Can US troops use other countries uniforms?

[Darktide]

A couple of months back I walked into a shop on a Philippine military base to pick up some uniforms. While I was there, I saw a bunch of the same camo pattern uniforms as the ones I was taking delivery of but the name tapes had American names. I asked the people at the shop about this and they told me that these uniforms were made for US advisors (we have quite a bit of those).

 

The Tiger Stripe fabric used in the construction of these uniforms is specific to a particular Philippine unit. They are specially printed abroad, and no other unit uses these. I do not believe this TS pattern can be found anywhere else. The unit is the NAVSOG, Naval Special Operations Group, the Philippine version of the US Navy SEALS. In fact, some of the patches/ insignia used by the NAVSOG are identical to those used by the SEALS, including the eagle, trident, pistol.

 

My question is this, is this a standard practice? If assigned in a different country, can US troops wear the uniforms of that country?

 

The name tapes had American names. The branch tape was embroidered SPEC-OPS.

[kammo-man]

Standard practice my friend .

Thats why the tigerstripe thread is so large .

Tigerstripe is a Vietnamese cammo pattern that was copied from an older French pattern and is now being used by the USAF itself ,talk about a long serving pattern.

This all happened because US Special Forces used the pattern to blend in with the men they were advising thus introducing the scheme to the US.

Same today , my friend is serving in the Stan right now in 7th group, his unit deployed in ACU , but the units they were training were given woodland , this is now redundant in the states , but his boys changed over to woodland so as NOT to stand out and become a target.

And that is why in a nut shell US forces adopt an other nations scheme , become the grey man and blend in.

owen

[vintageproductions]

Here is a PI set that was worn by a US soldier

 

 

[kammo-man]

And that is a loose copy of the British windproof pattern also used by France in Indochina !!!!

[Andrei]

During WWI some Black troops wore french uniform. As far as I can remember it was two infantry regiments assigned to a french infantry division.

[Darktide]

Wow, the uniform posted by vintageproductions is really old, I remember that one. You don't see it anymore though, even in thrift shops.

 

This is the TS pattern used by the NAVSOG that had American names on them. The edge of the bolt of fabric used for these unforms has embroidery that states that is made exclusively for that specific unit.

[cwnorma]

During WWI some Black troops wore french uniform. As far as I can remember it was two infantry regiments assigned to a french infantry division.

 

Actually, the Black US soldiers assigned to the French Army during WW1 continued to wear US uniforms but used French weapons and equipment.

[gwb123]

I am not sure I would call it a "standard practice". This is something generally reserved for advisors and special operations personnel.

 

The reasons are simple:

 

1. So at a distance, the US troops blend in with the locals.

 

2. To establish rapport with the local troops.

 

It's interesting that you bring this up because we had a Special Forces vet on the Forum at one time who swore that in his years of experience he had never seen it done. Depending on where he served, that is entirely possible. It was less common in Europe, say in Germany, and more common for assignments in Asia and Latin America. I am not familiar with it being done in Africa, possibly to avoid confusion with mercenary forces or European advisors. I also don't believe it has been done in the Middle East as allied countries like Saudi Arabia tend to mirror our uniforms to begin with.

[flyer333555]

During WWI some Black troops wore french uniform. As far as I can remember it was two infantry regiments assigned to a french infantry division.

 

 

Not two but all four Black regiments of the 93rd Infantry Division (Colored) were assigned to French divisions.

 

The 369th Infantry, also known as the 15th New York National Guard regiment, also known as the "Harlem Hellfighters" received "French rifles, ate French rations, and at first used French helmets."

 

Source: Edward M. Coffman The War to End All Wars.

 

This regiment fought with the French 16th and 161st divisions. Same source.

 

The Wikipedia also states it had "US uniforms, and at first French helmets." It stands to reason they would later be using US helmets.

 

The War to End All Wars does not mention which French division the 370th Infantry also known as the 8th Illinois NG fought with but it does say it was fighting also with the French.

 

The 371st and the 372nd Infantry fought with the French 157th Division, the "Red Hand" division.

 

Sources:

1. Edward M. Coffman The War to End All Wars.

2. The Wikipedia.

2. AfriGeneas Research Forum.

 

These four infantry regiments had been assigned to the 93rd Infantry Division which adopted as their shoulder insignia the blue Hadrian helmet of the French army because of the service of its regiments.

 

And they were decorated by the French because of their prowess in the fight with the Croix de Guerre. The book The War to End All Wars state the French stated "send all the Negro regiments you can."

[panzerwerk]

Just to add to the confusion , anyone who is connected with the tailor can get a uniform made fully badged with name tapes , a friend of mine in the Philippines had these 2 sets of tigers made for me . BTW I did not ask him to add name tapes for me , he did that on his own .

So be careful , they could have originated form a collector or Airsofter .

 

Army Pattern

 

 

Navy Pattern

 

[Darktide]

Just to add to the confusion , anyone who is connected with the tailor can get a uniform made fully badged with name tapes , a friend of mine in the Philippines had these 2 sets of tigers made for me . BTW I did not ask him to add name tapes for me , he did that on his own .

So be careful , they could have originated form a collector or Airsofter .

 

Army Pattern

 

 

Navy Pattern

 

 

These two BDA's probably came from a base tailoring shop, as they have access to the same exact fabric. Soldiers go to these shops to have extra sets of uniforms made.

 

The first one is a Army Special Forces TS pattern.

 

The second one is a Navy NAVSOG TS pattern. I have several of these. Athough people do use these for airsoft, they are real.

[panzerwerk]

These two BDA's probably came from a base tailoring shop, as they have access to the same exact fabric. Soldiers go to these shops to have extra sets of uniforms made.

 

The first one is a Army Special Forces TS pattern.

 

The second one is a Navy NAVSOG TS pattern. I have several of these. Athough people do use these for airsoft, they are real.

 

Thanks Darktide , That was my exact point , from what I know there is no Issue sets for Philippine armed forces , all branches approve a camo pattern and fabric , and all uniforms are made by approved tailors , the reason you hardly ever see a tag in a real uniform , unless the tailor puts it there .

If someone like my friend has an friend in one of these shops , that person can get uniforms made for other then Military use . also you see some obsolete patterns come to the market as they use up old fabric , the set below is an example , my friend had this set tailored for me this year,its an obsolete pattern.

 

[12A54]

I used to wear a ROK Army parka in the field that was reversible green to white. Didn't think much about anything other than it was parctical/functional. Wore it in Korea and Germany. In later years I wore a British (DPM) holster and a French fleece battle jacket.

[kammo-man]

PW ,

Fantastic uniforms !!!!!!!

owen

[Darktide]

Thanks Darktide , That was my exact point , from what I know there is no Issue sets for Philippine armed forces , all branches approve a camo pattern and fabric , and all uniforms are made by approved tailors , the reason you hardly ever see a tag in a real uniform , unless the tailor puts it there .

If someone like my friend has an friend in one of these shops , that person can get uniforms made for other then Military use . also you see some obsolete patterns come to the market as they use up old fabric , the set below is an example , my friend had this set tailored for me this year,its an obsolete pattern.

 

 

This is totally true... It gets really confusing. To give an example, the Navy uses different camo patterns. Panzerwerk, you should hang on to those two BDA's you have, the Special Forces TS fabric ran out some months ago, so they have been using the NAVSOG pattern. The NAVSOG has a new digital TS pattern (tigerpat) and the fabric is supposed to arrive soon. I have seen a sample of the tigerpat, and am waiting for it.

 

Btw, I'm pretty sure I know the shop that made your two uniforms.

[Sabrejet]

It's not without precedent. As far back as WW2 some Americans wore British-issue battledress blouses with US insignia.

 

Sabrejet

[vintageproductions]

Thanks Darktide , That was my exact point , from what I know there is no Issue sets for Philippine armed forces , all branches approve a camo pattern and fabric , and all uniforms are made by approved tailors , the reason you hardly ever see a tag in a real uniform , unless the tailor puts it there .

If someone like my friend has an friend in one of these shops , that person can get uniforms made for other then Military use . also you see some obsolete patterns come to the market as they use up old fabric , the set below is an example , my friend had this set tailored for me this year,its an obsolete pattern.

 

 

 

This has always been one of my favorite Philippine patterns. When I was running around the PI in the late 80's & early 90's I would hit all the "junk" shops around Quiapo (I think that is the right spelling), and grab camo all the time. Esp the Marine patterns from then as they were what I could sell back in the states easily. I only ever got a few pieces of this above pattern, but like a dumb a** I never kept any of it,

I have one great PI Army camo uniform I kept. Will take photos of it later, as it was named to a high ranking General officer.

[Darktide]

This has always been one of my favorite Philippine patterns. When I was running around the PI in the late 80's & early 90's I would hit all the "junk" shops around Quiapo (I think that is the right spelling), and grab camo all the time. Esp the Marine patterns from then as they were what I could sell back in the states easily. I only ever got a few pieces of this above pattern, but like a dumb a** I never kept any of it,

I have one great PI Army camo uniform I kept. Will take photos of it later, as it was named to a high ranking General officer.

 

"Quiapo" is the correct spelling. :twothumbup: Yes, they do have a lot of stuff in Quiapo. There is a new Marine digital camo pattern which I have, a tiny Marine insignia is repeated in the camo pattern much like the the US Marine Desert and Marpat uniforms. "Regular" Army units and the Air Force use the same camo pattern, a DPM variant (different from the above). The Chinese Special Forces uniform is practically exactly the same, even the colors.

[Darktide]

It's not without precedent. As far back as WW2 some Americans wore British-issue battledress blouses with US insignia.

 

Sabrejet

 

I didn't know that... That's new to me! Thanks for the info!

[vintageproductions]

Okay, how about a different angle on this subject. Here is a US jungle fatigue, VN dated, issue to a Philippine General. Plus his tailor made camo set. These were given to me, on one of my trips to the Philippine's by the wife of General Ermita. He did a tour in Vietnam with a Philippine army unit. When these were given to me he was either on the Philippine Supreme Court or the equal to the Joint Cheifs.

These are definately some of my favorite pieces I ever pulled out of the Philippines. Plus they saved my rear going through Aquino airport with suitcases of militaria. But, that is another long story......

 

[Darktide]

Okay, how about a different angle on this subject. Here is a US jungle fatigue, VN dated, issue to a Philippine General. Plus his tailor made camo set. These were given to me, on one of my trips to the Philippine's by the wife of General Ermita. He did a tour in Vietnam with a Philippine army unit. When these were given to me he was either on the Philippine Supreme Court or the equal to the Joint Cheifs.

These are definately some of my favorite pieces I ever pulled out of the Philippines. Plus they saved my rear going through Aquino airport with suitcases of militaria. But, that is another long story......

 

 

Wow! Those are super old! Very nice! Plus the fact that they came from General Ermita! The brown camo one is a bit strange though... I don't recall that one ever being a "standard" issue item but I could be wrong. They are so many different camo patterns currently being used in the Philippines (and in the past as well) that it's confusing. Even cops have different camo patterns.

[panzerwerk]

Thanks Guys for all the interesting info !!!!! Here is the recent Marine digi and the old Marine Woodland , plus since were showing Philippine camo , the first version of the SAF choc chip !!

I would guess all these patterns could have been worn by U.S. Advisers at some point in time .

 

BTW I have no plans of ever getting rid of any of these , they were hard enough for me to get in the first place :w00t:

 

[panzerwerk]

Okay, how about a different angle on this subject. Here is a US jungle fatigue, VN dated, issue to a Philippine General. Plus his tailor made camo set. These were given to me, on one of my trips to the Philippine's by the wife of General Ermita. He did a tour in Vietnam with a Philippine army unit. When these were given to me he was either on the Philippine Supreme Court or the equal to the Joint Cheifs.

These are definately some of my favorite pieces I ever pulled out of the Philippines. Plus they saved my rear going through Aquino airport with suitcases of militaria. But, that is another long story......

 

 

AWESOME SET !!!!!!!!!!!! very old rare camo , Thanks for sharing , it means there is hope for me someday of finding a set !!!

[Darktide]

Thanks Guys for all the interesting info !!!!! Here is the recent Marine digi and the old Marine Woodland , plus since were showing Philippine camo , the first version of the SAF choc chip !!

I would guess all these patterns could have been worn by U.S. Advisers at some point in time .

 

BTW I have no plans of ever getting rid of any of these , they were hard enough for me to get in the first place :w00t:

 

 

I have the digital Marine camo as well. The SAF that you have is known as "camo brown". There is a "camo green" version. There is also a "green" version of the old Marine camo. I can still get a lot of the uniforms that have been shown in this thread.

 

This is the new Navy NAVSOG digital TS (tigerpat) pattern which I am waiting for. It's due to arrive in the Philippines very soon. Sorry for the pic quality... I was shown a sample uniform made of this fabric/ pattern and I snapped a pic with my cam phone. I'll be getting some of these.

 

Navy NAVSOG TS again...

 

Navy SWAG (Special Warfare Action Group), now they are known as NAVSOG. Pic was taken in the early 90's. One of them is wearing the old camo pattern, the green version of what PZ posted. This was taken when I was helping them out.

[Bombe_Atomique]

 

I want one of these.

And one in the Army pattern.