Corsair Fuselage Markings?? ACE

[marineamtracer]

Hey guys I haven't had time to get the photo scanned yet but I thought I would get the question out there anyway. Yesterday I recieved a lot of pics from the old eBay and I'm trying to figure out who one of the aircraft was flown by. The photo shows the canopy and partial fuselage of a Corsair with the marking F-55 under the canopy as well as 7 Japanese flag victory markers. There is an enlisted sailor sitting in the cockpit and the only portion of the pilots name I can read is Capt. the rest is too blury. So can anyone tell me who this ace was? From the looks of the other photos it would seem that the sailor who took them was with a repair and maitnence unit of some type. Several of the other airframes appear to be being scraped as well. Lots of shots of torn town radial engines mostly from Catalinas. Let me know what you guys think!

[marineamtracer]

Just realized that I mis-typed....the marking on the fuselage is actually F-75

[marineamtracer]

here is the photo

[Bob Hudson]

I saw something from another squadron which had EE and then a two-digit number beneath the cockpit, but everything else I see has just a number. As for number of kills: well he could have gotten more after the photo was taken so you can't necessarily pin it down by looking for an ace with seven skills.

[marineamtracer]

I had seen the same EE markings that you mentioned and as I recall they were from a VMF squadron but which one escapes me right now. As for the seven kills....I am assuming that based on the apparent tear down of all the other airframes that were photographed in the lot that this was after the aircraft in question was released from service. That is only a guess however....and you could be correct as well.

[316th FS 324th FG]

Another thought - I have seen ETO aircraft that had kills marked on the fuselage for what were probable kills, but not ultimately credited as confirmed kills. So, there is the possibility, if there were similar patterns in the Navy, that 7 was his unofficial, but may not be corroboratable (sp?)

[marineamtracer]

That's really interesting. I didn't know that they would paint on probables. So I guess the direction I need to go with this is to focus on the F-75 but so far google is letting me down! :think:

[Chris_B]

Are you guys sure you saw "EE"? I've seen "FF"...

 

I am going to guess that this photo is of an F4U with kill marks returned to the States late war (because of the national insignia), and re-numbered. I know that MCAS Cherry Point had F4Us with "F-" markings in '44, but that doesn't necessarily mean this plane was at Cherry Point just due to the F-, but my recollection is that I've only ever seen these planes with this type of marking when they were in the US.

 

The planes with the FF I have seen photos of were carrier based...USS Cape Glouster?

[Bob Hudson]

Are you guys sure you saw "EE"? I've seen "FF"...

 

I am going to guess that this photo is of an F4U with kill marks returned to the States late war (because of the national insignia), and re-numbered. I know that MCAS Cherry Point had F4Us with "F-" markings in '44, but that doesn't necessarily mean this plane was at Cherry Point just due to the F-, but my recollection is that I've only ever seen these planes with this type of marking when they were in the US.

 

The planes with the FF I have seen photos of were carrier based...USS Cape Glouster?

 

I think you have hit the nail on the head: aviation artist Mark Styling has some great illustrations at http://www.markstyling.com/F4U_5.htm and it shows Corsair "F-107" as being at "VMF-224, MCAS Cherry Point, NC" 1944" and " FF59" with "VMF-351, USS Cape Gloucester, July 1945"

 

The only VMF-224 Corsair ace I can find is George L. Hollowell with 8 kills (see http://www.acepilots.com/usmc_aces_list.html ) but his was Corsair 108 and looked like this:

 

[Bob Hudson]

Okay, Marine Corsair 75 was flown by Maj Robert G Owens of VMF-215 who got seven kills. He served as CO of the squadron.

 

Here's a photo of him becoming the first Corsair to land on Munda in the Solomons in 1943.

 

 

 

"Major General Robert Gordon Owens, Jr., 90, a decorated Marine Corps aviator, died October 31 at his Boulder home in Fraser Meadows Retirement Community, where he had lived with his wife since 2003.

 

Born February 13, 1917, in Greenville, SC, he earned a B.A. degree from Furman University in 1938. Following graduation, he enlisted in the Marine Corps and began a distinguished 33-year military career, receiving several medals and decorations, including the Navy Cross.

 

Upon graduation from flight training in Pensacola, Fla., he was commissioned a Marine second lieutenant in 1940. Before reporting to Hawaii for duty, he proposed to his hometown sweetheart, Marjorie Frances (Fran) Hart. She joined Owens in Hawaii for their wedding on October 30, 1941. 39 days later, Pearl Harbor was attacked. They survived the war and enjoyed 66 years of marriage, joined by two sons: Robert III, and Stanley.

 

After Pearl Harbor, Owens led aerial combat in the Solomon Islands, New Georgia, and Bismarck Archipelago areas, earning the Navy Cross, the Distinguished Flying Cross with four Gold Stars, and the Air Medal with two Silver Stars. In January 1944, he earned the Purple Heart for wounds received in action over Rabaul in the South Pacific. Although injured, he successfully landed his crippled plane in the ocean, where a rescue plane picked him up. He was designated a Marine Corps ace after shooting down seven enemy planes during World War II.

 

When asked about his life-threatening missions, Owens was known to give a philosophical reply in his southern drawl, "When you're the leader, you have to be brave. The choice isn't up to you."

 

Following WWII, he served in various capacities and locations, including a number of educational assignments. These included the Air War College at Maxwell Air Force Base, Ala., helicopter flight training in Tustin, Calif., and the National War College in Washington, D.C. Colonel Owens received his Master's degree in International Relations from George Washington University in 1964. In August of that year, he was assigned to the Joint Staff of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, where he was awarded the first of his five Legions of Merit.

 

Subsequently, Brigadier General Owens was ordered to the Republic of Vietnam, where he served as the Chief of Staff, III Marine Amphibious Force. Upon return to the United States, he again served at Headquarters Marine Corps as Assistant Chief of Staff and was promoted to major general, September 1, 1968. In 1969, he was an honorary pallbearer at President Dwight D. Eisenhower's funeral. General Owens' last two Marine Corps postings were as commanding officer of the Third Marine Air Wing in El Toro, Calif., and as commanding officer of the First Marine Air Wing in Japan.

 

Upon retirement from the military August 1, 1972, Owens and his wife settled in Newport Beach, Calif., where he pursued a career in real estate. He enjoyed playing golf and raising orchids. Quite the horticulturist, he built two greenhouses and outfitted them with automatic sprinklers and temperature control systems. A well-respected neighbor and citizen, he was president of the Rotary Club of Newport Beach."

[Bob Hudson]

There's a nice long bio of Brig. General Owens here: http://www.arlingtoncemetery.net/rgowens.htm

[marineamtracer]

Thanks a million everyone! I knew that if I posted this question here someone would figure out the answer! Here is a shot taken at Santa Barbara of a VMF512 F4U with the large EE markings. They eventually went aboard USS Gilbert Islands in March of 45. Thanks again everyone!

[Bob Hudson]

Thanks a million everyone! I knew that if I posted this question here someone would figure out the answer! Here is a shot taken at Santa Barbara of a VMF512 F4U with the large EE markings.

 

And it appears to me that perhaps each Marine Corps Air Station had a one or two letter code: F for Cherry Point, EE for Santa Barbara and maybe EF for El Toro this Corsair belonged to VMF-213):

 

[Chris_B]

Thanks a million everyone! I knew that if I posted this question here someone would figure out the answer! Here is a shot taken at Santa Barbara of a VMF512 F4U with the large EE markings. They eventually went aboard USS Gilbert Islands in March of 45. Thanks again everyone!

 

Wow, that's a new one on me! Thanks for the photo

[Segedunum]

Another thought - I have seen ETO aircraft that had kills marked on the fuselage for what were probable kills, but not ultimately credited as confirmed kills. So, there is the possibility, if there were similar patterns in the Navy, that 7 was his unofficial, but may not be corroboratable (sp?)

 

Hi

 

In Europe they allso used kill markings, for shared victories and for enemy aircraft destroyed on the ground.

 

All the best

Snoopy

[Adam Lewis]

And it appears to me that perhaps each Marine Corps Air Station had a one or two letter code: F for Cherry Point, EE for Santa Barbara and maybe EF for El Toro this Corsair belonged to VMF-213):

 

If only it were that simple! I have the 1944 yearbook for MCAS Santa Barbara where several planes are shown from different squadrons. Station codes were not used, in the sense they are today. In large letters painted on the sides of the fuselage:

 

TBMs of VMTB-134 have Nxx

TBMs of VMTB-143 have Pxx

Corsairs of VMF-512 have EExx

Corsairs of VMF-112 have Fxxx (yes, three numbers)

Corsairs of VMF-115 have Sxx

Corsairs of VMF-123 has Txx

 

Altogether Santa Barbara trained 15 VMF squadrons, 10 VMTB squadrons, 4 VMSB squadrons.

 

VMTB-143 kept the Pxx markings during the war but the F4Us and F6Fs of VMF-512 abandoned EExx shortly after deployment. The markings on the USS Gilbert Islands are documented on my site www.adamsplanes.com

 

Adam Lewis