Modern souvenir/airshow wings for reference

[Kimo]

I agree with Patrick, these just don't look right and appear to be modern reproductions.

[Captainofthe7th]

I received these wings today and the obverse is very nice quality, excellent patina and appears to be a Meyer pattern.  The back, however, is hollow or skeleton and seems to be enamel coated?  All qualities of the reverse could be that of 'original' wings or newer produced.  I assume the latter, but want to have more experienced eyes on them.

 

Thanks,

Rob

 

[Airborne-Hunter]

Newer. 1990-today roughly.

[doyler]

Agree..stamped copies. I have a set of Glider pilots wings on a VFW hat to a veteran in this style. Guessing he sourced them out of a catalog or magazine years ago.

[rathbonemuseum.com]

As they said, modern copy. If see that kind of back and finish, safe to assume every time.

[BHillen]

Don’t want to pile on here, but this is not a Meyer’s pattern. There is a lot of info on this forum about the Meyer’s wings.

[Captainofthe7th]

Thanks for the help guys!

 

Rob

[P-59A]

I just picked this up. The wing is not stamped and the clutch's are marked Ballou. I can find nothing on this company making this wing. Opinions please.

[5thwingmarty]

I think these are souvenir type wings.  I also think Ballou made the clutches, but not necessarily the wings.

[cwnorma]

B. J. Ballou was exclusively a findings manufacturer and had been in business for over 100 years.  In one sense, they were the bane of collectors as they made many of their modern findings using old tooling.  For decades, the fakers could still get "old style" findings from Ballou.  B.J. Ballou was purchased by W. R. Cobb around 2010 or so.  W. R. Cobb no longer appears to be using any of the Ballou tooling with almost all of their stock coming from overseas manufacturers.

 

Chris

[P-59A]

So, Is this wing intended to mislead? I can see no other reason for construction that at  first glance looks like WW2 or early post war production. I was iffy on this and I am oly out 10 bucks.

[5thwingmarty]

I don't think it was made to mislead.  I think these were made to sell in places like surplus stores, museum gift shops and airshows.  That doesn't mean someone else wouldn't try to pass them off as original 1940's to 1950's wings.  I can't imagine a real, vintage 3" Flight Engineer wing selling for less than a couple hundred dollars unless the seller is totally clueless about their rarity and value.

[P-59A]

I bought this at a local swapmeet, so 10 bucks was my offer. I still do not understand the production standards that went into making it. Why go to the trouble of putting a flight engineers insignia over an observer wing and then coat the back? Wouldn't it be cheeper to just cast one or stamp it and call it one and done?

[manayunkman]

Casting is cheaper?

 

Im sure it all boils down to making money.

[5thwingmarty]

All the way back to WWII many wing makers made them this way, using Observer or Aircrew wings as the base wings for other ratings.  Aerial Gunner, Bombardier, Navigator, Flight Surgeon and Flight Engineer wings were all made this way by some makers.  I think some of the British wings had Pilot wings made using Observer wings as the base wing.  Tooling to make one base wing and a bunch of different much smaller rating devices might have been much cheaper and simpler that making the tooling for all complete full wings.

 

I recently posted a thread about a WWII maker the used the same deviceless base wing to make almost all of the ratings, plus cadet cap insignias and various sweetheart pieces.

[P-59A]

Interesting, so this was made back in the day?

[5thwingmarty]

I think this was made more recently, just in a similar manner of some of the older wings.  These may have been made with vintage dies that had been acquired from one of the wartime manufacturers, possibly Amcraft.  The finish, reverse details and fittings are what lead me to think this was made for the souvenir market. 

[pfrost]

I think Marty is pretty close in his assessment.  These types of wings were made relatively recently and can be found in Army-Navy Surplus stores, air museum gift stores, various air shows, gun shows, eBay auctions, etc.  They are made in pot metal, relatively thin stamping in a cliche style with a shinny black lacquer finish and are almost always clutch back.  Not made as reproductions, but more as specific souvenir type item.  Some where I have an identical wing on the original card, showing that they were sold at an air museum for a couple of bucks (the price tag is dated in the 1980's IIRC).

 

You could probably bend this one in half with out much effort.  They made them in all the different ratings, including flight engineer and astronauts. 

 

P

[rathbonemuseum.com]

What Patrick and Marty said ☝️

[P-59A]

Interesting! Thanks for the info.

[Elliott R]

Hey ya'll, recently picked this up at an antique store for 37 dollars. It appears to be a legit ww2 aircraft observer badge, but it is not sterling. Any idea on if it is a display worthy peice, if I got a good deal, and if it is actually a WW2 badge?

[donaldnol]

you would have to show the reverse side to get an idea of what you have there

[Elliott R]

My bad, here is the reverse

 

[Allan H.]

Air show/ surplus store grade. Not an original issue piece.

 

Allan

[Elliott R]

thats a little dissapointing, but I saw it coming I guess. I'm pretty new to wing badges and I'm looking to get some to spice up my medal display, so what should the back of a real sterling one look like. I see various backs on ebay and other sites. Do the backs vary? or is there a general look of real sterling ones