opinions on ww1 wing

[blind pew]

Any thoughts on this wing?

[blind pew]

Take a CLOSE look at it before rendering an opinion.

[rathbonemuseum.com]

I don't know that i can from these pictures. They were hand hammered.

[pfrost]

What do you think about them?  

[blind pew]

I initially glanced at them and thought they were junk. But then I looked closer and started to like them.

 

i sent the mages to Chris who noted positives and negatives.

 

I used some image enhancement on the reverse and could see what appears to be a silver stamp of Matthews from Newark, NJ. When I get them, I will clean up the back of the shield and see what the text says. 
 

Who knows? It will be more clear in hand. 

[pfrost]

I would tread carefully.  Very carefully around these

 

[KurtA]

23 minutes ago, pfrost said:

I would tread carefully.  Very carefully around these

 

I wouldn't tread around them.  I would drive over them. 

[blind pew]

Concern noted and appreciated. 

 

That is why I decided to purchase them (it was a low price) to examine them more closely in hand. That was all done with the full possibility that they are fake. However, it will be interesting to see them in better detail. 

 

Good- 

die struck, not cast

hammered reverse

gold US

uncommon silver stamp

hand finished front, but not in the style of the faker from AZ

 

Bad-

Relatively crude

C-catch

stars struck, not hand incused (Chris noted that)

Not of identical construction to known wing

 

I think taking a "gamble" on something that is quite unique, as long as the investment is not large, is worth the effort and may yield some new knowledge. I have not seen a fake (I know- big deal) with a hammered reverse like that. It will be fun to examine them in greater detail, one way or another. 

If they are fake, we can have a good laugh about it. 

[blind pew]

2 hours ago, KurtA said:

I wouldn't tread around them.  I would drive over them. 

It all depends on what vehicle is used. I would use my half track, but would not risk puncturing a tire with my woodies!

[pfrost]

This is just my opinion, so taking it with a grain of salt.

 

These types of badges (I am not sure exactly who made them, but several firms seemed to have been using similar techniques, including Sweeny, Eisenstadt, and Homorigous, to name a few) were made from a single sheet of metal that appears to have been hand-worked and chased with various silver working tools (e.g., saws, awls, chisels, etc.). I don't think they were actually die-struck like we typically think of that process.  ALthough it is possible that the general blank shape was first used on a die pattern.

 

This wing doesn't appear to have any of the high quality hand chasing (in fact, it looks cast to me).

 

I am not sure the hammer-back is actually a positive sign. Because the details were not from a die, but rather from the hand chasing and engraving, its not clear why the back would be hammered?  A cynic would say that it was to cover the casting flaws on the back.  Also, why isnt the back of the shield hammered?

 

But to me the ultimate "kiss of death" is this....

 

https://madeinamericansigns.com/products/wwi-aas-moustache-junior-reserve-pilot-wing-sterling

 

Lord Joeldemort strikes again...  HeWhoShallNotBeNamed is selling a similar wing.

 

Sorry buddy but I got to say my opinion on this one is it gives me heartburn.

[blind pew]

That looks pretty bad for the wing!!!!😄 That is hilarious!

 

Well.................... this won't be the first time I've bought a fake. I look at the bright side- it's worth the money as a learning experience!

 

I appreciate the discussion and information. If nothing else, it will be a good addition to the "fake" section. 

[bschwartz]

So is this "Made in America Signs" part of Joe's empire or just a re-seller? There used to be a dealer on eBay that would have young women wearing uniform coats or holding the items apparently meant to entice people into looking at the auction. Most of them looked like hostage photos or proof of life photos and weren't really all that enticing. Not sure if this is the same person but I'm getting that same vibe from the home page.

[blind pew]

Oh well................................ it wasnt the first fake I've bought and will most likely not be the last. 

 

I appreciate the input of everyone and will chalk it up to the cost of an "education"!😄

 

That's one of the several things I like about this site. One can share information and objectively evaluate items without people getting upset or emotionally attached to items. It's refreshing!

[pfrost]

I could be wrong of course.  Once you have them in hand you will be able to tell for sure.

 

P

[blind pew]

On 4/10/2024 at 5:07 PM, pfrost said:

I could be wrong of course.  Once you have them in hand you will be able to tell for sure.

 

P

Just got them- I'll take a look. Patrick- It is unlikely that you are wrong. Once again, as always, I appreciate the information and understand that EVERYONE gets tagged with a fake now and then. That is just the world of collecting and it is an educational experience. 

 

Again- that is the cool thing about this place- everyone dealing with these items is very cordial and are always willing to help with objective information. 

 

 

 

[pfrost]

Tom you are as talented a collector as anyone. Remember it’s just my opinion. I am not an expert but I do think it’s nice to have open discussion on wings. The guys on this forum are great sources of information but so are you!  
 

p

[blind pew]

On 4/14/2024 at 12:40 PM, pfrost said:

Tom you are as talented a collector as anyone. Remember it’s just my opinion. I am not an expert but I do think it’s nice to have open discussion on wings. The guys on this forum are great sources of information but so are you!  
 

p

Nope- Got it Patrick and you were 100% correct. Oh well............... it was worth a chance as it was only $300. 

 

In addition, I gained more "education", which makes it worthwhile. 

 

Again- not the first time I've gotten a fake and it won't be the last. Fortunately, due in a great part to the assistance of you guys here, the acquisition of fakes has become a far less frequent event!👍