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Thompson Submachine Gun used by Marines at Yalu


kanemono
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Hi,

This Thompson submachine gun belonged to Lt. Col James H. Dill. Lt. Col. Dill was written up for and awarded the Bronze Star Medal by Colonel Lewis “Chesty” Puller First Marine Regiment for his actions on September 25, 1950 during the recapture of Seoul. First Lt. Dill was the forward observer for the Seventh Division’s 31st field artillery and was the only FO attached to the First Marine Regiment. On September 25, 1950 the Marines were charged by a dozen tanks and self propelled guns of the NKPA Brigade. The Marines fired their howitzers until the tubes became so hot that they had to cease fire. The Marines asked for 155mm howitzer fire from the Army. The 31st Field Artillery Battalion responded with awesome firepower, 360 rounds along the 3rd Battalion, First Marines direct front. The fire mission destroyed remaining NKPA tanks. First Lt. Dill was the FO standing with Colonel Puller and directed the 31st Field Artillery Battalion’s fire. This “captured” Thompson submachine gun was presented to First Lt. Dill by officers of the 3rd Battalion, First Marines before he left Korea in 1951. Lt. Col. Dill placed a note behind the trap door in the stock of the Thompson. In the note Lt. Col Dill stated that the Thompson was captured and used by Marines during their escape from the Yalu. (Entire Chinese Regiments were armed with Lend Lease Thompson's and thousands more were captured from the Nationalist's during the civil war. In fact entire re-educated Nationalist Regiments fully armed with American equipment were used as shock troops. The Marines used the Thompson's and the full magazines in Chinese made bandoleers taken from dead Chinese soldiers because the Chinese kept their guns oil free so they wouldn’t freeze. The Marines M-1's and carbines often froze solid). Lt. Col. Dill wrote the book "Sixteen Days at Mungol-Li" (1993) and the American Heritage Magazine article “Winter of the YaIu” (December 1982) which tells of his escape from the Yalu in 1950. Lt. Col. Dill was also recognized by the Korean Government for not destroying Deoksugung Palace, a Korean National Treasure, despite the fact that North Koreans were using it as a base. When I bought the Thompson SMG the center of the receiver was missing. I was told Lt. Col. Dill had destroyed the receiver to make it legal because the gun was illegal and no longer able to be registered. I bought an 80% receiver, beautifully machined by Philadelphia Ordnance, with all original markings and numbered with the serial number taken from the remains of the original receiver. I patinated the metal to match the original pieces of the receiver, grip frame and barrel which had turned brown and showed a great deal of wear. Lt. Col. Dill’s medals were sold on EBAY. I was very lucky to be able to put these pieces back together and fortunate that Lt. Col. Dill cared so much about history to place a note inside the butt stock of his Thompson to explain to people in the future what part this gun played in the history of the Korean War.

Dick

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Woof! That is one incredible piece of history! Just imagine how many ChiComs were stopped with that bad boy. Truly and incredible story and incredible officer. :thumbsup:

 

Thank you for sharing,

 

G

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  • 2 weeks later...
Woof! That is one incredible piece of history! Just imagine how many ChiComs were stopped with that bad boy. Truly and incredible story and incredible officer. :thumbsup:

 

Thank you for sharing,

 

G

 

Or how many US marines?(!) :think:

 

Amazing find!

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Hi,

I need help!

Could anyone please tell me if there is any way I could get official records for Lt. Col. Dill? I would like to get a copy of hid BSM citation written up by Gen. "Chesty" Puller. All of the information I have gleaned so far has been from searching the internet and from books I have bought. I thought that only records 100 years old or older were allowed to be sent to non relatives. People on this Forum seem to be very knowledgeable on research and very helpful.

Thank You!

Dick

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Hi As I understand it records have to be 62 years old to be fully archival offical military personnel file (OMPF) I have some Korean war groupings that I would like to get records for but all I can get is whats releasable with the (foid) freedom of information act which isn't much. Good luck in your search you sure have an amazing group there. Mark

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Captainofthe7th

I am honored to be the current caretaker of Lt. Dill's Ike Jacket....Dick and I have been in touch (and I've been meaning to get back to him). It is nice to know that while the group is split, we each know where the other part is...

 

I hope to add more information shortly, I read the book 1 1/2 times through now and there are some great pieces of information. I'm also looking into getting his records...

 

Rob

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Hi Rob,

The book is very interesting, it gives the common soldier perspective of the war. I would love to get a copy of the BSM citation written by "Chesty" Puller. You would think that would be public information.

Dick

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Hi,

I thought you might be interested to see what kind of small arms the Chinese were using in 1950 at the beginning of the Korean War. Lt. Col Dill’s Thompson was captured from the Chinese during the Yalu River, Chosin Reservoir fighting (one of the most decorated battles in American history) by a member of the First Marine Division. The Yalu River, Chosin Reservoir Campaigns occurred before the huge influx of Russian weapons into China. The basic Chinese soldier was armed with a Chinese made 98 Mauser shown here with a bayonet imported from Czechlovokia. This rifle has "Power comes from the muzzle of a gun” stenciled on the butt of the stock. Swords like this large be-heading sword and the cavalry saber were common. The Chinese used cavalry to a great extent during the war. The folding knife is a Chinese military marked piece. The dagger would have been used by both Communist and Nationalist Chinese officers. The favorite Chinese hand gun was the Broomhandle Mauser produced in Germany and copied by Spain. Here are two variations, a short barrel bolo with a holster shoulder stock attached and C-96 in a cutaway holster. This pistol has Chinese made horn grips and the common silk tassel attached to the butt ring. Fully automatic Mauser and Spanish variations of the C-96 with large capacity magazines and shoulder stock holsters were also very common. The leather bandoleer was designed to carry stripper clips for the Mauser pistols. A similar setup was used to carry magazines for Thompson Submachine Guns. The bugle was used for communication since the Chinese had no radios. As previously mentioned Thompson Submachine Guns of all types were used by Chinese shock troops. Maxim water cooled machine guns and Czech ZB26’s along with BAR’s and Browning heavy and light machine guns were also heavily used by the Chinese at the Chosin Reservoir. Most of the items pictured here were brought back from China as souvenirs by veterans of WW2 and Korea.

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Captainofthe7th

Wow! Nice selection of captured weapons! My Pepere tried to take home what he called a Russian Carbine...I always assumed it was a cut down Mosin Nagant or something similar. I've also seen a number of photos with GIs handling a C-96...

 

Thanks for posting these.

 

Rob

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  • 1 month later...

Hi,

Bob from Philadelphia Ordinance emailed me and asked me to put up pictures of the original receiver and parts I had posted as “Thompson Submachine Gun used by Marines at Yalu” http://www.machinegunboards.com/forums/ind...showtopic=11549 . It seems there is some question as to the piece being real or made up from a “parts set”. Bob removed the barrel from the original piece of the receiver. I am the least qualified person to know about Thompson receivers or “part’s sets”, however, Bob who is very knowledgeable stated “It seems to me that this is all very well documented, that Lt. Col. Dill had the gun in his possession for many years. I took the barrel off the receiver and the receiver had been cut about an inch to the rear of the ejection port. Every parts kit gun I have seen has been cut thru the ejection port”. Here are pictures of both the Thompson parts and the cut receiver.

I bought the beat up remains of the Thompson submachine gun at a gun show. The dealer I bought it from told me the pieces came from an estate in Arkansas and that the piece had belonged to Lt. Col. James H. Dill who had brought it back from Korea. The dealer also said that Dill had cut up the receiver to make it legal when he found out the gun was illegal and no longer able to be registered. Included with the gun parts were some insignia, ribbons and copies of the book "Sixteen Days at Mungol-Li" and an "American Heritage" magazine both signed “James H. Dill”. The dealer also told me Dill’s medals might be out there somewhere because Dills footlocker and his medals were sold at the estate auction. He said he would email me if he turned up anything. The price was reasonable for a “part’s set” so I bought them to re-sell at the local Antique Mall. I was very surprised when he emailed me that Dill’s medals were on EBAY. I placed a bid and won Lt. Col. Dill’s group of medals. When I received the medals, the frame, medals and the backing were all apart in the box. The backing had a hand written description of the medals and the fact that the Bronze Star Medal was awarded for actions on Sept. 25, 1950. The signature on the backing matched signatures on the book and the American Heritage Magazine I bought with the gun parts. I also found an engraved plaque in the box presenting a “TSMG” to First Lieutenant Dill from officers of the Third Battalion of the First Marine Regiment. The plaque was not mentioned in the auction so I am assuming the seller either threw it with the medals or the plaque was behind the backing in the frame. When I looked at the Thompson stock there were holes filled with dirt and grease where the screws had been. I thought the piece was interesting and worth putting an 80% receiver on the parts. I ordered a M1A1 receiver from Philadelphia Ordinance. I also sent the barrel and the front of the receiver to Bob at Philadelphia Ordinance so they could be unscrewed from each other. When I received the receiver I patinated the metal to match the original pieces of the receiver, grip frame and barrel which had turned brown and showed a great deal of wear. While I was working on restoring the piece I found a note from Lt. Col. Dill in the hole behind the trap door in the butt stock. In the note he explained that the Marine Officer's who presented him with the Thompson told him that Dill’s Thompson was one of Thompson’s the Marines captured from the Chinese during their retreat from the Yalu. The grouping is very interesting but I don’t think it has any monetary worth beyond the value of the parts, new receiver and medals. It is still only a "dummy gun". I hope this answers some of the questions about the Thompson.

Dick

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WOW! :w00t:

 

 

 

 

I'm looking for original WWII U.S. Roughout or Russett Service Boots if anybody has a extra pair or two. Size 7-12 and in nice shape!

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  • 3 months later...

Today is the 60th Anniversary of the start of the Korean War / The Forgotten War. I think this group, Col. Dill's book and the American Heritage article he wrote symbolize the terrible difficulties and conditions of that war. I would like to thank every Veteran of the Korean War for their sacrifices. It is not a Forgotten War to me.

Thank You!

Dick

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  • 7 months later...

I wrote for Lt. Col. Dill's records and here is what I received. I was hoping that I would get his Bronze Stat citation which was written by Chesty Puller but no luck. Would anyone have an idea where I could obtain the citation? Here are some of Lt. Col. Dill's insignia that came with the Thompson.

Dick

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Hi,

I thought you might be interested to see what kind of small arms the Chinese were using in 1950 at the beginning of the Korean War. Lt. Col Dill’s Thompson was captured from the Chinese during the Yalu River, Chosin Reservoir fighting (one of the most decorated battles in American history) by a member of the First Marine Division. The Yalu River, Chosin Reservoir Campaigns occurred before the huge influx of Russian weapons into China. The basic Chinese soldier was armed with a Chinese made 98 Mauser shown here with a bayonet imported from Czechlovokia. This rifle has "Power comes from the muzzle of a gun” stenciled on the butt of the stock. Swords like this large be-heading sword and the cavalry saber were common. The Chinese used cavalry to a great extent during the war. The folding knife is a Chinese military marked piece. The dagger would have been used by both Communist and Nationalist Chinese officers. The favorite Chinese hand gun was the Broomhandle Mauser produced in Germany and copied by Spain. Here are two variations, a short barrel bolo with a holster shoulder stock attached and C-96 in a cutaway holster. This pistol has Chinese made horn grips and the common silk tassel attached to the butt ring. Fully automatic Mauser and Spanish variations of the C-96 with large capacity magazines and shoulder stock holsters were also very common. The leather bandoleer was designed to carry stripper clips for the Mauser pistols. A similar setup was used to carry magazines for Thompson Submachine Guns. The bugle was used for communication since the Chinese had no radios. As previously mentioned Thompson Submachine Guns of all types were used by Chinese shock troops. Maxim water cooled machine guns and Czech ZB26’s along with BAR’s and Browning heavy and light machine guns were also heavily used by the Chinese at the Chosin Reservoir. Most of the items pictured here were brought back from China as souvenirs by veterans of WW2 and Korea.

 

Great thread and history behind LtC Dill.

 

I highly doubt the ceremonial dagger were used by the Communists. The dagger has the national flower of the Republic of China. Some chance Communist officer have carried it during WWII, but not after 1945. Same with the ceremonial sword. Usually the sword blades were flimsy and bent easliy.

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