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1968 SF Vietnam


Francis Marion
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Francis Marion

I will be purchasing a 1968 M151 Jeep and need the proper attire to drive it. I already have the OG 107 Jungle Fatigues but want to make sure I have the appropriate period patches for them and this forum should be the best place to get it right.

 

I will be dressing it out with the patches that I have earned except backdated for the period. I will need:

 

SF Patch

Flash for the beret

Name tape

U.S. Army tape

Airborne wings

Combat Infantry Badge

 

The patches do not have to be authentic (I would not want to wear and devalue something of value) but realistic reproductions. Any help would be appreciated.

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pwmiraldi67

hey

sounds like a cool plan, Id go with subdued name and US army and do the rest of the insignia in color, ie SF wings, rank on sleeves, full color Viet wings, and maybe a combat patch for fun!

I know George peterson makes some pretty decent looking LLDB pocket hangers as well as silk bevo style Viet jump wings,

paul

post-2472-1237910643.jpg

post-2472-1237910780.jpg

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Francis Marion

I found Mr. X's SF in Vietnam pics thread and was able to verify patches/uniforms by year. Pwmiraldi67, I agree. I could go with subdued or color patches but the color would be better looking for the parade style I'm planning. I'll probably get Thai wings instead of the Nam wings you suggested; I want to stick with what I've earned. All the color Army and white name tapes were from before '68 so the subdued ones already on my Jungles should be fine. The Moore Militaria email was returned undeliverable so I'll give the In-Country site a try.

 

I'm still open for more suggestions so keep them coming and I'll post some before/after pics when I get home in June.

 

BTW, the top photo they are wearing the earlier Fatigues and the bottom one he's wearing the original Yarborough designed Jungles. Mine are the later design with the buttons covered and no epaulets and the best uniform I have ever worn. I wish they went back to these instead of the trash they call ACUs (pronounced I-See-Yous)

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thefallenbuddha
I will say the Jeff and Heidi make the best dam patches and name tapes out there.

thumbsup.gif

 

Yes, more "authentic" reproduction patches are just what Vietnam collecting needs......

 

It's already easy enough telling fakes from originals.

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I think I am detecting a bit of sarcasm here.... but I very much understand your point.

 

Jeff and I have talked about this a lot. He places markers in the reverse stitching of his patches so they can be identified further down the road as repros. (Usually red thread). He's not making them in great number, and they are either custom ordered for either vets or reenactors. And frankly, due to his time and labor, they are not cheap either. That is important because it cuts out the potential profit margin for a seller.

 

My opinion is that that most of the reproductions appearing on the market today are just junk. A few years ago we talked about cheap Vietnamese made reproductions eventually improving in quality. Apparently the reverse has taken place... they've actually gotten worse. There were a number of hand embroidered fake series on the market for awhile, but they seemed to have dried up when few people wanted to pay $15 to $20 each. Now mostly what you are seeing are large loom factory made patches with really horrid details.

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Francis Marion

This discussion on realistic reproductions caused a thought that's blown my mind. I would like to hear your reactions.

 

I'm currently in Baghdad and can go to the local custom sew shop and ask them to make me some patches that would be made virtually the same way that in country patches were made in Vietnam. These would be authentic pieces for Iraq but repros for Vietnam? Where do I draw the line? :unsure:

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This discussion on realistic reproductions caused a thought that's blown my mind. I would like to hear your reactions.

 

I'm currently in Baghdad and can go to the local custom sew shop and ask them to make me some patches that would be made virtually the same way that in country patches were made in Vietnam. These would be authentic pieces for Iraq but repros for Vietnam? Where do I draw the line? :unsure:

 

That is a matter of moral judgement.

 

How exactly would you market them? Vietnam era patches made in Iraq? And what is the objective here? As the saying goes, you could do it, but should you do it?

 

Even if you described them exactly for what they were and charged a fair price for them (say $10), will the next person who sells them do the right thing or try to sell them for big bucks as "rare variations" of the originals.

 

As it is, we had Vietnam era patches remade after the war in Korea, Taiwan, Thailand, Japan / Okinawa, and probably even Germany. They were made for veterans as souvenirs or combat patches. But then again we had enterprising souls who had the same thought you've had and made up batches to be sold to collectors as "the real deal". Vietnam collectors have been sorting this out for years.

 

And why stop at Vietnam? Why not some rare 1930's, WWII or Korean War patches?

 

I'm willing to bet someone has already had a USARV or MACV or 18th ENGR or 18th MP patch made in Iraq simply because they did not have one made in desert colors before they left the states. I've seen US factory made USARV patches in desert tones, so it would not surprise me. (And yes, there are Vietnam era vets who have served in the modern conflicts in Iraq and Afghanistan)

 

If you make them up there will be people who will buy them. In fact, I would like a couple just for reference so that five years from now when they appear on eBay I can tell people where they came from. But I doubt you will find many long term Vietnam collectors who are in favor of it. We already have a constant stream of well made reproductions coming from Pakistan to sort through.

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Francis Marion

Perhaps I should have illustrated better that this was only a mental image of contradiction. I have no intention of actually having any of these made since the neither the color nor the subdued green are used here.

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I was wondering about that. It would be kind of funny if all of a sudden a bunch of tan and brown Vietnam era patches suddenly appeared on the market! The really funny thing is that somebody, somewhere would come up with an explanation for them as "rare variations" worn in the Vietnamese highlands during the dry season!

 

Having said all of this, I just saw on eBay a modern update of the USAF 14th Tactical Recon Squadron patch done in desert colors. This is the design that dates back to WWII with Bugs Bunny riding a stylized P-38 Lightning with a large camera mounted on the front. This one featured missiles which were not part of the original design, but it still had the look of the old patch.

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NobleLoyalGSD
Yes, more "authentic" reproduction patches are just what Vietnam collecting needs......

 

It's already easy enough telling fakes from originals.

 

Going back here a couple posts, I want to apologize for not stating clearly that In-CountryPatches.com was my own Web site. It was not intended to mislead anyone and should be known that I make these reproductions myself.

 

I started collecting US army patches and making other replicas two decades ago (gawd I'm old) and it's really a passion. Vietnam era theater-made insignia introduced a whole new love affair. I try to mark each item as permanently as possible without taking away from the quality and replicated authenticity.

 

There is a good market for my wares and if I'm going to sell them as marked repros, as I do, the market currently dictates that they must be superb and worth the extra dime I charge (this is also because I make them myself and not in a nation where labor is much cheaper).

 

The alternative is producing crappy repros, selling them as real and making an obscene profit from ignorance. NOT producing replicas is simply not an alternative. As I already wrote, there is a good market for the stuff and a way to sell it and still maintain one's integrity.

 

Many vets and historians strive to wear uniforms, equipment, and insignia that is as accurate as possible without spending the cash on or ruining an original item. There is a place for that and it's up to the individual or niche organization to determine why and how.

 

I think forum member Francis Marion is on the right track by asking where he can find what he needs to complete his uniform. Myself, National Capital Historical Sales, Moore Militaria and others can perhaps provide that in a professional, honest manner.

 

Cordially,

 

~Jeff

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If you are looking for high quality hand stitched repros, Jeff who posted above does the best work around!

 

Going back to my earlier post, I found the USAF 14th Recon variation done in desert colors. And yes, I know it is different from the WWII and Vietnam patches, but it still has a lot in common with the original design. Just to make this story all the funnier, this was reportedly made in Korea.

 

The color USAF 14th Recon is from a dinner invitation used in Udorn, RTAFB around 1975/

14th_Recon_invite_b.JPG

USAF_14th_Recon_desert.jpg

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  • 1 month later...
Francis Marion

Another quick question for those who may know. Is there any difference between the color sleeve rank insignia worn in the mid '60s and those worn on the current Army Class A uniform?

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  • 3 weeks later...
pwmiraldi67
Another quick question for those who may know. Is there any difference between the color sleeve rank insignia worn in the mid '60s and those worn on the current Army Class A uniform?

 

Yea the old ones have a cut edge like WWII era SSI and the modern day Class A uniform ones have a high raised marrowed edge, I'll see if I can post some examples for ya, its easy once you see the difference :)

 

paul

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  • 3 weeks later...
Francis Marion

I just got the uniform all put together. Thanks for all your help and especially Jeff from In-Country.

 

Uniform.jpg

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pwmiraldi67

Very nice, my only concern is are you doing Special Forces in Thailand or Vietnam?? The only reason I ask is you dont see a whole lot of SF guys in nam in 1968 with Thai jump wings, only because the 1st Group was there TDY and the 46th hadnt been around but 1 year. I would have gone with the color silk Viet wings instead, but thats just me. still a really nice shirt and set up!!

Love to see ya with your jeep!!

 

all my best

 

paul

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Francis Marion

I decided on the Thai wings because of the close proximity and interaction between the countries. I also didn't want to wear anything I didn't earn.

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