WW2 US Navy

[sigsaye]

Regarding Artificer (engineering) Branch rates:

 

At the beginning of WWII, the Navy had an anomaly in their rating structure for fireman that was confusing. In essence, everyone went into the Navy as an apprentice seaman. Upon completion of recruit training at one of the recruit training center, you were usually sent to a school for more training or straight to the fleet. Some of the sailors were sent to some engineering specialty school and became fireman third class. Now a fireman third class was at the same rating scale as a seaman second class. Their rating progression went from Fireman third, to fireman second to fireman first class; then to PO 2nd class. So in other words, in the artificer (engineering) branch, there were no 3rd class Petty Officers. You didn’t have a Machinist’s Mate 3rd class or a water tender third class, etc. This changed in 1943 (but not effective til January 1944) when they made the rate structure fall in line with the seaman branch and third class petty officers became authorized. They eliminated the fireman third class rating, once they finished recruit training, they would become fireman 2nd class.

Most folks don't know that, and sometimes it gets really difficult to explain it, but that was great. The thing with the snipe rates was a hold over from the 1866 regulations that made "Fireman First Class" a Petty Officer Rating. Since inthose days, there were only one grade of Petty Officer, it just sort of held on over the course of time. Thanks for the explination.

 

Steve Hesson

[zouave114]

Regarding Artificer (engineering) Branch rates:

Upon completion of recruit training at one of the recruit training center, you were usually sent to a school for more training or straight to the fleet.

 

Aha, so that would explain why my Dad went from Sampson Naval Training to Great Lakes Training Center.

 

 

 

Jeff

[JRB]

Jeff, I saw a size 42 uniform on craigslist. http://lancaster.craigslist.org/atq/1566655254.html

 

Jack

[sigsaye]

Jeff, I saw a size 42 uniform on craigslist. http://lancaster.craigslist.org/atq/1566655254.html

 

Jack

For what it's worth, that is not a WW2 uniform. It has the post '49 Seaman stripes on the left sleeve. Additionally, it had a Unit Identification Mark on the right shoulder, which were not adopted until 1958, plus the National Defense ribbon ('53?)

 

But still, if no one looks real close......

 

Steve Hesson

[topdcnut]

Actually UIM's date from the 51 regs

[sigsaye]

Actually UIM's date from the 51 regs

This is true, but for some reason, they do not seem to be common in the fleet until '58. I have cruise books from the era, and they do not appear in any of the crew photos I have. My father didn't remember them until around '58-'59.

 

Either way, not a WW2 uniform

[sigsaye]

Actually UIM's date from the 51 regs

This is true, but for some reason, they do not seem to be common in the fleet until '58. I have cruise books from the era, and they do not appear in any of the crew photos I have. My father didn't remember them until around '58-'59.

 

Either way, not a WW2 uniform

[topdcnut]

My earliest UIM dates from 56 or 57

[sigsaye]

My earliest UIM dates from 56 or 57

Cool, do you remember what ships? It may have taken awhile for them to get around. I remember when I was CMAA, and how hard it was to get them to issue out. Never seememd to be a high pri for any one concerned. One time I got a box ful of patches for another ship that had just been decommed.

 

Steve Hesson

[topdcnut]

Steve,

 

My UIM came from the WASP, And as usual with the navy there is more to the story. Reading on in my copy of the 51 uniform regs, the UIM's had to be issued no later than 1 JAN 59 so that fits with what your Dad experienced and as usual the priority was set by the command. I also believe that there would be more jumpers with distinguishing marks on them but some commands (CO) just did not palce the same urgency or importance on them.

 

John

[sigsaye]

Steve,

 

My UIM came from the WASP, And as usual with the navy there is more to the story. Reading on in my copy of the 51 uniform regs, the UIM's had to be issued no later than 1 JAN 59 so that fits with what your Dad experienced and as usual the priority was set by the command. I also believe that there would be more jumpers with distinguishing marks on them but some commands (CO) just did not palce the same urgency or importance on them.

 

John

I agree with you about the Distinguishing marks. One thing about them, as with all of these sorts of things, the individual had to go out and buy them and pay to have them put on. many DMs were not permenant. This meant that they were only worn for a specific time and then had to either be requalled for or removed. Some things like the Battle E were only good as long as you were on that ship for that cycle, so no rush in getting it put on. There is a lot to be said about the power, that digging into his own pocket for this stuff, has on a Sailor.

 

Steve Hesson

[topdcnut]

Steve,

 

Great point, uniforms with a number of DM's mean that that DM was awarded within a year of that sailors seperation from naval service.

[fortworthgal]

Cool impression! Amazing you found anything WWII USN that actually fits - that stuff is always ridiculously tiny!

 

Here's a shot of me in my Navy WAVES uniform a couple of years ago:

 

[dartheric1]

heres me doing a 1st person impression of my uncle MM1 Alexander Ryan

[sgtbrown]

Even though our group is AAF oriented, some of us have a habit of showing up at dances and such in our USN finest. Here is a shot from a hangar dance of Lt Pat, CPO Tom, CPO Eric and the ever lovely Geringfugiger Offizier Harry.

 

I'll have to dig up a couple other shots.

 

Tom

[dartheric1]

now heres me doing my 1st person impression of my uncle MM1 alexander ryan

[sgtbrown]

As sometimes happens when soldiers and sailors get together...