m1a2u2 Posted February 25, 2021 Share #1 Posted February 25, 2021 What do you guys think? The decals looks like the paint is smeared... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thor996 Posted February 25, 2021 Share #2 Posted February 25, 2021 What do I think when I see painted or decal helmet liners for very historically significant units? Let me preface this by saying, I don't collect many helmets {I have a couple of nice, non painted with decals that I got cheap and got very lucky on from flea markets and one decal liner given to me by the daughter of the veteran ] but have seen enough threads here to know ANY painted helmet is automatically suspect and any with paint or a decal that is too good to be true for a unit like this one, or looks like it's been altered in the most important spots , or for small historically significant units is to be looked at with a VERY wary eye. IF that were a 10$ find at a flea market i MIGHT throw ten bucks at it but that one IMHO and my VERY unexpert eye looks bad. I don't like the decal or the paint. Looks like it was manipulated to 'look old'. I can't comment on the webbing or any of that bc that's way beyond my knowledge base. My first reaction is to keep scrolling and keep going. Especially if this is on ebay, especially unattributed and not verifiable. Just my two cents. But let's see what the experts say. ebay link. https://www.ebay.com/itm/Original-World-War-Two-Nuremberg-Trials-Guard-MP-M1-Helmet-Liner-Rare/184672949319?hash=item2aff5d9447:g:NOEAAOSw3e9gMPW7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doyler Posted February 25, 2021 Share #3 Posted February 25, 2021 Is it actually paint or a paper transfer image applied with glue? Ome insignias were paper. I have a MP helmet I posted that had been over painted and it had the USFET paper transfers under the paint. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doyler Posted February 25, 2021 Share #4 Posted February 25, 2021 Has one on each side but the other side didnt hold up as well the prior owner was stripping it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ken88 Posted February 25, 2021 Share #5 Posted February 25, 2021 Almost looks like a water slide transfer. Those will easily fall apart, creating the rippled/cracked effect you see in the pictures. But unless the price is right, you'll probably want a microscopic verification. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
m1a2u2 Posted February 25, 2021 Author Share #6 Posted February 25, 2021 Does anyone have a picture of a confirmed real one? I've looked around the forum but only saw fakes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
themick Posted February 25, 2021 Share #7 Posted February 25, 2021 The dealer is also trying to make money from the shipping -- $71.65 from Pennsylvania. Waaaay tooooo much!! Steve Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Rooster Posted February 25, 2021 Share #8 Posted February 25, 2021 Im not an expert. The thing that seems strange to me is that there are two scratches in the paint behind and not through the upper right corner of the decal. If, the decal was applied to a fresh coat of white paint (Which I would assume would have been the case) then why are there two parallel scratches under the decal ? It looks like,.... someone finagled a decal onto an old white painted liner and aged it ??? Its those scratches that make me think that. They are clearly under the decal. "The dealer is also trying to make money from the shipping -- $71.65 from Pennsylvania. Waaaay tooooo much!!" Yup !!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
m1a2u2 Posted February 25, 2021 Author Share #9 Posted February 25, 2021 1 hour ago, The Rooster said: Im not an expert. The thing that seems strange to me is that there are two scratches in the paint behind and not through the upper right corner of the decal. If, the decal was applied to a fresh coat of white paint (Which I would assume would have been the case) then why are there two parallel scratches under the decal ? It looks like,.... someone finagled a decal onto an old white painted liner and aged it ??? Its those scratches that make me think that. They are clearly under the decal. "The dealer is also trying to make money from the shipping -- $71.65 from Pennsylvania. Waaaay tooooo much!!" Yup !!!! Unless that is a crack in the paint rather than a scratch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dmar836 Posted February 25, 2021 Share #10 Posted February 25, 2021 7 hours ago, m1a2u2 said: Does anyone have a picture of a confirmed real one? I've looked around the forum but only saw fakes. And there it is. That's the problem with collecting painted lids. We have already had our "noses ruined" by so many ingrained images of bogus helmets. We want to see cracks rather than scratches and reasons why it must be real. BTW, and sorry to come off sideways but, do those two scratches really look anything like cracks in the paint to you? If cracks developed in the paint after the decals were applied the decal would most certainly move with it and crack. Those are much less flexible than the paint. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Keith Posted February 26, 2021 Share #11 Posted February 26, 2021 Looks like a real one here: 8 hours ago, m1a2u2 said: Does anyone have a picture of a confirmed real one? I've looked around the forum but only saw fakes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
m1a2u2 Posted February 26, 2021 Author Share #12 Posted February 26, 2021 3 hours ago, dmar836 said: And there it is. That's the problem with collecting painted lids. We have already had our "noses ruined" by so many ingrained images of bogus helmets. We want to see cracks rather than scratches and reasons why it must be real. BTW, and sorry to come off sideways but, do those two scratches really look anything like cracks in the paint to you? If cracks developed in the paint after the decals were applied the decal would most certainly move with it and crack. Those are much less flexible than the paint. In looking at the rest of the cracks on that helmet, those lines look a lot more like cracks than scratches. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dmar836 Posted February 26, 2021 Share #13 Posted February 26, 2021 Okay Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Rooster Posted February 26, 2021 Share #14 Posted February 26, 2021 14 hours ago, m1a2u2 said: In looking at the rest of the cracks on that helmet, those lines look a lot more like cracks than scratches. They could be cracks ? But even if they are cracks... the decal looks to be applied over them. Because if they were indeed cracks or scratches, the cracks and or scratches would go right on through the decal. The decals are much more brittle and fragile than the paint like DMAR said. The decal should be cracked or scratched too. Its just an opinion though so I would not assume that these opinions are the gospel truth. ??? What do you think ? Maybe some experts on here, which I know are on here, will give their opinions ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manayunkman Posted February 26, 2021 Share #15 Posted February 26, 2021 Im no expert but Rooster I agree with you. Those are scratches under the insignia. Thats a shabby chic decal. This is what I’m sure you are talking about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Rooster Posted February 26, 2021 Share #16 Posted February 26, 2021 Yes Sir. And does it look like it has had some kind of chemical applied to the decal ? Maybe causing it to look all smudged up ? Looks like dried droplets of something around the lower outer edges of the decal...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manayunkman Posted February 26, 2021 Share #17 Posted February 26, 2021 The decal has undergone a shabby chic treatment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dmar836 Posted February 26, 2021 Share #18 Posted February 26, 2021 What chemicals react to slide decals is a big deal. I have restored older racing bicycles and ruining rare NOS decals by applying the wrong thing is a big concern. I suspect this liner had something applied to either clean it or to weather it which reacted with the ink on the decals - real or not. Could also be Microsol applied to the wrong kind of ink. I don't thing the excessive cracking of the white paint elsewhere on the helmet is part of that - just the running ink on the decals. Can't say for sure this is a fake but considering the poor condition why defend the anomalies? Wanting it to be real is a common sentiment but lets not let it blind our common sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thor996 Posted February 27, 2021 Share #19 Posted February 27, 2021 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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