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BB&B jump wings/ good or bad?


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It is sort of a copy.  It might even be a copy of a copy.  My understanding is that these were made by BB&B post war for a renown individual within the airborne community who designed the paratrooper wing at the beginning of WW2.   The very first batch of paratrooper wings were produced by BB&B.  This person would then gift these wings to certain paratroopers he deemed worthy.  So they are original in the sense that they were produced by BB&B but I'm guessing in the 1980s.  I've seen one that is dated 1987.  I'm sure whomever was gifted one of these wings would consider them a prized possession because of who gave it to them.  What I don't know is if BB&B produced additional batches and sold them to the public.  These wings do not match the war time BB&B paratrooper wings so BB&B used a different die to produce them.  Since no one produces pin back paratrooper wings anymore my guess is that BB&B was asked to reproduce their war time paratrooper wing so it is actually a reproduction.  It is hard to tell with these photos but this paratrooper wing looks like a casting.   If it is a casting then it looks like someone cast a copy of a copy.  

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I just found these photographs so it would appear that BB&B was selling these to the public.  The caption I have for these wings is that they were produced in 1984.  I also found the photograph of an example dated 1987 and you can just make out the BB&B hallmark that is out of focus on the upper right wing tip.  So they are out there and you have to be careful as I'm sure unscrupulous insignia dealers will try and pass these off as WW2 originals.

 

 

BB&B 1984 Edition Para Wings (2).jpg

BB&B 1984 Edition Para Wings (3).jpg

BB&B 1987 Re-Strike (2).jpg

BB&B 1987 Re-Strike (1).jpg

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Persian Gulf Command
1 hour ago, Tonomachi said:

I just found these photographs so it would appear that BB&B was selling these to the public.  The caption I have for these wings is that they were produced in 1984.  I also found the photograph of an example dated 1987 and you can just make out the BB&B hallmark that is out of focus on the upper right wing tip.  So they are out there and you have to be careful as I'm sure unscrupulous insignia dealers will try and pass these off as WW2 originals.

 

 

BB&B 1984 Edition Para Wings (2).jpg

BB&B 1984 Edition Para Wings (3).jpg

BB&B 1987 Re-Strike (2).jpg

BB&B 1987 Re-Strike (1).jpg

Great information and supportive photographs regarding the post war production of BB&B wings.  Thank you!

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There is a very excellent thread here

 

I hate to sound like Grandpa Simpson, but back in the day (just after Saving Private Ryan and Band of Brothers came out) the prices of airborne stuff seemed to explode exponentially.  BB&B wings were especially popular, with sets selling in the 1000$ range on eBay.  That, of course, fired up the great unwashed masses of shady collectors, "Honest John" type dealers, and various other riff-raff trying to cash in.  It seems that the prices have generally settled into more normal realms, but the premium items, like a nice BB&B hallmarked jump wing still get good prices. Ironically, from the front, unless you really have studied the wings, they look just like most other airborne wings.  I found my BB&B wing years ago at a flea market, bought it for 10$, but only because I wanted an example of the BB&B hallmark.  It wasn't actually until years later that someone told me that there were only 300 of these made for the first 300 paratroopers.  Then a few more years until someone (I'm looking at Alan H) told me the truth --that there were actually much more that that.

 

This thread above was interesting because there was some undercurrents of misbehaving that were hinted at... and I hate to admit it, I do love me some gossip (I've been accused of being as bad as a 12 year old when it comes to gossiping LOL).

 

But, we are super lucky to have some AWESOME airborne collectors, scholars and gentlemen on this forum. 

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Patrick,

 

the old thread on the BB&B wing brought back a lot of bad memories for me as I really caught hell over it at the time. The seller of the wing, who was banned, had a number of these later vintage wings and he sold them to all of his buddies. I got involved because the seller mentioned that the wing he was selling was "exactly like" the example in a noted collector's collection. The rub was that the seller had sold that wing to the noted collector. When I called him on it publicly, it really started a firestorm. I had all sorts of negative things said about me on other sites and my ability to judge WWII airborne items was definitely called into question. Even in the previously linked thread another collector came barreling in to show off his wing that had "iron clad" provenance to a 377th PFA pathfinder. What wasn't explained at the time is that the wing and "grouping" to the 377th PFA pathfinder had been sold by the same guy that was defending his bogus wing that started the thread to the USMF community. Thank God that everything came out in the wash, but a price was paid for outing the scumbag for what he was doing.

 

In the end, I am glad that there is a place like USMF where items can be discussed on their merits, but all collectors need to remember that all that glitters is not gold.

 

Allan 

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Allan,

 

Allan, you are one of the true good guys in the hobby.  I've Known that since we first met at the ASMIC National show in DC.  If someone tried to tell me that @Allan H. was wrong about something US elite forces related, it would tell me more about them than anything else.

 

Chris

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Allan,  I remember that thread and I also remember you acquitted yourself very well during the discussion.  Your contributions were reasonable, well sourced, well thought out, educated and very respectful.  This is one of the things that makes this forum so much fun to participate on, when people can share their perspectives in such a gentlemanly matter.  I am not just saying this because I owe Allan money, but EVERY TIME he posts something I carefully read and digest what he is saying.  No one is ever perfect, but you can try to be less imperfect!  The guys on this forum who post about the airborne stuff really do know their facts.

 

On the other hand, those who are argumentative, loud and obnoxious...well they are full of sound and fury, but little else.  Not to impugn the others on that thread who are now banned (and good riddance, I always say), but while I would surely miss YOUR contributions to this forum, I can honestly say to myself that I never say... "gee what the heck happened to XXXXX and YYYY, those guys had some good insight and knew what they were talking about!"  I still see some of those knuckleheads on the other forums... playing the same stupid clown circus games.

 

As collectors, especially novice ones, the BB&B thread is a good example of how class, knowledge and education in a subject trumps those who are loud, obnoxious and just looking to make a buck. 

 

Frankly, being badmouthed by some of those chowder heads on some of those other forums is like a badge of honor!  HeWhoShallNotBeNamed once sent me an email suggesting that he would "expose me to the wing collecting community as the hack I am" or some such  nonsense.  I was honestly bemused as to why he would possibly think I cared what he thought about me. Sure, I am a hack, but I am an honest hack".  My ignorance is gained honestly.  LOL

 

Not to gossip, but didn't at least one of those fellows deface a US paratrooper memorial in Normandy a few years ago and get himself in a whole ton of additional trouble?

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Chris, Patrick and all who have reached out to me privately,

 

I would like to thank you for the very kind words. I sometimes wonder if my blather is read at times as I feel like nothing kills a thread like me participating! 🤣

 

I really appreciate this forum for what it is- a place for the scholarly discussion of US militaria. I appreciate the fact that we have some real giants in the hobby that frequent these pages, though some do not post nearly enough. I am proud to be a member of this community and am proud of the fact that there are so many who are willing to help other collectors. I believe that it is this fraternity of US collectors that set us apart from the 3rd Reich collecting community. Our willingness to help each other and to call out the scumbags who try to take unfair advantage of others is what we should all strive to do.

 

Thank you to the USMF for setting a high standard for the community as a whole.

 

Allan

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Persian Gulf Command

Allan,

  I also wish  to support all you have done for so many here to aid and assist us with your knowledge and direct assessments.  I can only imagine how many you have helped, whom do not directly participate in a thread but simply read the information and use it for future benefit.

 

Thank you sir,

John

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  • 3 weeks later...
  • 1 month later...

Another one of these copies is up for bid on eBay with 21 hours to go (see link).  It is a little more convincing with some wear like damage to the front.  There are currently 13 bids and now up to $250.00.  

 

https://www.ebay.com/itm/224421196705?mkcid=1&mkrid=711-53200-19255-0&siteid=0&campid=5335821211&customid=&toolid=10001&mkevt=1

 

 

 

 

s-l1600 (9).jpg

1081292742_tp.jpg

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Sold for $405.00 and I'm sure the seller is glad they brought a tidy profit but disappointed that he didn't skin someone for a lot more.

 

Allan

 

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  • 2 years later...

These BB&B hallmarked jump wings are currently listed on eBay as being original WWII era sterling. The seller has a return policy and a 100% rating. The current bid is $21.50 with 6 days left. Having read all the previous comments I’m curious to see what everyone thinks about these. I’m not sure quite what to make of them but my spidey senses tell me to tread lightly. I look forward to everyone’s comments. 

IMG_2909.jpeg

IMG_2910.jpeg

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I would venture to guess these might be the same wings that started this thread, just cleaned up a bit.  Same pock marks...I would trust your spidey senses..

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In as much as I have read on here that there weren’t that many originals made by BB&B during the war it seems more likely that they aren’t than they are original. 

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Since you mentioned the wings that started this thread I believe you are right upon comparing the two. They do look the same having identical indentations on their backs, Either the ones up for auction currently are the same ones from the first post in 2021 or were made the same way (which seems unlikely). Good eye. Thanks for the help.

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  • 2 weeks later...
WarRelics

The last bid I saw on these cast BB&B wings before the bidding ended was $129.00 about an hour before. They may have sold for more. 

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