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Blued bayonets rusting, HELP!


Blake_E
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Hey all, to my shock horror today, i dipped inside my cabinet to grab something out, and noticed on two bayonets i have, that the blued scabbard that one is in (and the handle on the other) had appeared to have just started rusting. Although it was the oddest type of rust i have ever seen. Thickish looking, but just wiped off like dust, with no real attachment to the piece at all. Scared the guocamole out of me! Question is, how on earth do i stop it? One has actual, proper 60+year age rust on it, that isnt coming off, and is very very very tiny. The other has basically none. And all of a sudden, this really light dusty coating comes out of nowhere! What do i do? Can i, or should i be wiping them over with a silicone rag (like is used for blued guns after handling)? If i did, obviously, i should not let this anywhere near the leather of a scabbard? Another odd thing i found, was ON the leather scabbard, in tiny little places, not in crevices, but RIGHT on the surface, were strange looking dabs of white powder! Like flour, just a tad thicker. Again, they just wiped right away (some i could even just lightly blow off, as a testament to their, 'just sitting there' look). I guess i'm basically just asking, how on earth can i take care of these?! I've never had this happen before, to any of my other leather, or blued gun pieces?! Something that i took a strange note of, was that, these pieces are on the BOTTOM of my glass cabinet. Every row or level above them, has a glass bottom, whereas the level they are sitting on, has that vinyled over, covered wood finish, being the base of the cabinet. Could it be some type of finish on the vinyl that these are sitting on, ruining them?!

Cheers in advance, a very shocked and thankful he got to them in time Blake :unsure: :think:

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It would be interesting to see photos of this stuff.

 

That vinyl could be a culprit: there is a thing called PVC outgassing corrosion in which corrosion is caused by chlorine that outgasses from PVC and forms hydrochloric acid in the presence of humid air. I would start by getting rid of the vinyl and putting some desiccant in the case (see http://www.agmcontainer.com/desiccantcity/index.htm?utm_id=5 ). If the case doors close pretty tightly, I would think that it might be a good idea to leave them open for awhile in order to clear the air and perhaps even wipe down the shelves (plain old water is always a safe bet).

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I agree with the other post and suggest using a microcrystaline product like Rennaisance Wax to preserve them. It is expensive, but very easy to use as you wipe it on then off again and it will remove the surface rust usually. Then it leaves a very thin barrier between the metal and the air.

Capa

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Captainofthe7th

Gun Oil should work, too. This not only protects metal and wood finishes, but removes rust. I was just out this weekend shooting my M1 at a very wet, very muddy reenactment. After the battle the next morning, my rifle was caked with mud/dirt/debris and spots of rust (still worked though, good old M1!). A good field strip, toothbrush, rag, and oil, and it is perfect now. If gun oil can do that for the M1, it'll work on the bayonet.

 

Rob

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Thanks for the suggestions guys. The cabinet isnt completely air sealed, so they can steal breathe, i'll grab some pics if it happens again.

This Rennaisance Wax, how much is it, and how exactly does it work, just wipe on and wipe straight off? Will it hurt leather or any other type of materials?

I thought about gun oil, but am not really too fond of the smell (where these pieces are). So you guys don't recommend i use or try a silicon rag?

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Thanks for the suggestions guys. The cabinet isnt completely air sealed, so they can steal breathe, i'll grab some pics if it happens again.

This Rennaisance Wax, how much is it, and how exactly does it work, just wipe on and wipe straight off? Will it hurt leather or any other type of materials?

I thought about gun oil, but am not really too fond of the smell (where these pieces are). So you guys don't recommend i use or try a silicon rag?

 

Oil traps dust.

 

I'd suggest taking a look at this article for some tried and tested advice on gun conservation: http://www.nps.gov/spar/historyculture/guncare.htm

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The Meatcan

you probably need to check for a source of moisture. My basement had a minor flood a couple years ago and shortly thereafter I noticed some black leather ammo pouches had developed the very same white powdery surface crud as you mentioned. After the typical mopup operation was over I made sure there were plenty of those little dessicant packets stored with the gear. The problem has never returned.

Good luck and keep us posted on your results.

Terry

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Oil traps dust.

 

I'd suggest taking a look at this article for some tried and tested advice on gun conservation: http://www.nps.gov/spar/historyculture/guncare.htm

My guns and other edged weapons are fine, it's just this bayonet pair driving me bonkers :P But good read, some great info :) I've just never had to do anything to my knives or bayos, other than just leaving them and dusting once in a while :ermm:

Terry, moisture huh? It IS winter here at the moment. Could the metal pieces of the scabbard and hangaurd be getting so cold they are literally, moisture frosting up, so to speak, like a car does out in the weather?

Well i'll just be damned, what is going on here, i checked on them again today, and noticed a shelf level up, a Normandy dug airborne parachute hook i have, is literally bleeding some kind of bubbly crystalline looking substance, that when touched, has the consistency and look of yellow oil. Another buckle right next to it, same place, same dig, same time, same covering (they were treated with some kind of lacquer when i got them) has nothing at all. This is just too creepy weird, what the hell is going on! :blink: Just hang guys, will get some pics in the morning :think:

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I agree with the other post and suggest using a microcrystaline product like Rennaisance Wax to preserve them. It is expensive, but very easy to use as you wipe it on then off again and it will remove the surface rust usually. Then it leaves a very thin barrier between the metal and the air.

Capa

^ That's it. It nearly always works best.

 

Some years ago (maybe 20?) Chevron Petroleum made a product called simply "Rust-Ban"... a very thin industrial liquid preservative for all metals exposed to rust conditions.

 

I've meant to mention this in the past, but had forgotten the product name.

 

To give some idea of how good it was, you could expose a mild steel or bronze to the outdoors for a year without seeing any corrosion of any kind... and if a place did get started, it would be neutralized instantly by a light application.

 

Don't know if Rust-Ban is still made, but microcrystalline wax is pretty much infallible in any case.

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Just google Rennaisance Wax and you should be able to find it easily. It really is worth the investment. I know that Gaylord sells it. It is supposedly safe for leather as well.

Bluehawk-are you in the museum field too?

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Cool, i'll give it a research :)

Here's some pics i took. The first one is the glass cabinet bottom. The 2nd is the vinyled wood bottom where they were sitting. The next is a piece of unrusted bluing. Then where the dust rust has sat. Just a simple wipe, even lightly with a finger, and it comes RIGHT off

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post-3398-1248282736.jpg

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Thats just the impurities of the steel/iron/whatever the hook is made of. As it oxidizes (rusts) and reacts with moisture certain weaker/more susceptible areas weaken. All dug/burried/underwater iron based items do this. Unless you can get near an electrolysis machine your best bets are oil or some kind of varnish....Dont crack off bubbles or anything as the metal is incredibly weak (not just on the surface), I've had some really nice pieces break in half just trying to make them more identifiable/presentable. Last thing you want is a dug "pile of rust" from Normandy.

Probably should invest in a dehumidifier...

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Just google Rennaisance Wax and you should be able to find it easily. It really is worth the investment. I know that Gaylord sells it. It is supposedly safe for leather as well.

Bluehawk-are you in the museum field too?

Retired, after 35+ years as a curator.

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Just ordered myself some Renaissance Wax, will give it a whirl. The general word is that it's THE stuff to use, especially on edged items, so hopefully it'll be great :) Will just try it on a little piece first, just to be sure :)

Cheers

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