Missing Patch-What should be sewn here?

[Big Iron]

I like some surplus stuff and this uniform caught my eye. It has a CIB in the pocket that never got sewn on. What goes on the left sleeve under the Ranger and airborne tabs? There is velcro on the right sleeve below the right patch. It's $25 and I'm thinking I'll just snag it the next time I'm there.

[RWW]

The left sleeve would have been a unit patch, from the shape, possibly a 1st Calvary Division patch and the right sleeve Velcro would have held an American flag.

[atb]

The outline looks too small for a 1st Cavalry Division SSI. Note the size of the "AIRBORNE" tab. Unless it's grossly oversized, the patch underneath was smaller than a 1st Cavalry Division one.

[Edelweisse]

8th ID patch?

[atb]

I believe the 8th Infantry Division was inactive when this uniform would have been worn with an 8th ID SSI on the current unit shoulder. Also, what 8th ID element would have been airborne?

[RWW]

I agree abt, I was just thinking shape for who would have had an airborne element, not size. A Cav patch is pretty large...

[Rakkasan187]

I just looked through the book: "Desert Uniforms Patches and Insignia of the US Armed Forces" By Kevin Born and Alexander Barnes.

 

There are a few possibilities of the patch due to the shield shape and arched top (If it is arched due to the image shown) as well as an affiliated AIRBORNE tab: 

 

US Army Civil Affairs and Psychological Operations Command patch.  

1st Special Operations Command patch.

Special Operations Command Europe (SOCEUR)

 

Just some guesses.

 

EDIT NOTE:   I Did not Scan the images of the Desert Insignia for the patches pictured below from the book but they were in there...

 

Leigh 

 

[RWW]

I knew one of you "thread head" patch guys would come through!

[Big Iron]

2 hours ago, Rakkasan187 said:

I just looked through the book: "Desert Uniforms Patches and Insignia of the US Armed Forces" By Kevin Born and Alexander Barnes.

 

There are a few possibilities of the patch due to the shield shape and arched top (If it is arched due to the image shown) as well as an affiliated AIRBORNE tab: 

 

US Army Civil Affairs and Psychological Operations Command patch.  

1st Special Operations Command patch.

Special Operations Command Europe (SOCEUR)

 

Just some guesses.

 

EDIT NOTE:   I Did not Scan the images of the Desert Insignia for the patches pictured below from the book but they were in there...

 

Leigh 

 

How would one go about determining which of those would be the most likely? Just guess?

[Rakkasan187]

There is a possibility that the surplus shop removed that specific patch to add to a collection if they have desert patches on the wall as a display, or the Soldier removed it before getting rid of the uniform. I would check with the store owner and see if they may have removed the patch to sell separately.  It is not uncommon for some stores to remove shoulder patches from uniforms to sell individually to folks only wanting patches not the uniforms. I know several shops that have patch bins. 

 

You may want to look at the other uniforms on the racks to see if there were others with similar insignia that may not have been removed, but I imagine you already did, and this uniform was the only one with nearly complete insignia. 

 

Other than the last name if there are no laundry marks or the Soldiers last 4 in the uniform, and even if there were, it would be a very long shot to get recent records of Soldiers. 

 

A best guess is the quickest option for now and if it were me, I would go with the PSYOPs and Civil Affairs insignia as it would be in my opinion the most practical.  PSYOPs and CA command deploys quite frequently with other Airborne units such as the 82nd and 101st in addition to Rangers, SF and other units. 

 

Leigh 

 

[Big Iron]

3 hours ago, Rakkasan187 said:

There is a possibility that the surplus shop removed that specific patch to add to a collection if they have desert patches on the wall as a display, or the Soldier removed it before getting rid of the uniform. I would check with the store owner and see if they may have removed the patch to sell separately.  It is not uncommon for some stores to remove shoulder patches from uniforms to sell individually to folks only wanting patches not the uniforms. I know several shops that have patch bins. 

 

You may want to look at the other uniforms on the racks to see if there were others with similar insignia that may not have been removed, but I imagine you already did, and this uniform was the only one with nearly complete insignia. 

 

Other than the last name if there are no laundry marks or the Soldiers last 4 in the uniform, and even if there were, it would be a very long shot to get recent records of Soldiers. 

 

A best guess is the quickest option for now and if it were me, I would go with the PSYOPs and Civil Affairs insignia as it would be in my opinion the most practical.  PSYOPs and CA command deploys quite frequently with other Airborne units such as the 82nd and 101st in addition to Rangers, SF and other units. 

 

Leigh 

 

Thank you for your reply. I'll go back at some point and ask if they did. It's a pawn shop, so everything is for sale more or less. They may even have a record of who sold it and could contact him if they were really accommodating. There were a few others with neat patches.

 

All the uniforms were $25 per top, so not a whole lot and are a cheap way to build a neat collection of modern GWOT type stuff.

[Big Iron]

Since I can't edit my previous post, I guess I'll have to make another one.

 

Is the first uniform more than likely an OIF uniform given the awards (CIB in pocket, jump wings, Ranger and airborne tabs) or more likely a Desert Storm vet and issued uniform? Thank you again.

[gwb123]

It's up to you, but that USAF jacket might be worth the $25, depending on your collecting interests.

 

Here is a link that describes the patch you see on the uniform.

 

https://flightlineinsignia.com/product/363rd-ers-dragon-lady/

[Rakkasan187]

11 hours ago, Big Iron said:

Since I can't edit my previous post, I guess I'll have to make another one.

 

Is the first uniform more than likely an OIF uniform given the awards (CIB in pocket, jump wings, Ranger and airborne tabs) or more likely a Desert Storm vet and issued uniform? Thank you again.

The 25th Infantry Division did not participate in Operations Desert Shield/Storm in the 1990s.  In 1995, the Division HQ along with 1st and 2nd Bdes deployed to Haiti for Operation Uphold Democracy, and later in April thru September 2002, 1000 Soldiers from the Division deployed to Bosnia as part of Stabilization Force XI. It was in 2004 when elements of the Division started to deploy to Iraq and continued rotations with the Brigades and other elements of the Division to both Iraq and Afghanistan, so more than likely this uniform is an OIF/OEF uniform.

 

Leigh 

[32sbct]

I also think that it would be a USACAPOC patch.  It was probably a Bn, company, or team supporting a Brigade of the 25th ID. Probably from 2004 or 2005.  At that time USACAPOC units were being awarded the "combat patch" of the unit they were supporting.  It was not unusual to leave Iraq with numerous combat patches from a single deployment.  My battalion, who was in Iraq in 2004, left with four, Third Army, USACAPOC, First Corps, and 2nd ID.  Also I don't think the 1st Special Operations Command patch was in use by the time of the Iraq War started.