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Col John A Schramm USMC Scout/Sniper


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Agreed. My searching on this shows....well, nothing. Other than the fact that it sure looks like this guy was a poser. Everyone else has already posted the same red flags I saw just on the ribbon bar alone. One other thing I noted, that I didn't see mentioned....Colonels make DARNED good money, and typically have either business, or calling cards. When you earn Colonel, you are pretty much expected to re-do your cards (and it's not a big fight, really, because everyone is proud of their new rank, even Private's First class LOL). What I'm getting to is, in all the Field Grade covers I've seen over the years, almost all of them, even the modern one's, have a card inside them with the bearers rank, etc. Not some cheezy scratched out handwritten thing. "SOCOM"???? Come on. That's another red flag. If our "Colonel" was really some sort of deep undercover 'operator', being all hush hush secret squirrel, is he going to write, in big fat letters, SOCOM on his dress cover?????????

 

All in all, this guy spent some serious coin (no pun intended) to pull off his hoax.

 

Still, you can likely recoup your investment by selling the stuff off. I'd be personally interested in the cover and ribbon rack if nothing else. I'm sure others have made similiar offers.

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My guess is like everyone else's...he was a hoax. Sadly, even HE might have believed the stories that went behind all of this. Who knows...he may never have worn everything, but instead had the nice jewelry box, and during the conversation with a nice "lady friend" casually mention that he was a retired Marine Colonel who was in Special Operations and then show her "the Bling"...all the pretty jewelry in the box.

 

Almost would have loved to have heard the guy's story...before beating his head in... :lol: (just kidding, though I'm sure there are some anti-posers who would have!)

 

Unfortunately, looks like he was a poster boy for the Stolen Valor Act...

 

Dave

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I'm waiting on confirmation from a friend of mine who is actually IN the USMC specops community, but another red flag just hit that wasn't mentioned.....Another Marine buddy of mine that I sent this to advised that "Colonel" is NEVER spelled out on the flightsuit tag.

 

Dave, that does make some sense....

 

I'll bet 20 years ago this guy would have had an HLI MOH!

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I'm waiting on confirmation from a friend of mine who is actually IN the USMC specops community, but another red flag just hit that wasn't mentioned.....Another Marine buddy of mine that I sent this to advised that "Colonel" is NEVER spelled out on the flightsuit tag.

 

Dave, that does make some sense....

 

I'll bet 20 years ago this guy would have had an HLI MOH!

 

I am wondering why the MOH ISN'T included on the rack! :think:

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Stinger Gunner USMC

I feel bad for you, I hope you are able to make a return in your investment. But in some ways it is an important lesson for all of the colletctors in our community. It is very easy to be blinded by the excitement of the moment of a find and not suspect things to be questionable, espically when names are included.

 

This may be the largest case of personal fraud (nto something likely put together by a collector but by the veteran, if he even was one) that I have personally seen show up in the community but certainly not the only one.

 

I have seen countless cases of veteran obtained uniforms or groupings that include items that they didn't earn, anything from a simple campaign medal, a personal promotion in rank to self awards of Purple Hearts, Bronze Stars and Silver Stars. This idea that we now call "Stollen Valor" is certainly not a new phenomena. While much of the things added by veterans were likely because they knew they were entitled but it was never included in paper work was botched up along the line but in other cases there are obvious examples of fraud commited by the veteran for one reason or another.

 

Has any one checked this guy against the stolen valor online database?

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I feel bad for you, I hope you are able to make a return in your investment. But in some ways it is an important lesson for all of the colletctors in our community. It is very easy to be blinded by the excitement of the moment of a find and not suspect things to be questionable, espically when names are included.

 

This may be the largest case of personal fraud (nto something likely put together by a collector but by the veteran, if he even was one) that I have personally seen show up in the community but certainly not the only one.

 

I have seen countless cases of veteran obtained uniforms or groupings that include items that they didn't earn, anything from a simple campaign medal, a personal promotion in rank to self awards of Purple Hearts, Bronze Stars and Silver Stars. This idea that we now call "Stollen Valor" is certainly not a new phenomena. While much of the things added by veterans were likely because they knew they were entitled but it was never included in paper work was botched up along the line but in other cases there are obvious examples of fraud commited by the veteran for one reason or another.

 

Has any one checked this guy against the stolen valor online database?

 

Don't feel too bad for me,heck I have picked up lots of good stuff over the years and this one is just a bump in the road. If even one collector learns from this (besides myself) then I will feel some good has come out of it and can live with that. I am certain I can get what I have into it by selling off the parts. As most have noticed,everything is brand new!! At the least I can say I have one of the largest personal fraud groupings around :w00t:

 

Steve

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All,

 

Regarding "classified" citations........ Having worked in the Intel business as a 352C (SIGINT) WO, on occasion had to do a writeup on something that was classified. Granted, it wasn't for a Navy Cross, MOH, Silver Star, or anything like that (actually a Joint Service Commendation Medal, I know, not sexy! LOL) What we did was a generic citation. The point being that for EVERY award there will always be a citation of some sort, even if it is generic. I've never understood these fakers, and don't guess I ever will. We had a guy in the local area who used to walk around wearing a DSC, Navy Cross, and an Air Force GCM! Used to beg at gas stations and the like. Right before I retired, I was heading into work in BDU's and this guy came up to me. Asked him where he got the "fruit salad" and he gave me the "classified" thing. Bad answer, really bad answer! LOL If I hadn't been in uniform, and not wanting to disrespect it, I'd of jammed those medals with pins open pointy end up where he wouldn't of liked it. Instead, I suggested that he remove them, or the next time I saw him, I would!!!! Damn uniform! Damn clearance! LOL

 

My two cents,

 

John

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I am wondering why the MOH ISN'T included on the rack! :think:

 

He probably couldn't find one. :think:

 

Seriously, when someone or something seems too good to be true, he/it probably is. Shake it off, dump what you can; the medals, even though current issue, are worth something. The ribbon rack might make a nice Christmas tree decoration. Oops, sorry, I said I was going to be serious. :unsure:

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Gotta admit, the rack is impressive, not Idi Amin impressive, but not bad. And, I always thought the the USMC handed out awards like they were throwing around manhole covers! LOL Geez, you guys are getting as bad as the Army and the Air Force! LOL (OOPS, was supposed to be serious here) Wait...... I am, the USMC doesn't just dole things out! LOL

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Tommymonkey192

Even though in all likelihood it appears that the late "Colonel" Schramm is a fake, it did pique my curiosity enough to check the US Social Security Death Records via the LDS Family Search site. I found two John Schramms in the right age group who could be our faux colonel. One was born in 1938, possibly in New York, and died in March 2008 in Fairborn, OH while the other was born in 1941, in New Jersey, and died in either Saugutuck or Westport, CT in February of this year.

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Well,the hoax continues. Talked to the guy that I got the above postaed stuff from and he had a few more boxes of stuff that belonged to Schramm. I found out he passed away a few months ago in New York state and had 6 kids while he told the seller he had none. The seller also said he was told by Schramm that he retired in 1968. 1968 also seems to be the year that Staff Sgt John (Jack) A Schramm USMC was promoted to 2nd Lt in the USMC by LBJ himself!

 

Check out the following certificates that are on loan to me from the seller. He seemed quite surprised when I layed out the facts and fantasies that were gone over here at the Forum.

 

Lots of pictures to follow along with some comments so please bear with me!

 

These are all dated 1966 to Sgt or Staff Sgt Schramm.LRP & Surveilance Leaders Course awarded in Apr in Vietnam,Recon School Grad,3rd Force Recon Co,3rd Marine Div awarded in Nov and the EOD & Sabotage Demo Expert awarded in Dec at Camp Hanson Okinawa.

 

post-5041-1258853427.jpg

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These two are dated 1967,one to Staff Sgt (SERE Course in Jan) and the other to 2nd Lt Schramm (Armed Forces Exp Medal in JUne) for combat ops in Quang TriProvince with 3rd Force Recon Co

 

post-5041-1258853846.jpg

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May 1968 dated promotion cert to Shramm going from Staff Sgt to 2nd Lt with a Lyndon B Johnson autograph. Autograph is NOT in LBJs writting style from other autographs I looked at online.

 

post-5041-1258854082.jpg

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May 1968 dated promotion cert to Shramm going from Staff Sgt to 2nd Lt with a Lyndon B Johnson autograph. Autograph is NOT in LBJs writting style from other autographs I looked at online.

 

So he got promoted to 2nd LT from SSGT without having a single Good Conduct medal.

 

Fascinating!

 

:think:

 

Dave

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These 4 are from 1969.Sept one he is a 2nd Lt and is for a PUC for heroism in Vietnam from Jan 1967 thru Mar 1970.The other three he is a 1st Lt and two dated in Nov and last dated in Dec.

 

The Joint SOC Basic Qual Course cert (dated 5 Nov 1969) has the AFSOC patch on it that did not come about till around 1990

 

post-5041-1258854577.jpg

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So he got promoted to 2nd LT from SSGT without having a single Good Conduct medal.

 

Fascinating!

 

:think:

 

Dave

 

Dave,

 

Stick around. You ain't seen nothing yet!

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First 3 are dated 1970,last one is 1971. First one is for Allied Forces Terrorist Tac Team and dated Jan 1970. Same AFSOC patch on this one also. Second and third he is a 1st Lt and are for the High Risk & Personal Sec Course and other for basic UDT/SEAL training.Last one he is now a Capt and has completed the Marine Corp Combat Diver Course in nearby Panama City Fl. I am going to ask them anout this one if I can find the right office.

 

post-5041-1258855290.jpg

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First one is Nov 1971 as a 1st Lt for the Mountain Leaders Course class 21-71. Next two are 1972 dated and he is back to a 1st Lt. One for Joint Spec Ops Leadrs Course and one authorizing him to wear the Sec of Def ID badge.

 

post-5041-1258855665.jpg

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I like these ones. All 1973 dated first two from Feb. and one he is a 1st Lt,other he has made Major. In March he is back to a Capt and in July he is back to a 1st Lt.

 

post-5041-1258855956.jpg

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Last four. Thanks for sticking around Dave!

 

1983 (first two) he is up to Lt Col. Last two (1991 & 92) he is Col.

 

Will post some more stuff tomorrow.

 

Steve

 

post-5041-1258856362.jpg

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Stinger Gunner USMC

With all of those schools and courses completed, when did he have time to go into combat and get all those medals? :rolleyes:

 

This has got to be the most elaborate case of stolen valor i've ever seen! It might be worth getting ahold of the folks at www.pownetwork.com. They contain a massive database of the disgusting and honorless individuals who have commited such acts

 

unfortunatly, almost every one of those citations, and certificates can be bought at expresscitations.com and numerous other sites including on ebay.

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Wow - I'm in awe! This guy had some serious time and creativity on his hands!

 

I wonder where he got the templates for these certificates? As far as I know, there are no certificates for the National Defense Service Medal or Armed Forces Expeditionary Medal. Unless, of course, I got jipped when I got mine... :pinch:

 

Dave

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Wow - I'm in awe! This guy had some serious time and creativity on his hands!

 

I wonder where he got the templates for these certificates? As far as I know, there are no certificates for the National Defense Service Medal or Armed Forces Expeditionary Medal. Unless, of course, I got jipped when I got mine... :pinch:

 

Dave

 

Ditto on those certificates not existing Dave!

 

MW

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