*** looking for photos of pre-war / early war vehicles with Infantry plaque ***

[General Apathy]

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Hoping for some help PLEASE, I have this brass plaque which weighs approaching two pounds in weight, it has crossed rifles for ' Infantry ' identification, I have seen several photos of a similar brass plaque with crossed ' Sabres ' on armoured vehicles, but I would like to find photos of the Infantry plaque in use on any vehicles.

 

As brass became a critical material then the plaques were discontinued and the crossed Rifles and Sabres symbols were simply painted onto the vehicles. 

 

thanks in anticipation if you can help.

 

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regards lewis.

 

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[Rakkasan187]

Lewis,

 

I have to go to work at the 1AD museum on Saturday. I will see if we have any photos of the Infantry plate in use..

 

Best regards, stay safe

 

Leigh 

[General Apathy]

4 hours ago, Rakkasan187 said:

Lewis,

 

I have to go to work at the 1AD museum on Saturday. I will see if we have any photos of the Infantry plate in use..

 

Best regards, stay safe

 

Leigh 

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Hi Leigh,

 

Thanks my friend that sounds good, some of those pre-war manoeuvres would be a likely candidate, hope you're managing to avoid this damn virus, have a good weekend

 

regards lewis.

 

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[Rakkasan187]

Lewis,

 

Hope your doing my friend...

 

Here are three prewar images that I found in our archives in regards to the Infantry Brass plate on vehicles.

 

The picture with the large Birthday Cake is the 1st Armored Division Birthday at Ft Knox in 1940. The M2 Light Tank has the Infantry plate towards the middle behind the .30 caliber machine gun on the left side. I verified with a jewelers loop and there is no doubt that they are crossed rifles.

 

I made a second copy of the image and cropped to the brass plate.

 

The three quarter front view of the M2 Medium tank has the brass plate in the same area but this time on the right side of the tank behind the .30 caliber machine gun. Again I confirmed with a jewelers loop that these are without question crossed rifles. This is an Ordnance Department Photo taken in August 1939

 

The last photo is quite interesting as the information on the back of the image (which was too light to try to copy) read: "Medium Tank M2A1 of the 67th Infantry, 3rd Army Maneuvers 1940. This helps validate that tanks assigned to infantry units would have used the crossed rifles brass plate in lieu of the cavalry crossed sabres.

 

I will continue to search through the archives and see if I can find any other photos. We have a smaller than average pre-war photo collection of 1AD images but I am glad to have found these in the archives for the activation of the 1st Armored Division at Ft Knox in July 1940.

 

Hope these help my friend

 

Stay safe, best regards

 

Leigh

 

 

 

[General Apathy]

On 3/20/2021 at 8:24 PM, Rakkasan187 said:

Lewis,

 

Hope your doing my friend...

 

Here are three prewar images that I found in our archives in regards to the Infantry Brass plate on vehicles.

 

The picture with the large Birthday Cake is the 1st Armored Division Birthday at Ft Knox in 1940. The M2 Light Tank has the Infantry plate towards the middle behind the .30 caliber machine gun on the left side. I verified with a jewelers loop and there is no doubt that they are crossed rifles.

 

I made a second copy of the image and cropped to the brass plate.

 

The three quarter front view of the M2 Medium tank has the brass plate in the same area but this time on the right side of the tank behind the .30 caliber machine gun. Again I confirmed with a jewelers loop that these are without question crossed rifles. This is an Ordnance Department Photo taken in August 1939

 

The last photo is quite interesting as the information on the back of the image (which was too light to try to copy) read: "Medium Tank M2A1 of the 67th Infantry, 3rd Army Maneuvers 1940. This helps validate that tanks assigned to infantry units would have used the crossed rifles brass plate in lieu of the cavalry crossed sabres.

 

I will continue to search through the archives and see if I can find any other photos. We have a smaller than average pre-war photo collection of 1AD images but I am glad to have found these in the archives for the activation of the 1st Armored Division at Ft Knox in July 1940.

 

Hope these help my friend

 

Stay safe, best regards

 

Leigh

 

 

 

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Hi Leigh.

 

Many thanks some great photos there,  thank you for taking the time to copy and post here for me,  hope others enjoy the images as well.

 

Take care and keep safe . . . . . .

 

chin-chin lewis.

 

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[gwb123]

Learn something new every day.  This is such an odd practice.  Perhaps it dates back to locomotive or tractor manufacturing. I was never aware of this before. 

[mikie]

I've got to admit doing some head scratching about the purpose of going to the time and expense of installing these plaques. They are neat for sure, but why? 

Mikie

[Rakkasan187]

I will have to do some more research when time permits but at the 1AD museum where I am the curator,  I have 12 file cabinets of 1AD history and approximately 200 archival boxes full of documents from when the Division was activated at Ft Knox in July 1940 to present day. There may be some information regarding the placement of the brass plaques on the vehicles. We have a few of the plaques in the collection. I can't recall if they are all infantry or cavalry or a combination of both.

 

Although the Division moved from Germany to Ft Bliss in 2009 there are still numerous boxes of items that we are still going through. Hidden gems of information and treasures in every box.

 

Best regards, stay safe everyone

 

Leigh

 

 

[robinb]

Spotted this photo in a 1940 magazine.

[General Apathy]

On 3/27/2021 at 12:27 AM, gwb123 said:

Learn something new every day.  This is such an odd practice.  Perhaps it dates back to locomotive or tractor manufacturing. I was never aware of this before. 

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Thanks gwb123,  pleased that it has interested you and hopefully highlighted a little known early war historical detail.

 

regards lewis.

 

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[General Apathy]

On 3/27/2021 at 2:50 PM, Rakkasan187 said:

I will have to do some more research when time permits but at the 1AD museum where I am the curator,  I have 12 file cabinets of 1AD history and approximately 200 archival boxes full of documents from when the Division was activated at Ft Knox in July 1940 to present day. There may be some information regarding the placement of the brass plaques on the vehicles. We have a few of the plaques in the collection. I can't recall if they are all infantry or cavalry or a combination of both.

 

Although the Division moved from Germany to Ft Bliss in 2009 there are still numerous boxes of items that we are still going through. Hidden gems of information and treasures in every box.

 

Best regards, stay safe everyone

 

Leigh

 

 

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Hi Leigh,

 

thanks again for all the effort,  must be very interesting seeing stuff come out of the boxes for the first time in a while, hope a lot of it gets onto display . . . . . . .

 

Please say hi to Luther at the QM next time you see him, wish I could have gotten back there more often myself . . . . . 

 

regards lewis.

 

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[General Apathy]

On 3/30/2021 at 5:44 AM, robinb said:

Spotted this photo in a 1940 magazine.

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Hi Robin,

 

many thanks for taking the time to record and post the photographs here, pleased to see what I was looking for has turned up, also interested now to research what the two items/ parts are that I have added arrows to.

 

Tank models don't alter in size so I can only imagine that the soldier in the turret is a much larger person compared to the other soldier and the tank itself . . . . . . . . . . . . . .

 

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regards lewis.

 

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[Dogsbody]

21 hours ago, General Apathy said:

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Hi Robin,

 

many thanks for taking the time to record and post the photographs here, pleased to see what I was looking for has turned up, also interested now to research what the two items/ parts are that I have added arrows to.

 

Tank models don't alter in size so I can only imagine that the soldier in the turret is a much larger person compared to the other soldier and the tank itself . . . . . . . . . . . . . .

 

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regards lewis.

 

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Hi Ken, although it's not the same vehicle it can probably shed some light on the two items/parts. The bigger round part is most likely where the bow machine gun is situated. The smaller part I believe to be a horn of some type.