MPage Posted February 10, 2021 Share #576 Posted February 10, 2021 I picked this up recently. It has the 50th Signal Battalion's flash, but I did some digging and found out that the flash originally was used by the 35th Signal Group, to which the 50th belonged, during the beret craze in the 70s. The 35th Signal Group had airborne status, but since the beret is in Signals branch color, I'm curious as to what component unit could it represent? From what I can see, during part of its time the 35th Signal Group had at least two non-airborne battalion assigned to it. Since these were separate battalions, I guess they would all wear the 35th flash, with their battalion DUI (?). Maybe Patches can add some expertise here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
patches Posted February 11, 2021 Share #577 Posted February 11, 2021 6 hours ago, MPage said: I picked this up recently. It has the 50th Signal Battalion's flash, but I did some digging and found out that the flash originally was used by the 35th Signal Group, to which the 50th belonged, during the beret craze in the 70s. The 35th Signal Group had airborne status, but since the beret is in Signals branch color, I'm curious as to what component unit could it represent? From what I can see, during part of its time the 35th Signal Group had at least two non-airborne battalion assigned to it. Since these were separate battalions, I guess they would all wear the 35th flash, with their battalion DUI (?). Maybe Patches can add some expertise here. This type of "Airborne" units are airborne really in name only, or mostly in name only, they wear their own unit patches, but they fall under XVIII Airborne Corps, and even if some actual personnel in units throughout the group/brigade that were on jump status in connection to direct support of any XVIII Abn Corps (ones from the corps that were/are on actual jump status) or 82nd Abn Div elmts, back in the 70s unauthorized beret period, would probably wear the Maroon Beret. In example a more recent photo from the HHC of the Brigade, note they are wearing black Berets rather then Maroon. However This sub unit, the 50th Signal Battalion was only title AIRBORNE very briefly in the 50s , and had a novelty type of patch for it. and does not as far as we can see a true Jump Capability in the 70s, today it's new title 50th Signal Battalion (Corps) (Forced Entry) (Airborne) there seems to be one company on jump status?, the 514th Signal Company? On the Orange Beret. Here's an earlier photo from this topic posed by seanmc1114, that does show that Signal Corps Branch Berets were worn, 57th Signal Battalion Ft Hood 1974-75, so my guess is the beret you got for the 50th Sig Bn is from the 70s time period. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MPage Posted February 11, 2021 Share #578 Posted February 11, 2021 Right I was sure I had a Signal beret, but was curious about the exact unit, as the 35th Signal Group was wearing that flash prior to 1981 (when it became the 50 Sig Bn flash). Would all the units of the Group have worn the flash, or just the HQ? I ask because I thought I might narrow down the likely unit, and find a DUI for it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cavcon Posted February 11, 2021 Share #579 Posted February 11, 2021 Pretty sure everyone in the entire unit would wear the same beret but each regiment/battalion would have their own flash. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
patches Posted February 12, 2021 Share #580 Posted February 12, 2021 9 hours ago, MPage said: Right I was sure I had a Signal beret, but was curious about the exact unit, as the 35th Signal Group was wearing that flash prior to 1981 (when it became the 50 Sig Bn flash). Would all the units of the Group have worn the flash, or just the HQ? I ask because I thought I might narrow down the likely unit, and find a DUI for it. Would all the units of the Group have worn the flash, or just the HQ? I don't know, maybe. The DI for the 35th Sig Grp will be this one I'm seeing, while it is for the 35th Sig Bde today, it was originally adopted for the 35th Sig Grp in 1968, I guess you can split the difference and pick up one of these, a pre or post 1974 one will do (Post 1974 will now have MADE IN USA on them). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
12thengr Posted February 19, 2021 Share #581 Posted February 19, 2021 25th ID, 1987, light blue or grey beret. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
patches Posted February 20, 2021 Share #582 Posted February 20, 2021 On 11/9/2017 at 6:20 AM, seanmc1114 said: I have posted a little bit about this under a different topic. The Army is developing a new type of unit, the Security Force Assistance Brigade with the 1st Security Force Assistance Brigade already activated earlier this year and currently training at Fort Benning. The Facebook page for the 1st states as follows: "On order, 1st Security Force Assistance Brigade deploys in support of a combatant commander, integrates with foreign partner forces, assists and advises local security operations to build partner security capacity and capability to achieve regional security in support of U.S. national interests." The members of the brigade are wearing a new SSI although I cannot find it on the Institute of Heraldry website. Now it appears there is a move to allow the members of the Security Force Assistance Brigades to wear a green beret in a shade slightly lighter than the one worn by Special Forces. Because of the beret issue, the resemblance of the new SSI to the Special Forces SSI and the similarity in their missions, this is apparently causing some concern among Special Forces soldiers. https://www.armytimes.com/news/your-army/2017/10/27/the-rumors-are-true-the-army-plans-to-issue-distinctive-berets-to-its-new-military-training-advisers/ http://www.sof.news/sfa/sfab-beret/ http://soldiersystems.net/2017/10/26/ask-ssd-is-there-a-new-sf-group/ Here's a 2018 shot of the Berets in question, a Brown Beret. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seanmc1114 Posted February 21, 2021 Share #583 Posted February 21, 2021 Joint Casualty Resolution Center around 1974-1975. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seanmc1114 Posted February 26, 2021 Share #584 Posted February 26, 2021 The photo identifies this as Fort Greely, Alaska - 1976. I believe the SSI is the 171st Infantry Brigade, but it could be 172nd, The photo further identifies the officer in the brown beret as company commander Cpt. Jim Morehouse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seanmc1114 Posted February 26, 2021 Share #585 Posted February 26, 2021 This one has 1970's written all over it. Black beret with pin-on rank and Trainer Personnel DUI on a black beret and U.S. Army Training Center Armor SSI and nylon name and Army tapes worn on perma press fatigues. The rank insignia on the beret is definitely brass - as opposed to subdued - and the insignia on the collars looks to be brass as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cavcon Posted February 26, 2021 Share #586 Posted February 26, 2021 That is a great pic! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grunt1SG Posted February 28, 2021 Share #587 Posted February 28, 2021 Black beret that I wore while assigned to 1-4 Infantry. OPFOR at what was then CMTC Hohenfels, Germany. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grunt1SG Posted February 28, 2021 Share #588 Posted February 28, 2021 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seanmc1114 Posted March 28, 2021 Share #589 Posted March 28, 2021 Here's the maroon beret and flash being worn by members of the Thornbirds, sort of an elite airborne corps commanded by Col. Clay Thornbush that operated out of Fort Biloxi, Mississippi in the late 70's/early 80's. They were one of the earliest airborne units to allow women in their ranks. Note they also had their own unique SSI which was worn on the right sleeve. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MPage Posted March 28, 2021 Share #590 Posted March 28, 2021 1 hour ago, seanmc1114 said: Here's the maroon beret and flash being worn by members of the Thornbirds, sort of an elite airborne corps commanded by Col. Clay Thornbush that operated out of Fort Biloxi, Mississippi in the late 70's/early 80's. They were one of the earliest airborne units to allow women in their ranks. Note they also had their own unique SSI which was worn on the right sleeve. It's still March! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
easterneagle87 Posted March 28, 2021 Share #591 Posted March 28, 2021 Ooohhh, please! That there’s PVT Benji , aka Goldie Hawn. should have saved that for April Fools day. 😆 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manny C Posted March 28, 2021 Share #592 Posted March 28, 2021 Had me completly fooled. Now I feel silly. lol Nice job Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seanmc1114 Posted April 1, 2021 Share #593 Posted April 1, 2021 Medal Of Honor recipient Sergeant Major Thomas Payne. Note he is wearing the shoulder sleeve insignia, DUI and beret flash of the Special Operations Command with the Ranger tan beret. I thought the tan beret was limited to wear by members of the 75th Ranger Regiment and the Ranger Training Brigade. However, according to wikipedia, for what it's worth, "On June 14, 2001 the U.S. Army Rangers assigned to the 75th Ranger Regiment were authorized to wear a distinctive tan beret to replace the black berets that had become the army-wide standard. In the U.S. Army, the tan beret can be worn only by those assigned to the 75th Ranger Regiment, the Airborne and Ranger Training Brigade, or have served with the regiment for at least one year and is still serving within a unit under the U.S. Army Special Operations Command." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
McChizzle Posted April 3, 2021 Share #594 Posted April 3, 2021 That is correct seanmc1114. When I was serving with the 7th Special Forces Group (Airborne) as an military intelligence (MI) sergeant in the 1990s, my first sergeant, also an MI NCO, had come from the 75th Ranger Regiment. Since he was still serving within U.S. Special Operations Command (USSOCOM), he was authorized to continue wearing his black beret--that's what they wore before Shinseki messed it up in 2000--but if he left special ops and got assigned to a regular MI unit he would not be allowed to wear the black beret anymore. This rule still exists with the now tan beret. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
McChizzle Posted April 10, 2021 Share #595 Posted April 10, 2021 Does anyone have information that could corroborate the fact that 3rd Battalion, 172nd Infantry Regiment (Mountain) wore gray berets at some point in its history, as this seller proclaims on WorthPoint? https://www.worthpoint.com/worthopedia/army-mountain-battalion-beret-172-150166249 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
patches Posted April 11, 2021 Share #596 Posted April 11, 2021 8 hours ago, McChizzle said: Does anyone have information that could corroborate the fact that 3rd Battalion, 172nd Infantry Regiment (Mountain) wore gray berets at some point in its history, as this seller proclaims on WorthPoint? https://www.worthpoint.com/worthopedia/army-mountain-battalion-beret-172-150166249 Kinda reminds me of the Hodden Grey of the old London Scottish. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
patches Posted April 11, 2021 Share #597 Posted April 11, 2021 3 hours ago, patches said: Kinda reminds me of the Hodden Grey of the old London Scottish. Seen one unit has a Facebook Page, no berets, but maybe they can be contacted to ask??? Facebook Page C/3-172 IN MTN Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MPage Posted April 11, 2021 Share #598 Posted April 11, 2021 13 hours ago, patches said: Seen one unit has a Facebook Page, no berets, but maybe they can be contacted to ask??? Facebook Page C/3-172 IN MTN Since 3/172 is a Nat'l Guard unit, would they have more leeway to wear these? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
McChizzle Posted April 11, 2021 Share #599 Posted April 11, 2021 45 minutes ago, MPage said: Since 3/172 is a Nat'l Guard unit, would they have more leeway to wear these? Sort of, but only while on Title 32 status (state control). I don't know what all the limitations are but maybe berets are one of them I do know that state guard (not the national guard) has a lot of uniform flexibility and because they are not beholden to the federal government's uniform regulations--well not all of them that is--they can get away with a lot. State guard/Militia cannot wear a uniform that makes them look exactly like the national guard or another federal uniform service, so they must alter their uniform enough to be recognized as non-federal/state military personnel. Most do that using US Army uniforms with different patches, service taps, unique beret flashes, etc. https://armypubs.army.mil/epubs/DR_pubs/DR_a/ARN30302-AR_670-1-000-WEB-1.pdf https://web.archive.org/web/20100211213320/http://www.calguard.ca.gov/casmr/Documents/Regulations/CSMR670-1_2008-04.pdf https://media.defense.gov/2014/Apr/30/2001713359/-1/-1/1/DODIG-2014-065.pdf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
McChizzle Posted April 17, 2021 Share #600 Posted April 17, 2021 On 1/6/2021 at 12:19 AM, rtd_sf_eng said: The 67th Engineer Company was located at Fort Wainwright. In February-March 1976, my company went to Fort Wainwright for Jack Frost training and while there I purchased all flashes that were worn there, which were made at the post concession cleaners. And they did wear the OD beret (I referred to it as a 'Buffalo Chip' beret). Here is the flash from the Engineer Company. rtd_sf_eng,, Since you purchased all the beret flashes that were worn at Ft Wainwright in 1976, would you mind taking pictures and posting them for us/me to see and learn about? I really want to understand the types and designs of each beret flash that was worn on the "Buffalo Chip" berets. Also, if you happen to know the unit designation of each flash you purchased, that would be wonderful to see/know as well. Thanks, you in advance, for your help. McChizzle Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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