market garden Posted June 7, 2008 #26 Posted June 7, 2008 Here is a photo of my father who was a CFC gunner on B-29 bombers stationed in Savana Ga. in 1952 He tells me that when he enlisted in 1951 they had the brown issue uniforms also given to them. Here he wears kakis and a blue tie. ( His gunner wings are WW2 issued pin backed)Market garden I have several other photos of him and his friends wearing fatigue uniforms of the period. Also one of him in his gun turret(in color). That photo could pass as WW2. Ill dig them out. Market garden If you desire to see great post war Airforce uniform photos get the following movies. The Big Lift. with Montgomery Cliff. About the Berlin blockade. and Strategic Air Command with Jimmy Stuart. In this movie He makes the comment "When I was in before we wore the brown uniform". when he gets "Challenged" by a AP in a blue uniform at a airbase Market garden
gwb123 Posted July 13, 2008 #29 Posted July 13, 2008 Once upon a time, about 15 years ago, there were about 3 people in the US collecting USAF fatigue uniforms. I was one of them, and the other two were the ones who occaisionally bid against me at Manion's. There just was not a whole lot of interest in them. Most of them probably had their patches removed and then donated to base thrift shops and Goodwill. (The USAF thrift shop at Hickam used to put them out for three weeks and then donate them to the Civil Air Patrol). Here are some selections from my former collection: 1) 27th Fighter Squadron Missile Maintenance technician. Note the yellow nametape with the stenciled lettering. As I recall it was made of a reinforced cloth of some type, like some kind of strapping material. Also note there is no USAF tape. I am guessing this is from the 1950's. Note the brown plastic buttons. 2) A very poor picture of an Asian made fatigue shirt with a Japanese made Neko Nomad unit patch. The name tape is large and white and had four lines of information including the owners first and last name, his duty station, a full line in Japanese and his unit. Note the added pen pocket on the left sleeve. This one I believe came from Manion's auction and is also most likely from the 1950's. 3) An interesting shirt from the 49th Fighter Interceptor Squadron. The F106 Delta Dart patch is quite striking. If you look closely at the left sleeve you will see the shadow of a much higher NCO rank. Most likely this shirt was recycled for use by another airman. Early 1960s? 4) At first this shirt with the MAC patch looks fairly ordinary... until you realize that the wing is for a pilot and not an enlisted Airman. Mistake? Or a retread officer? Also note the reflective flight line tape on the sleeves to increase visibility during darkness. If you look at the inside center of the shirt, you will see that the flight line tape was also sewn on the back as well. 5) USAF field jacket, similar to the M-65 but notice the difference in the collar. Note the large TAC pocket patch. But the neatest thing about this jacket is again the use of the reflective flight line tape, both on the front and back. I took this out at night and shined a light on it, and it lit up like neon. This was quite used. 1960s? 6) A standard issue OG-107 cotton fatigue shirt with direct embroidered rank and pilot wing, as well as name and USAF tapes. As I recall it could have been embroidered in either Thailand or Vietnam. This is most likely from early in the Vietnam War. 7) Sometimes uniforms from this period had a bare minimum of insignia. This is an Asian embroidered Air Commando tab on a starched cotton OG-107 fatigue shirt. Other than name, rank and USAF there was never any other insignia on the uniform. I believe I pulled this out of the Hickam AFB thrift shop in the 1980's. 8) Another example of bare minimum insignia: The qualification badge is beautifully hand embroidered, most likely from Thailand. It is hard to tell from the photo, but the blue background of this insignia is a very richly dyed deep blue. Also hard to tell is that the name SKINNER is actually very closely chain stitched. And also, look how closely trimmed the 1st LT rank is.... this is not direct embroidered but very tightly sewn on without the blue border. The USAF tape is standard issue. This was a Salvation Army find on Oahu. 9) Asian made fatigue shirt on display at the museum of RECON Militaria, in Dallas TX (now currently in storage). The rank and pilot wing are direct embroidered, and the USAF tape is hand embroidered. Note the added sleeve pocket in a slightly different shade of material. The Asian dyed thread has faded slightly to provide an outline of the shirt. Note the small size buttons. The Air Commando Squadron pocket patch is Thai made. 10) Another Thai made fatigue shirt featuring a pocket patch for the 553rd RECON Sq. and its associated wing. This unit flew EC-123, electronic monitoring versions of the Constellation. Note the light weight material, which is one reason such uniforms were favore. The name and USAF are custom embroidered and the wing may have been as well. Again note the small sized buttons. I believe this was purchased through Manion's auction at a price far below the value of the patches sewn to it. That was true about uniforms for a long time.... you could pick them up cheaper than the patches because nobody wanted to store them. As one collector told me "you cannot fit a fatigue shirt into a notebook binder!" 11) Jumping forward in time, one of my favorite uniforms. This would have been for an Air Liaison Officer attached to a unit of the 1ST CAV Division. This uniform is hard to date. The material looks like the synthetic introduced in the 1970's. This shirt was probably not worn during the Vietnam War, but immediately after it. While Airmen and Officers wore subdued insignia in theater (Vietnam, Korea, Thailand, PI), I believe they continued to wear full color insignia in the US until the mid 1970's.
Wailuna Posted July 13, 2008 #30 Posted July 13, 2008 ...A very poor picture of an Asian made fatigue shirt...Note the added pen pocket on the left sleeve... This A2C has pen pockets on both sleeves. He is in Korea, 1954, and his fatigues appear to be issue (note the metal button rivet on his right lapel near his t-shirt) -- the pockets are obviously local add-ons and there is no sign of a name tag here: More of the same Airman showing Fifth AF SSI and period-appropriate ribbons on long-sleeve khakis (with scarf!) and AF Ike (on board a troopship headed home -- note soldiers and maybe a Marine in the background):
Bob Hudson Posted August 4, 2008 Author #31 Posted August 4, 2008 I'm continuing to go through a 100-lb collection of photos, documents, etc. from a US Air Force Lt. Col. who started out as a fighter pilot in WWII (see http://www.usmilitariaforum.com/forums/ind...showtopic=23762 ). One album has a bunch of photos from McGuire Air Force Base in 1951: and some are nice examples of the early Air Force uniforms. This first is interesting because the visiting Major General is still wearing his old Army Air Force cap while everyone else has gone to Air Force blue: Here are some MP's, also in 1951, decked out for a ceremony welcoming some VIP's from Belgium: And I think this was taken during a wing parade:
Wailuna Posted August 4, 2008 #32 Posted August 4, 2008 Here is a copy of the 1948 USAF directive covering enlisted insignia during early transitional period
Bob Hudson Posted August 4, 2008 Author #33 Posted August 4, 2008 Here is a copy of the 1948 USAF directive covering enlisted insignia during early transitional period (source: Air University Enlisted Heritage Hall -- link here). Thanks for that. It's interesting to read about the gold buttons, collar and cap insignia then. After looking at those images of the collar insignia I decided that if I did an ebay search I'd find some US Air Force insignia labeled as WWII AAF or Air Corps. Sure enough, when I did a keyword search for air corps pin one of the first listings was for this group labeled as "WWII Army Air Corps Pins" - of course as those regulation show, the US and propeller surrounded by circles are post-WWII US Air Force:
aclfan Posted September 4, 2008 #34 Posted September 4, 2008 Thanks for that. It's interesting to read about the gold buttons, collar and cap insignia then. After looking at those images of the collar insignia I decided that if I did an ebay search I'd find some US Air Force insignia labeled as WWII AAF or Air Corps. Sure enough, when I did a keyword search for air corps pin one of the first listings was for this group labeled as "WWII Army Air Corps Pins" - of course as those regulation show, the US and propeller surrounded by circles are post-WWII US Air Force: This reference has helped me as well. One of our museum volunteers was in the AAF Training Command in 1945, then called back up in Korea. He wore three different Ike jackets - WWII OD, AF OD and AF Blue. He gave me his OD jackets, and donated his blue uniforms to another local museum. Both jackets were missing collar insignias. I knew about the WWII one, but not the transition. I had a set of the brass transition pieces in my collection, but thought they were WWII era aviation cadet! I am now looking for a set of period US pewter ringed collar pins for a blue AF Ike jacket I later obtained. Most of what is on ebay are more modern. Does anyone have an extra set they could part with?
aclfan Posted September 4, 2008 #35 Posted September 4, 2008 Thanks for that. It's interesting to read about the gold buttons, collar and cap insignia then. After looking at those images of the collar insignia I decided that if I did an ebay search I'd find some US Air Force insignia labeled as WWII AAF or Air Corps. Sure enough, when I did a keyword search for air corps pin one of the first listings was for this group labeled as "WWII Army Air Corps Pins" - of course as those regulation show, the US and propeller surrounded by circles are post-WWII US Air Force: I forgot to mention that I will post photos after I replace the collar brass. I also have his khaki colored AF shirts to go along with the OD Ike, with full training command patches and rank. He just filled 2 duffle bage full of gear and gave one to me and the other to a co-worker. I got most of the post-WWII AF stuff and he got the WWII stuff, which I already had most of in my collection.
jim2 Posted September 4, 2008 #36 Posted September 4, 2008 Heres a photo I found on the net. Notice the Para wings & the CIB.
Wailuna Posted September 4, 2008 #37 Posted September 4, 2008 ...Notice the Para wings & the CIB.... And placement of the ROK PUC over the left pocket with the U.S. DUC over the right pocket. Most 1950s USAF pictures I have seen show all unit awards over the right pocket, whereas Army practice in the 1950s was foreign unit awards on the left pocket flap and the U.S. DUC only over the right pocket. Eventually, all USAF unit awards ended up over the left pocket and all Army unit awards ended up over the right pocket. This TSgt. seems to have straddled the fence with his unit awards. Great picture, jim2, thanks for posting it here.
Wailuna Posted September 14, 2008 #38 Posted September 14, 2008 Here are official pictures of Col. Edward W. "Jonesy" Szaniawski previously posted elsewhere by Forum Support (and added here with his permission ~~ link here). The bottom pictures are dated Dec. 6, 1955 (left) and Aug. 3, 1961(right), which give useful reference points for dating USAF transition era wear of DUC over the right pocket (Army practice) vs. over left pocket (current USAF practice). The exact date that the DUC migrated from right to left side of USAF uniforms has never been published on the Forum but is usually stated as "late 1950s" or "early 1960s" ~~ Col. Szaniawski's 1961 picture supports the later dating, although there might have been a lengthy "wear-out" period for existing right-side DUCs (and maybe especially for crusty old war heroes).
seanmc1114 Posted September 19, 2008 #39 Posted September 19, 2008 Here is a copy of the 1948 USAF directive covering enlisted insignia during early transitional period (source: Air University Enlisted Heritage Hall -- link here). [/center] I never realized that the Air Force actually had Privates First Class and Corporals. However, now that I think about it, there was a scene in "No Time For Sergeants", which I believe came out in 1957, where Don Knotts' character was referred to as a corporal. That was a great movie and I think that was the first time he and Andy Griffith worked together.
Bob Hudson Posted September 19, 2008 Author #40 Posted September 19, 2008 Here is a copy of the 1948 USAF directive covering enlisted insignia during early transitional period... Here's a couple of 1949 pattern Air Force uniforms I picked up today. The Ike jacket has the type of chevrons shown in the 1948 directive - it is s 1951 jacket. The blue dress coat was made apparently in 1949, but has the later style chevrons. Notice that this coat fastens with a zipper and snaps: And here's the blue dress coat: The thrift store where I got these also had a 1949 pattern overcoat but at $35 it was overpriced.
Bluehawk Posted September 19, 2008 #42 Posted September 19, 2008 5) USAF field jacket, similar to the M-65 but notice the difference in the collar. Note the large TAC pocket patch. But the neatest thing about this jacket is again the use of the reflective flight line tape, both on the front and back. I took this out at night and shined a light on it, and it lit up like neon. This was quite used. 1960s? That's the one we were issued in 1964 I believe... the collar was a hood pocket. Very useful on a flightline.
seanmc1114 Posted September 19, 2008 #43 Posted September 19, 2008 This photo is seen in various places on the web and it's one of my favorite USAF photos: the 1956 summer uniform: Check out the expressions of the guys walking by in the back of the picture. I guess they are staring at how ridiculous the two grown men walking by in khaki shorts and long socks look. To me, this uniform just worked against every image the military has always tried to portray through its uniforms. I wonder if anyone who might have worn this uniform can comment on its comfort and practicality.
Bob Hudson Posted September 19, 2008 Author #44 Posted September 19, 2008 Check out the expressions of the guys walking by in the back of the picture. I guess they are staring at how ridiculous the two grown men walking by in khaki shorts and long socks look. To me, this uniform just worked against every image the military has always tried to portray through its uniforms. I wonder if anyone who might have worn this uniform can comment on its comfort and practicality. I had found a couple of comments elsewhere on the web from guys who were in the USAF then and it sounds like the only ones who ever wore it were the guys forced to put it on for photo sessions.
aclfan Posted September 20, 2008 #45 Posted September 20, 2008 Here is a copy of the 1948 USAF directive covering enlisted insignia during early transitional period (source: Air University Enlisted Heritage Hall -- link here). I found what looks like the transitional gold hat badge that has clutch back pins rather than a center screw post. Would the hat badge have stayed on with clutch back pins?
Wailuna Posted September 20, 2008 #46 Posted September 20, 2008 ...I found what looks like the transitional gold hat badge that has clutch back pins rather than a center screw post... Most likely this is a case of mistaken identity. The USAF gold colored service cap insignia has been thoroughly kicked around in this topic and others but the two-pin and clutch-back version has never been attributed to USAF wear. This insignia was identified elsewhere on the Forum as being an authorized insignia for Army enlisted women (probably on the woman's black beret in use ca. 1975 - 1984). Link here and also see Emerson: Encyclopedia of U.S. Army Insignia and Uniforms, p 554.
aclfan Posted September 20, 2008 #47 Posted September 20, 2008 Most likely this is a case of mistaken identity. The USAF gold colored service cap insignia has been thoroughly kicked around in this topic and others but the two-pin and clutch-back version has never been attributed to USAF wear. This insignia was identified elsewhere on the Forum as being an authorized insignia for Army enlisted women (probably on the woman's black beret in use ca. 1975 - 1984). Link here and also see Emerson: Encyclopedia of U.S. Army Insignia and Uniforms, p 554. Thanks for the information. Now I know what to look for.
DutchInfid3l Posted September 27, 2008 #48 Posted September 27, 2008 Here are a few of my recent purchases... These are from the same airman Michael J. Dupay. 15 May 1946- 30 Apr 2008 Request for military record pending. Sateen uniform dated 1969 Winter weight wool uniform with flight cap dated 1969 Summer weight polyester uniform dated 1968 with wool service cap dated 1968 with rain cover Wool overcoat dated 1968 Aviation Cadet uniform, various course papers and items from A/C Stanley E. Petersen Class 51-H Randolph Field, TX Ike style wool uniform dated May 2, 1949 with flight cap, mini officer cap badge and student name tag. Course notebooks, address books, Compass Headings cadet handbook, January 12, 1951 San Antonio newspaper, T-6 Student Checklist
Bluehawk Posted September 27, 2008 #49 Posted September 27, 2008 Looks like Dupay's Airman Basic fatigue shirt was during his Air Training Command assignment. Wonder what he did in that Command... probably ca. 1963-68 or so.
DutchInfid3l Posted September 28, 2008 #50 Posted September 28, 2008 Looks like Dupay's Airman Basic fatigue shirt was during his Air Training Command assignment. Wonder what he did in that Command... probably ca. 1963-68 or so. On his shirt I see an outline of an airman stripe, so hopefully I'll get his records info and get the chance to see.
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