US Army Infantryman on the Plains in 1868

[Gbrown1]

As the Civil War ended and the Indian War period began in 1868 – The Rifles and Accouterments attached is what a US Army Infantryman would be fitted with out on the plains.

 

Rifle on the left - M1865 First Allin Conversion Springfield 3 band rifle in .58 Rimfire Caliber - 5000 of these were made in 1865 and were the first rifles issued to the Indian Army after the Civil War. This one in Very Fine/Excellent condition. One must also consider that a good portion of these were late cutdown for school cadet guns in the 1880s, and an original untouched Excellent condition Specimen are rare. The model 1861 Rifle Musket was the gun converted to the first conversions includes proper rifle sling. Example of a .58 Cartridge.

 

Rifle on the Right - M1866 Second Allin Conversion Springfield 3 band rifle in .50-70 Caliber.   Following the M1865 First Allin above, the US Army at Springfield reduced these to the more powerful center 50-70 Cartridge and simplified the Breech mechanism. 25,000 were manufactured and these guns seen heavy use on the frontier in the late 1870s and were famous at the Wagon Box fight near Ft. Phil Kearny in Wyoming, and again at the Hayfield Fight near Fort C. F. Smith in Montana, US Troops held off attacking Indians.  26 soldiers at Wagon Box Fight held off hundreds of Indians with these newly issued rifles. Same at Hayfield.  Very Fine/ Excellent Condition.  Again, thousands of these were cutdown into two band cadet/school guns after the adoption of the 45-70 series of Trapdoor rifles. The model 1863 Rifle Musket was the gun converted to the Second Allin conversion as well as the improved 1868 and 1870 models. Includes a proper leather sling.

 

Infantry Set of Accouterments used for the First and Second Allin Rifles 58 caliber and 50-70 caliber Trapdoor rifle.  Only Infantry Officers had hand guns.  This set of accouterments includes the Angular US Bayonet that fits on the 1865 1866 1868 1870 trapdoors.  Set consists of Sheepskin lined musket Cartridge box.  Tins removed and it was lined with Sheepskin.  Original Leather Sling on the Cartridge Box with the round eagle Breast plate.  Leather Belt with the brass lead filled US oval belt plate which was worn through the adoption of the M1872 Belt with the rectangular brass US plate.  All leather M1855 Bayonet scabbard with the Bayonet.  M1858 Knapsack - Tarred linen body with leather straps and brass fittings with steel connecting buckles.  It represents the standard issue Federal Infantry knapsack of the Civil War.  In addition to other gear the CW soldier was issued a knapsack.  In light marching order the knapsack has little more in it or on top than a rolled blanket, extra rations, and the balance of 60 round of ammunition that couldn't go in a 40 round cartridge box.  At other times, the knapsack varied from carrying a new outfit to underclothing, poncho or rubber blanket and woolen blanket.  Mostly, however the men tended to leave enough in camp so that when they took to the road their knapsack weighed only about 15 pounds.  Civil War to 1872 Infantry and Cavalry Haversack that is the completely tarred leather haversack and permanent attached Tarred Canvas shoulder strap used for food and personal items.  Very rare. The leather strap on the bag and buckle leather have been restored on this bag.  Civil War Infantry Canteen with the wool covering and complete with the cloth shoulder strap and cork stopper with chain.

 

 

[MattS]

Very nice set-up! 

[The Rooster]

Thats an awesome display! Thank you for posting it.

Must have been tough with a single shot rifle. But at least they had cartridges instead of muzzle loaders.

Im wondering wether the enlisted carried handguns of their own?

Meaning even though they were not issued could they be allowed to carry a sidearm in the field

of their own purchase ?

[Gbrown1]

Someone more knowledgeable than I can better answer that question.  I have never read of an infantry soldier having a side arm only officers or seen a picture of an enlisted infantryman with a side arm only officers.  

[BlueBookGuy]

hello,

quite a very nice setup, my compliments  -    I like it very much. That M-1865 is a gorgeous firearm. Years ago I was offered one, but price plus much extra money needed to have the gun here from the US would have turn out more than impressive, so I ended up with a M-1866 Second Allin conversion found here in Europe (most likely, my gun had been one of those aquired from French in its 1870 war against Prussians).

 

As for the interesting question, infantry enlisted and NCOs usually didn't carry any sidearm, however starting in summer 1886 the Sergeants (but only them) got the standard Colt SAA.   As a curiosity, Sgt. Max Littman of 27th US Infantry recalling of the mythic Wagon Box Fight of August 2nd, 1867 against Red Cloud's warriors, stated he and his comrades that day were carrying in the field the revolvers besides their Springfield M-1866 rifles   -  one for each man.

Will post shortly my M-1866.  Thanx, Franco.

[45govt]

3 hours ago, Gbrown1 said:

I have never read of an infantry soldier having a side arm only officers or seen a picture of an enlisted infantryman with a side arm only officers.  

 

 

[Slobo]

8 minutes ago, 45govt said:

 

Do we have a date on this photio?

[BlueBookGuy]

... possibly many a picture back then was taken being with full weaponry, for the sake of portrait? In my opinion, carrying a big frame revolver (let alone a couple of them) just stuffed under the cartridge belt, wasn't either practical and comfortable.  Itt's hard to think at the guy doing in earnest all was needed to do in the field, with such obstacles pressing against the crotch or thigh   -  moreover staying exposed to outside elements, and risk of getting lost along the march.

[BlueBookGuy]

... here my Springfield Mod. '66.   As said, much likely this could come from those the French got together with other American longarms (Spencers and Winchester '66) in view of the war against Prussians.

Not too worn out, neither too 'nice'  -  the right amount in my opinion.

 

 

 

 

... here among some other Trapdoors in my collection. The Mod. 1866 and the Mod. 1868 (first and second from above) could fit this topic, even though the M-1868 in my instance does bear a 1870 date.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Gbrown1]

Like your rifle/carbine collection.

[Gbrown1]

My understanding is the Army did not issue revolvers to the Infantry only the Cavalry.   If an Infantryman was carrying a revolver it would have been a private purchase.  I believe the picture poses with revolvers were for picture purposes only.

[Skysoldier80]

Really like the photo of the Schoffield in the belt.

[BlueBookGuy]

the rule for issuing revolvers was:

*  Cavalry   -   enlisted, NCOs, and officers

*  Light Artillery  -   only officers

*  Infantry  -  only officers.  Then in summer 1886, Infantry Sergeants got revolvers as well. But only Sergeants.

 

[The Rooster]

Here is a painting of 9th Cav Buffalo Soldiers.

[huntssurplus]

I believe non-NCO infantry troops didn’t begin to carry sidearms until WW1. Very nice setup though! Thanks for sharing!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[45govt]

21 hours ago, Slobo said:

Do we have a date on this photio?

No date on the photo.

 

Yes. some of the photos are probably studio but still they are photos of infantry with side arms, I wouldn't think the Manila photographer would have those props?

 

[Fritz]

GBrown, beautiful rifles!  have you ever seen or heard of a 1864 Allin that was cut down to carbine length?  

 

Fritz

[Bill_Harrison]

On 12/23/2023 at 4:22 PM, Fritz said:

GBrown, beautiful rifles!  have you ever seen or heard of a 1864 Allin that was cut down to carbine length?  

 

Fritz

I have, it is quite a common conversion of the 1864 trapdoor to shorten the stock and reduce the barrel length  to carbine length or slightly longer for the civilian market (I believe the modern term is sportorised), my first Springfield was one of these.  I still have it and will post a photo or two if you like?

[P-59A]

        Way back in the old days I worked at a gunshop / indoor gun range and manufactured small arms ammo for a sister company. I made custom loads on a Dillon auto progressive. I used to do allot of shooting and hunting. We shot every type of handgun, long gun, black powder, smokeless powder and went into recurve and compound bows to be well rounded. I had a 45-70 Trapdoor carbine for a couple of minutes. Burning black powder and pushing out 500 grains of lead that was about the size of a .45 APC round was brutal. After 20 + rounds my shoulder would hurt! A buddy had a 45-70 leaver action rifle. He tagged his 250lbs hog at 50 yards in the shoulder. The entry wound was what you would expect, but the exit wound blew out the other shoulder. You could put your fist in the hole. 

        I have nothing but respect for the guys who muled that rifle around in the old days. I call that rifle a man's rifle. It is not forgiving, not one bit.