Mercenary25 Posted February 5, 2009 Share #1 Posted February 5, 2009 Hello fellow collectors! I just got it from ebay. According to the seller, this webgear was given to him by former Special Forces guy to sell on ebay. As you can see in the photos, it is customized. It came with: M1956 H-harness LC1 pistol belt Pistol belt pad 3x ALICE ammo pouches ALICE canteen pouch M1967 canteen pouch 2x compass pouches unknown foreign pouch buttpack Note customized parts with para cords (whatever it is called) As you can see this H-harness, it doesn't have "hooks" instead, it appeared to have "hooks" cut off and sewn with extra long straps to form loops for pistol belt and pads. Bonus: I found it in buttpack, it appeared to be net that could be used as camouflage scarf or net for sniper? I like how salty this gear is. Note on foreign pouch, what is its origin? What is everyone's input? Thanks in advance! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
O.G-Palmer Posted February 5, 2009 Share #2 Posted February 5, 2009 The foreign pouch is British 58 pattern, I used them for extra ammo or rations, the scarf is also British. Dont know much about the other web equipment. Ollie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
filupe Posted February 5, 2009 Share #3 Posted February 5, 2009 The foreign pouch is British 58 pattern Specifically, the waterbottle pouch. This is the later type with the strap and buckle, the earlier type had a turnbuckle fastening. Nice set. The buttpack looks an unusual colour - what material is it? Nylon? Canvas? Rubberised? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hawkdriver Posted February 5, 2009 Share #4 Posted February 5, 2009 You are definitely buying the story with this set. I worked with SF in the Balkans and don't ever recall any of them wearing 56 pattern gear, they all had the new high speed gear with the Pro Tec helmets and painted weapons. I used to have a web gear set when I wore a younger man's clothes, where I cut all the buckles off and tied them to the belt with 550 cord like this set because someone showed me how to do it. It looked cool and that is what the Rangers did in those days. Loosen the belt and let it all hang around your waist. Didn't make me SF, so once again, don't buy the story unless you want to buy the story. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bsquirrely Posted February 5, 2009 Share #5 Posted February 5, 2009 You are definitely buying the story with this set. I worked with SF in the Balkans and don't ever recall any of them wearing 56 pattern gear, they all had the new high speed gear with the Pro Tec helmets and painted weapons. I used to have a web gear set when I wore a younger man's clothes, where I cut all the buckles off and tied them to the belt with 550 cord like this set because someone showed me how to do it. It looked cool and that is what the Rangers did in those days. Loosen the belt and let it all hang around your waist. Didn't make me SF, so once again, don't buy the story unless you want to buy the story. I'm with hawkdriver on this one; it's just a good story. We were well into the LBV by the Balkans. Most of the load carrying gear that we used was from Blackhawk, or rigger made. Except for raids the headgear was a patrol cap and outside was a floppy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mercenary25 Posted February 5, 2009 Author Share #6 Posted February 5, 2009 filupe: The buttpack is canvas, but it seemed to be rubberized. Couldn't find any markings on it. I had a chat with Nkomo, he suggested that this set may be used during 80's before Bosina. Hawkdriver and Bsquirrely: Actually, I wasn't sure that story may be legit. The reason I got it so I can show it to everyone and see what everyone's thoughts on it. I only got it for $12 plus shipping. It has M1967 canteen cover which goes for $12 in most places and ebay. Thanks for your thoughts, everyone! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the.warlord1944 Posted February 6, 2009 Share #7 Posted February 6, 2009 for that price i would `ve bought it also. at least you have a complete set of gear. it`s worth its money in parts allone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jayhawkhenry Posted February 6, 2009 Share #8 Posted February 6, 2009 I would be happy with a nice pile of gear and forget the story. You did alright. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
101combatvet Posted February 6, 2009 Share #9 Posted February 6, 2009 You can still find a few guys still wearing this old crap. You are definitely buying the story with this set. I worked with SF in the Balkans and don't ever recall any of them wearing 56 pattern gear, they all had the new high speed gear with the Pro Tec helmets and painted weapons. I used to have a web gear set when I wore a younger man's clothes, where I cut all the buckles off and tied them to the belt with 550 cord like this set because someone showed me how to do it. It looked cool and that is what the Rangers did in those days. Loosen the belt and let it all hang around your waist. Didn't make me SF, so once again, don't buy the story unless you want to buy the story. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hawkdriver Posted February 6, 2009 Share #10 Posted February 6, 2009 You can still find a few guys still wearing this old crap. True, but you will always have the hold outs. We have an OLD E-6 that refuses to turn his Kevlar in for he ACH, thinks the ACH will get him killed because it doesn't cover enough area. I would find it hard to believe that a SF trooper would buck his team that much to keep wearing that antique. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CamoDeafie Posted February 6, 2009 Share #11 Posted February 6, 2009 My .02, as I've been in communication with Mercenary25 on this, its possible that the previous owner was told to keep it or face punishment because its modified gvt property...and in Hans Halberstadt's 1995 book on US Navy Seals, there were some pictures of older men with older gear, most had either ALICE customized rigs or a variety of vests, but one guy in particular, he's shown in a 6 color desert camo with face mesh and a pistol belt rig with customized M16 mag pouches (cut grenade straps and cut flaps) and what appears to be a 1956 H harness, canvas with couple rectangular rings, pistol belt pad being regular foam paracorded onto belt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CamoDeafie Posted February 6, 2009 Share #12 Posted February 6, 2009 here is the scanned image from the book, page 72, with caption and credit, the canvas shoulders, modified ALICE M16 mag pouches, taped on field dressing pouch..and if you can look closely, the foam behind the pistol belt pad thats been taped and paracorded to the belt itself..perhaps the ebay seller tried to do something similar? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mercenary25 Posted February 6, 2009 Author Share #13 Posted February 6, 2009 Thanks for this cool picture! I wonder if anyone else has more picture of modified rigs? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CamoDeafie Posted February 6, 2009 Share #14 Posted February 6, 2009 other than my own non-SF/non-Army rig, i'm not sure, i'll have to scan some more pages from this particular book, i'd love to get more books similar to this Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CamoDeafie Posted February 6, 2009 Share #15 Posted February 6, 2009 let me open a new thread in the Field Gear subforum for such images! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
taucco Posted February 6, 2009 Share #16 Posted February 6, 2009 unluckily it's impossible to tell if it is original or built up on purpose. i have anyway two hints that may confirm your thought. -a fellow italian collector has a similar rig, that should have been used in bosnia, too. It's made from a LBV harness (without the panels with the ammo pouches, just the harness), attached to a belt with some Alice canteen and ammo pouches plus the MOLLE I buttpack -sometime ago a soldier posted his gear from half the '90s. He had a rig made from an english Pattern 58 canvas harness, attached to a rigger belt, with the typical mix of commercial and alice pouches. And just a recent example, this is a Ranger photos. The guy on the right is wearing his Ranger Assault Carrying Kit using old m56 suspenders as shoulder straps, plus a Desert Storm vintage night camo parka. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gunner Posted February 6, 2009 Share #17 Posted February 6, 2009 unluckily it's impossible to tell if it is original or built up on purpose.i have anyway two hints that may confirm your thought. -a fellow italian collector has a similar rig, that should have been used in bosnia, too. It's made from a LBV harness (without the panels with the ammo pouches, just the harness), attached to a belt with some Alice canteen and ammo pouches plus the MOLLE I buttpack -sometime ago a soldier posted his gear from half the '90s. He had a rig made from an english Pattern 58 canvas harness, attached to a rigger belt, with the typical mix of commercial and alice pouches. And just a recent example, this is a Ranger photos. The guy on the right is wearing his Ranger Assault Carrying Kit using old m56 suspenders as shoulder straps, plus a Desert Storm vintage night camo parka. amazing photo! i love the sf and ranger rugged look of i just woke up... did some one need to be apprehended haha even though you know its not like that Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CamoDeafie Posted February 6, 2009 Share #18 Posted February 6, 2009 Tauco, there was a company (Blackhawk?) who produced a "Special Forces" Load Bearing H harness that looked to be lifted directly from the LBV vest's straps and modified to use as a H harness like an Alice rig, but instead of hooks, it went onto the belt via belt loops Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hawkdriver Posted February 6, 2009 Share #19 Posted February 6, 2009 It's really doubtful that those are Rangers, more likely, contractors in Iraq. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
taucco Posted February 6, 2009 Share #20 Posted February 6, 2009 sorry, i'm firm they are rangers, they are wearing Ranger Spear Balcs and SDS Ranger Rack kits. I doubt contractors would use military equipment, radios and handsets, usgi brown t-shirts etc... but maybe i am totally wrong on this. btw this is the bosnian rig i am talking about Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CamoDeafie Posted February 6, 2009 Share #21 Posted February 6, 2009 We don't know do we? They match the photos of Special Forces that were sent into Afghanistan to work against the Taliban, that I've seen in some coffee table books (Special Forces in Afghanistan) and accredited to the API press corps..though they may well be PMCs... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nkomo Posted February 6, 2009 Share #22 Posted February 6, 2009 Merc, I do know that the USSF guys did wear ALICE rigs during Desert Storm and they would have been modified for each operators specefic requirements. In the 1986-1995 time period, there was a lot of testing of new gear. You will find a lot of black LBV's, black vests, and black pouches showing up from that time period. However, some of the older guys did stick with the ALICE gear up into the 90's. My personal belief is that this set, if SF, would have been used in the 1980's and up into the mid 1990's. However, my guess is as good as anyone else's. Nice piece whatever the case. Arch Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nkomo Posted February 6, 2009 Share #23 Posted February 6, 2009 Those pics of the Ranger guys is very interesting. I am not trying to argue with anyone, but those guys do look like contractors. Here is a pic of some contractors in Iraq. They are dressed similarly. However, the guys in my pics are all wearing Blackhawk gear. Arch Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
101combatvet Posted February 6, 2009 Share #24 Posted February 6, 2009 Depends on the team..... for the most part it has been wear what functions and works kind of an organization. During that timeframe it was possible to see this stuff. Actually, most of the SF guys in Bosnia were not wearing all this crap.... not even headgear... the gear was left in the vehicle or at the safe house.... of course it depended on the mission but remember this was a peace keeping operation. True, but you will always have the hold outs. We have an OLD E-6 that refuses to turn his Kevlar in for he ACH, thinks the ACH will get him killed because it doesn't cover enough area. I would find it hard to believe that a SF trooper would buck his team that much to keep wearing that antique. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
101combatvet Posted February 6, 2009 Share #25 Posted February 6, 2009 They look like triple canopy contractors.... I'm shocked that they aren't carrying AKs. unluckily it's impossible to tell if it is original or built up on purpose.i have anyway two hints that may confirm your thought. -a fellow italian collector has a similar rig, that should have been used in bosnia, too. It's made from a LBV harness (without the panels with the ammo pouches, just the harness), attached to a belt with some Alice canteen and ammo pouches plus the MOLLE I buttpack -sometime ago a soldier posted his gear from half the '90s. He had a rig made from an english Pattern 58 canvas harness, attached to a rigger belt, with the typical mix of commercial and alice pouches. And just a recent example, this is a Ranger photos. The guy on the right is wearing his Ranger Assault Carrying Kit using old m56 suspenders as shoulder straps, plus a Desert Storm vintage night camo parka. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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