Fixed bale 2nd Division. Helmet

[newcollect]

hi Gents, hope all is well. Does this look legit? Thanks!

[Nickman983]

I'm not sure about this one, looks different than most of the other 2nd ID examples I've seen posted on here.

 

Are these the only photos? Do you have it in hand?

[David D]

In my opinion looks similar to examples I have seen painted at the end of hostilities in Czechoslovakia. Nothing really sticks out to me about it being a fake but then again hard to tell with only 2 photos of the insignia. More pictures would be nice. A plus if you can have some of it under magnification 

[Nickman983]

1 hour ago, David D said:

In my opinion looks similar to examples I have seen painted at the end of hostilities in Czechoslovakia. Nothing really sticks out to me about it being a fake but then again hard to tell with only 2 photos of the insignia. More pictures would be nice. A plus if you can have some of it under magnification 

 

I was used to seeing these with a white border on the shield and that's what I saw mostly when I looked for examples here last night but looking at a couple of my reference books again I'm seeing most of the examples in Helmets of the ETO have the blue/grey border and the one example in Pieter Oosterman's book has a white and blue/grey border.

 

The shield still looks narrower than what I've seen on other examples though, but this could just be down to camera angles. Like you said, more/better pictures would help, especially with magnification.

[David D]

5 hours ago, Nickman983 said:

 

I was used to seeing these with a white border on the shield and that's what I saw mostly when I looked for examples here last night but looking at a couple of my reference books again I'm seeing most of the examples in Helmets of the ETO have the blue/grey border and the one example in Pieter Oosterman's book has a white and blue/grey border.

 

The shield still looks narrower than what I've seen on other examples though, but this could just be down to camera angles. Like you said, more/better pictures would help, especially with magnification.

Blue and grey borders are very common, I have 2 in my collection with blue/grey borders and one with a white border. Not sure the significance if there is any of the different colors used. Size is a bigger indicator to me at least. Hard to tell from the angle of these photos but shield looks bigger than most Normandy era helmets I have seen. 

[BryanJ]

Well, here’s a generic question for the experts, that came to mind when reading this thread and seeing these photos.  Who in the 2ID (or any other division) would have painted these helmets?  Would they have been painted by the division’s quartermaster unit, or would they have been painted at a lower unit level?  The reason I ask, is that if multiple lower echelon units were painting them, then there could have been as many variations of paint jobs, as there were individuals painting them.  Second question, when judging the authenticity of these type painted helmets, is there any way to estimate the age of the paint to rule out fakes? 

[David D]

1 hour ago, BryanJ said:

Well, here’s a generic question for the experts, that came to mind when reading this thread and seeing these photos.  Who in the 2ID (or any other division) would have painted these helmets?  Would they have been painted by the division’s quartermaster unit, or would they have been painted at a lower unit level?  The reason I ask, is that if multiple lower echelon units were painting them, then there could have been as many variations of paint jobs, as there were individuals painting them.  Second question, when judging the authenticity of these type painted helmets, is there any way to estimate the age of the paint to rule out fakes? 

From my studies I believe paint jobs were done at regimental or battalion level. I have a named liner belonging to a forward observer of the 15th FAB and have come across another example named to a soldier also of the 15th painted in an identical fashion. While more speculation it makes sense to me but I’m still working on compiling a data base of identified real examples to make a study on the style they painted their “Indian heads “

[newcollect]

Thanks guys…I will try to get more photos. The “story “  is that this was found in Normandy in the late 80s. Of course just a.story.