remember. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SKIPH Posted July 10, 2010 Share #6 Posted July 10, 2010 So, guys, twill is that white -thread looking matting on the back of most modern US patches? If so, that is what my SF background is on. SKIP Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
irish Posted July 10, 2010 Share #7 Posted July 10, 2010 I beleive the oval was worn as far back as 1955 give or take. I have a photo of the uniform of the first U.S soldier killed in Vietnam as an S.F Advisor in approx 1956, it has this oval behind the wings. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SKIPH Posted July 10, 2010 Share #8 Posted July 10, 2010 It may take a little time, but let me check with my neighbors. One went thruogh the "Q" course in 63" the other in 53". Might be able to pin down a date . SKIP Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nkomo Posted July 11, 2010 Share #9 Posted July 11, 2010 Here is a picture of my Special Forces Ike jacket with jump oval. This would date from the 1953 to 1956 time period. http://www.usmilitariaforum.com/forums/ind...cial+forces+ike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J_Andrews Posted July 11, 2010 Share #10 Posted July 11, 2010 This oval, its color scheme matching the SF SSI, began with the 77th (later 7th) Group. In Europe, the 10th Gp apparently did not wear this, but rather soon adopted its own, green bordered maroon (later changed to scarlet). The 1st Gp did wear the teal and gold one. In the early 1980s it occurred to someone that the oval ought to match the colors of the FLASH of each Gp and Group-distinctive ovals began to appear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SKIPH Posted July 11, 2010 Share #11 Posted July 11, 2010 J Andrews- I left 5th SFGA in Jun 1980, and 7th SFGA in Dec 89. We were still wearing the same background. I beleive the change came a little later, but not sure when. SKIP Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
05B4S Posted August 24, 2010 Share #12 Posted August 24, 2010 So, guys, twill is that white -thread looking matting on the back of most modern US patches? If so, that is what my SF background is on. SKIP No, twill is cloth (in this case blue) that the yellow embroidery is done on, the white mesh is is a backing/reinforcement that is glued on to aid in the embroidery process. My original background issued to me in 1966, embroidered on extremely thin blue material, which I don't believe would be considered twill. Its is semi transparent. I doubt it could be successfully embroidered on without the white mesh backing. BTW, I have SF patches (arrowheads) issued to me in the mid 60's that are fully embroidered , some on tan twill and others on dark blue twill (cut edge) the only white that is visible on the back is what I believe is white thread that is used on the (bobbin?) backside of the embroidery. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hawk3370 Posted January 12, 2011 Share #13 Posted January 12, 2011 This oval, its color scheme matching the SF SSI, began with the 77th (later 7th) Group. In Europe, the 10th Gp apparently did not wear this, but rather soon adopted its own, green bordered maroon (later changed to scarlet). The 1st Gp did wear the teal and gold one. In the early 1980s it occurred to someone that the oval ought to match the colors of the FLASH of each Gp and Group-distinctive ovals began to appear. I was serving with the 10th SFG during the 1965-67 time frame in Germany. At that time we were wearing this oval behind our wings and the solid green flash on the beret. Don't know for sure when the green oval came in to being but when I returned to SF in 1978 they were wearing the colored oval that was the same as the group flash. Maj (Ret) Terry Morris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cszakolczai Posted January 12, 2011 Share #14 Posted January 12, 2011 I have ovals like this which are a mixture between twill and full embroider. I have a set of tans to a SF man VN era which had the full embroidered oval in this color scheme. Then I have an earlier twill backing one in the same color scheme which I've been told dates earlier. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
05B4S Posted January 12, 2011 Share #15 Posted January 12, 2011 In the early 1980s it occurred to someone that the oval ought to match the colors of the FLASH of each Gp and Group-distinctive ovals began to appear. "Note: At the time of this writing, the 3rd SFG recently adopted it's own matching oval wing background. A number of matching oval wing backgrounds began to appear (some of which are shown below) were manufactured solely for collectors. This was further exacerbated by the addition of "humps" to accommodate master parachutist wings. The 3d, 10th, 11th and 20th Special Forces Groups are the only special forces groups authorized wear of their respective matching wing backgrounds." Volume 1 (2nd edition) A Concise History of US Army Special Operations Forces with Lineage and Insignia by Geoffrey T Barker - Copyright 1988, 1993 Barker's illustrations below the note depict the unauthorized(in 1993) ovals for the 1st, 5th (black), 5th (RVN), and 6th SFGs. The 6th SFG only existed from May 1963 to March 1971. According to the TIOH, approval dates for the ovals are as follows: 1st - 24 FEB 99 3rd - 20 MAR 89 5th - 12 OCT 95 (RVN colors) 7th - 27 MAR 97 10th - 25 JAN 93 19th - 13 MAR 09 20th - 18 MAY 87 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Abn Inf Posted January 13, 2011 Share #16 Posted January 13, 2011 The Green/Maroon bordered oval was authorized for wear by the 10th SF in September 1952. It was worn until 1970 when it was replaced by the Green/Scarlet Border. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
05B4S Posted January 13, 2011 Share #17 Posted January 13, 2011 2dogs-To be honest I have no clue. I'm not a patch collector. All I know was we wore them. If you could give show or explain, I can check mine out and pass it on. Sorry, I honestly don't know the difference. SKIP Above Left: Embroidered (yellow) on blue cloth (IMO not twill). Issued to me in 1966. Above Right Full embroidered - cut edge. Year of issue unknown to me. Top row, left to right: Embroidered on blue cloth; Fully embroidered - cut edge Bottom: Fully embroidered - merrowed edge, (year unkown) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
USAAFPilotWingCollector Posted January 23, 2011 Share #18 Posted January 23, 2011 SWEET OVALS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
loudoun Posted January 23, 2011 Share #19 Posted January 23, 2011 This is the oval for the 77th SFG (now the 7th SFG). It was approved by TIOH on 16 June 1954. This was after the approval of the 10th SFG oval (19 Sept 1952) and before the approval of the SF SSI (22 August 1955) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
05B4S Posted January 23, 2011 Share #20 Posted January 23, 2011 This is the oval for the 77th SFG (now the 7th SFG). It was approved by TIOH on 16 June 1954. True, however it wasn't wasn't authorized exclusively to the 77th and (since 1961) it was worn by every SF Group for the majority of their existences except for the 10th which reverted back to wearing it's green w/maroon (later red) oval in 1969. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mitch Posted January 23, 2011 Share #21 Posted January 23, 2011 05B4S great ovals especially when they are your personal ones. To keep the descriptions as accurate as possible I have attached a picture of a jump oval removed from a uniform and it is on twill . This is the most common type of twill with the raised diagonal rib. This simple twill weave is what most patch collectors see as a background material when the describe a patch that is on twill. There are more complicated twills but they all have some sort of raised rib. When the ribs become woven opposed to each other in a V form it is herringbone. Regards, Mitch Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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