Dirk Posted May 12, 2007 Share #1 Posted May 12, 2007 All: Here is a cap for consideration....No contract stamp visible, but the leather liner is in rough condition and some stamps are light and sink in over time into the leather...like my faint contract stamp on my 1916 Bell Crown. The EGA is usual in it self, the wear on the hat tells me the band and the EGAs have been on for a long time....the buttons are held by rings vice screw posts....all heavy with verdigris. Buckle/leather slider vice leather sliders, so if good before 1904. Also will attach several pictures of early hats for comparison. The hat's height bothers me but it did suffer crush damage. Also note the visor does not slope down like known marine caps after 1904. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dirk Posted May 12, 2007 Author Share #2 Posted May 12, 2007 The buckle Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dirk Posted May 12, 2007 Author Share #3 Posted May 12, 2007 With the EGA removed...note a anchor fluke rested between both chin strap Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dirk Posted May 12, 2007 Author Share #4 Posted May 12, 2007 Behind the chin strap....found insect remains....whatever this hat turns out to be, the strap has been there for a while. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dirk Posted May 12, 2007 Author Share #5 Posted May 12, 2007 The rings holding the side buttons...lots of crust Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dirk Posted May 12, 2007 Author Share #6 Posted May 12, 2007 With the EGA removed.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dirk Posted May 12, 2007 Author Share #7 Posted May 12, 2007 For comparision..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dirk Posted May 12, 2007 Author Share #8 Posted May 12, 2007 Not the best picture....side buttons are marked "Horstmann Philada" they are 1/4' in diameter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobgee Posted May 12, 2007 Share #9 Posted May 12, 2007 Not the best picture....side buttons are marked "Horstmann Philada" they are 1/4' in diameter Nice cover, Dirk. I'm thinking it's about 1890 or there abouts. It has great age patina. Great find. Bob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brig Posted May 12, 2007 Share #10 Posted May 12, 2007 nice find Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
teufelhunde.ret Posted May 12, 2007 Share #11 Posted May 12, 2007 All: Here is a cap for consideration....No contract stamp visible, but the leather liner is in rough condition and some stamps are light and sink in over time into the leather...like my faint contract stamp on my 1916 Bell Crown. The EGA is usual in it self, the wear on the hat tells me the band and the EGAs have been on for a long time....the buttons are held by rings vice screw posts....all heavy with verdigris. Buckle/leather slider vice leather sliders, so if good before 1904. Also will attach several pictures of early hats for comparison. The hat's height bothers me but it did suffer crush damage. Also note the visor does not slope down like known marine caps after 1904. Thank you for sharing this wonderful period original with us. Let me know if you ever decide to part with the EAG Best regards; Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dirk Posted May 12, 2007 Author Share #12 Posted May 12, 2007 Thanks guys! Darrell that EGA is an odd one....still not sure of the date.....we really need to see the uniform regs/quartermaster notes for this early stuff. Jeremiah reminded me of this image...the trumpter seems to have a similar shaped hat...have seen several other images from this period and looks like 2-3 diffrent styles being worn...some more like the traditional bell crown....some with stiff crown, others liek this more loose...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobgee Posted May 12, 2007 Share #13 Posted May 12, 2007 Dirk.....Please post the side buttons and some pics of the emblem front & back.Thanks Semper Fi! Bob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dirk Posted May 12, 2007 Author Share #14 Posted May 12, 2007 Bob: Not 100% clear but the best I could do quickly.....doomed 1/4 inch button...Horstmann marked Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GLM Posted May 12, 2007 Share #15 Posted May 12, 2007 Dirk: This cover is one of the best examples I have seen. It absolutely wreaks of authenticity. If you notice, not only does the chinstrap show where the fluke rested for beaucoup years as you've pointed out, the eagle's head imprint on the cover matches exactly the head on your EGA. I'm confident that the EGA and side buttons have been on this cover forever, thus, no doubts or questions about the originality of the cover. IMHO, it's a super sweet cover and a very nice find for you! Congratulations! Gary Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dirk Posted May 13, 2007 Author Share #16 Posted May 13, 2007 Gary: Thanks for the and for the long discussions on this one. If this guy is good, Chenoworth's book shows that group picture with Murphy....several of the Marines appear to be wearing this short style along side a higher framed model. I guess we can then say there is more than one model between the 1890's and 1912....from my photos the buckle disappears around 1905 to be replaced by double sliders and the hat rises in height after 1900, so by 1908 it almost looks like the 1912 bell crown we all know. Dirk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
teufelhunde.ret Posted May 13, 2007 Share #17 Posted May 13, 2007 Thanks to all for this information and pictures, this truly helps in understanding the period uniform wear. Dirk when you have the opportunity; the front AND reverse of this emblem needs to be posted in the EGA reference section. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dirk Posted May 13, 2007 Author Share #18 Posted May 13, 2007 A final shot of the full side. Dan most likely the reason you only see buckles on one side in the USS Brooklyn SC is personal preference. I've got a ships photo in which 17 out of 20 have adjusted their straps with the buckle on the right side while the remaining three have theirs on the left. I always suspected there was some type of a change to the cap around 1904....the photos I've been able to gather pointed to that. Now the true test will be when we can ID a makers cap based on the style we see in photo....I think around 1900 another maker was out there producing a cap with elements closer to the bell crown than mine....now about dating that EGA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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