Vintage and somewhat salty NS Meyer Technical Observer wing

[pfrost]

One of the cruel ironies about wing collecting is that perhaps the most prolific badge maker during WWII also has the most "fakes" flooding the collecting market.

 

This is because, sometime in the 1980s or so, NS Meyer was commissioned to make many wings using their original dies (AKA restrikes).  Multiple waves of these restrikes came into the market, but the first wave included the technical observer, airship, and balloon wings.   I suspect that the true number of restrikes produced swamped the number of vintage wings made.

 

As collectors, we have talked (ad nauseam) about the "tells." Sadly, more often than not, when someone posts one of these restrikes on the forum, the news is rarely good.

 

However, once in a blue moon, a good wing can be purchased for a reasonable price.  I believe this is one of those cases, a WWII vintage TO wing made by NS Meyer. You must always be willing to have other people disagree with you regarding NS Meyer. There seems to be an expert for every wing.... LOL. 

 

But for me, this is a good one. It has some wear and tear and a jeweler-made repair on the findings. This takes away a couple of potential tells (the pin and hinge), but I can live with that, especially since the other tells (tiny font STERLING and placement of the hallmark) are spot on for a vintage wing.

 

The Technical Observer wings seem to have been unpopular (they would have been worn by senior flying personnel) and are rarely seen. For me that makes this one even more fun, as the wing has obvious signs of wear, including old sliver polish residue, dings and bangs to the metal and an interesting type hinge repair.

 

 

 

 

 

For an example of one on Bob's site, go here:  https://www.ww2wings.com/wings/usaaf/technicalobserver/meyerto.shtml

 

[pconrad02]

Glad you got this one - I forgot to bid!  🙂

[The Rooster]

Only a few questions. Why would you bother to replace the pin? Considering how cheap these

wings were back in WW2, why go to the trouble of having the pin replaced?

The pin is a major tell of authenticity on good old Meyer wings. Ive also been liking pins that are somewhat bent up from

actually having been worn on a uniform.

The logo placement and sterling are in the right spot. Soft strike on the sterling mark at the end looks like from the pic..

Were the restrike T/O wings made from the original dies?

The back of this one especially compared to the one on Bobs great site, is very soft.

All the details seem there but soft and worn down.

And the front on the left side of the wing has some, what look like bubbles, metal blobs on the wing front?

Almost like casting bubbles?

My two cents. And with the grain of salt that Im a novice still.

[bschwartz]

My two cents, I think this matches very well with the wing that is depicted on my site (which happens to be one in my personal collection) I just think that Patrick's wing has some stories to tell whereas I believe my wing to be a wing that sat out the war on a shelf. The sterling mark is in the proper smaller font and that is sometimes seen with a softer strike. I don't know if it's from the dies wearing out over time or what. You wouldn't think so in this case as there weren't a lot of technical observers in the first place so I can't see them placing a huge order for these like they would for pilot wings. I like the wear on the wear as well. It looks like authentic wear to me. The back looks to have that stippled or almost bead blasted look that is a good sign for authentic Meyer wings. Again, just likely dirty from actual use and a rougher storage life than mine had. I agree with Patrick that this is a good wing.  

[pfrost]

Dave, first and foremost, no worries.  I have sometimes raised my concerns about the wings posted, and you all have been very gracious.   My point has always been if you don't want to hear about it, don't put it on a public thread! (Doing my Kramer voice "Why dont you just TELL me what you want to hear!").  But with NS Meyer wings, THEY ALWAYS cause controversy.  One has to expect that and decide for themselves what level of comfort they have with it being in their collection.  Some will like it, some won't, and most will not care one way or another. I know a dear friend is saying the same thing about this wing as you are.  Never expect consensus.  But since I don't sell my wings, I only amass cases of cases of them...  I can be forgiven.

 

As for some of your questions: 

 

Why bother replacing the pin? 

 

It's was a common occurrence. Replaced pins are a regular sight in the world of military wings, and  I see it all the time. I have wings from WWI that were repaired, WWII repairs obviously done in a machine shop and repairs done by a jeweler.  Someplace I have a wing that was repaired using a safety pin and another that had two tacks glued to the back.

 

Sometimes, the guys were in the theater of operation or away from a PX/uniform supply store or retail shop. We ASSUME that they could drop everything, run to a store, select the latest LGB, Luxenberg, Gaunt, or Coote wing as a replacement, and be on the way to bomb Berlin.  The fact is, many of these guys probably had 1 or 2 wings total. Replacing something like a TO wing would not be that quick or easy, even if they wanted to.  Imagine if you were flying out of Tinian or from a base in North Africa, and your wings got caught on something and were broken.  Your options were limited.  Also, most of these guys were from the Depression and threw away nothing.

 

When evaluating a wing, it's important not to look TOO closely (yes you can be too picky sometimes).  The STERLING mark, for instance, was made using a separate tool and is not integral to the forcer on the die (IMHO). If you look through examples, you'll find that some strikes are cleaner and deeper, and some are less.   But for me, the tell isn't the strike of the sterling mark, it's the font.  Run through the examples on Bob's site and the forum. There are more than a few variations to be seen, but the one constant seems to be that the restrikes have a significantly larger font STERLING mark. Also the wing on Bob's site, has a "pebbly" finish-- but that wing has been polished, unlike mine. Note that the front has a gunky brown residue (likely a shellack).  The one I have has the same peebly finish but its tarnished. That has given it (again IMHO) a less smooth texture.  Also the detail in the NS Meyer shield is the same.  I am having trouble getting a really good picture.

 

A couple of other things that I look for.

 

1) if you are going to repair a restrike to get rid of the BAD pin/hinge, then why replace it with a homemade pin?  And then one that you are going to break anyway? 

2) if you carefully look at the tiny space in the T and the O, you will find residue of silver polishing paste (out of focus, and blown up but you can see it).  Again, fakers dont do that to sell a wing for less than 100$

 

3) I'm having a heck of a time getting a good photo.

 

 

Thanks Bob!  Well said, and not just because you agree with me!  LOL

[pfrost]

This is not a definitive post, but I took a few minutes online to look for what I think are VINTAGE NS Meyer wings.  Images were captured from a number of sources. The source is not what I consider important for the authentication of the wing, but the "tells" that I like to look for.

 

First "GOOD" wings.  Small font STERLING mark, Cammed pin, hinge without those little feet.

 

 

Compare this to NS Meyer restrike examples: Large font STERLING, non-cammed pin, hinge with little feet.

 

 

The NS Hallmark on these is not really a good tell, IMHO.  And the finish and patina can vary considerably. 

 

This is why NS Meyers can be a nightmare in determining authenticity.  But when I look, I ask myself (1) are the tells correct, and (2) is the price reasonable for my budget, and (3) can I live with it knowing that it I could be wrong and it may end up in my box of tears.

[Threewood]

Great find! That pin repair is interesting. Doesn't look like a jeweler repair. It looks made from what the owner had available, wherever he was at the time.

 

I'm not a fan of Meyer wings because of the restrikes, as you stated above. But yours looks like a good one with everything you pointed out.

[jeff41st]

I find it interesting that the non-pelican beak Meyer hallmarked wings seem to all have incised sterling marks. And in at least these two patterns, incised Meyer shield. Additionally, the hallmark placements are inconsistent.

 

Patricks TO wing, as well as the other examples he presented, have incised sterling marks and raised Meyer shields. Also, the placement of the sterling mark and the shield is consistent between those examples.