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A-2 392BG for review


RVR

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Nobody? Promised the seller i would let him know if i will sell it or not... 😟  In my opinion it's a good one but would feel more comfortable when some of your expert would give me there opinion!  Thank you guys!

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It looks like a nice original jacket to me, and is probably researchable given the name

I will pay top dollar for original WWII items pertaining to:

 

OSS

OSS Maritime Unit

NCDU

UDT

Scouts and Raiders

FSSF

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A big thanks guys for your opinion, very much appreciated! I had a good feeling with this jacket and it comes with the positive ID of the original owner... He was the navigator on one of there B-24’s... He and the crew were shot down during his 23rd mission - 29th May 44, POW in Germany... Will post more pictures when I have them! 

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I guess I don't understand being the go-between seller without the knowledge to authenticate it. Not trying to be a jerk but I just don't understand dealing in a potentially dicey area if that isn't what you usually deal with. Antique store maybe?

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4 hours ago, dmar836 said:

I guess I don't understand being the go-between seller without the knowledge to authenticate it. Not trying to be a jerk but I just don't understand dealing in a potentially dicey area if that isn't what you usually deal with. Antique store maybe?

 

Hi there, so, because I don’t have the knowledge it means that I can’t be interested in the A-2? I have bought a few books about the A-2 in the past because I always wanted to buy me one but they are so expensive that I don’t dare to buy me one without asking your help... I didn’t know that they were people who were annoyed by my question... I know that I’m not a big help on this forum but I mainly collect Belgian RAF and wanted to extend my collection with some of there American brothers... So I am certainly no antique dealer, only a Belgian collector who wanted some help...

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15 hours ago, RVR said:

Nobody? Promised the seller i would let him know if i will sell it or not... 😟 

 

Oh, no. I honestly said I didn't understand this as it sounded like you were going to be the seller for someone.

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☺️, no harm done, thank you for your answer... Now I see what the problem is, I was wrong in my post, I must have been distracted.

 

The A-2 was for sale with an other collector, I had a good feeling for it and I asked him to reserve the jacket for me for a couple of hour so I could ask for opinions here ☺️...

 

So i ment: “Nobody? Promised the seller i would let him know if i will BUY it or not...

 

My mistake... But in the meantime I bought the jacket, will post it on this forum the moment it is on mannequin in full uniform! 
 

thanks again guys! 👍🏻👍🏻👍🏻

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Love the jacket and the patch....here is what I look for when trying to determine if the patch is period to the jacket....I look for creases in the leather jacket around the perimeter of the patch...just like a natural crease on pocket flaps etc, generally the leather will crease around the edges of the patch...not always definitive, but a start

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Agree with Phantom. It's a little too late but based on that enlarged patch picture I am a little suspicious of just the patch. The stitching does not appear very old, the edge is still crisp, and there is a shoe polish look to it. I figured the lighting is messing with the overall colors so better picks could prove no problems. These are just things that draw the eye. Photography can make a good fake look excellent and an authentic look fake - the latter more common. There are as many here who gloss right over all this and say I'm paranoid. A-2 IMO are as faked as M-1s. The jacket is certainly a good contract and well-collectible. Maybe researching SMITH would be a bit vague but give that a go.

It sure displays well! Do post some detailed photos when you receive it!

Dave 

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The wrist knits are replacements but that's not a killer. Did the seller say he replaced the knits? They look like they were done by an A-2 guy - not the town seamstress. That can be a giveaway that the jacket has been messed with. It might imply that it came through hands of those who "know what they were doing". Not always a good sign unless provenance follows with it. Many of us AAF collectors have replaced knits(even a vet friend's painted A-2 had replacements but they were the incorrect style) but if this isn't revealed by the seller then what else might have been done. Just something one must ask - not a killer.

BTW, I have seen POW A-2s that were not with the vet when captured. Finding one worn in a Stalag would be rare indeed and likely in much worse shape, no? I sure hope that is not what the seller was espousing.

Dave

 

 

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I was assuming he wore it in the POW camp.

 

Are you saying that his A2 was sent back to the US or the other men held on to it for him?

 

How does a POW get reunited with his A2 ?

 

Didn't they reissue this type of thing?

 

Especially since they were in high demand by many who wanted one, by hook or by crook, I might add.

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I think so. I suppose most of what I have seen was sent home and the A-2s are often the story and not from the owner-vet. For example, named jackets to KIA service men, UNIS marked canteens to KIA Marines, etc. Items obviously not always with them, then the mystery starts. If this guy was a POW, obviously his A-2 wasn't with him. How it got to where it is now is a mystery. This is also the case with M-1 helmets "with original netting", Ranger painted helmets, etc. I am suspicious unless a seller has provenance or openly explains either all of the history or admits to the questions rather than just leaving the questions alone or becoming defensive - because it is there. This jacket could be a good example. 

I have an M-43 from a guy "killed in the Battle of the Bulge" per his niece. I wondered how it got back to family until I saw it was manufactured during or after the battle. I told her it likely belonged to his brother (her father) who survived the war. "Nope, it was uncle XXXX,s coat." She never claimed he was wearing it but she was convinced the family lore was accurate despite the obvious date issue. I don't wish to offend these people. I have good family lore as well - some of which I've dispelled and some of which has proven even better than told.

This A-2 is a good looking jacket but there are some really good fakers out there - some ostracized from the community years ago who likely still operate at more local rather than internet levels. This A-2 does have a certain solid, German appearance and patina if anyone remembers that extremely knowledgeable and talented guy - he predated my collecting.

RVR, I'm not trying to rain on your purchase. These conversations come up all the time when questions of authenticity is questioned. We are looking forward to pics!

Dave

 

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Hi guys, so I went to Brussels a few days ago to collect the jacket...

 

Seems the man who put the jacket on the sale site was the son of the former owner of the jacket... Unfortunately the man died a few months ago and his wife who was in here late eighties I think and whome I also met was going to life with here son... The man was an engineer and worked with Sabca, (that’s a Belgian aero company). I could see the man was a fervent model builder and had a couple of uniforms among which the A-2.

 

The wife told me that the uniform was in there house as long as she could remember... I wish I could tell you all a exiting story of how he found the jacket but the boring truth is that he - according the wife - just brought the jacket from the States during one of his professional trips...  

 

When i see the prices on the net I payed a very reasonable price so I don’t think the tried to fool me...

 

In the meanwhile I allready have some opinions and all are well until now so hope you all like it also... I will put some detailed pictures here tommorow! 

 

Want to thank you all, you were a great help! Love this community! 

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Way late to the discussion here, but I didn't/don't see any issues with this this jacket at all. Patch is a good one. Nice score to a well known 8th AAF bomb group. Enjoy.

 

JD

AAF Collector...........
**Always Buying WW2 Aviation Related Items: Especially Operation Tidal Wave items (1st Ploesti Raid) ..... WW2 Fighter Ace Related Items.....Higher End A-2 Flight Jacket Groups....AAF Related Valor Medal Groups**

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Ive had a named 392nd A-2 before and the patch on mine looked just like this.

 

Kurt

!!!! WANTED !!!!

WWII Prisoner of War items : Medals, Mail, Diaries, Photos, Documents, Scrapbooks + More

WWII Naval Aviation Groupings : Medals, Documents, Scrapbooks, Photos, Flight Logs, Flight Jackets + More

 


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Hi guys, thank you a lot for your help, it is really appreciated, you were a big help...  Now i am waiting for a WWII chocolate shirt and tie i ordered and when all is complete will post other pictures...  @JDK: better a bit to late then never is my motto so i am very glad you gave your opinion about this jacket...

 

@dmar836:  with the jacket came two Second Lieutenants bars ( and you can see clearly evidence on the jacket that there once were lieutenants bars on it ) a Navigator wing, they were all in the left pocket... There were no other wings at the mens home and the son told me the insignia belonged with the jacket so i looked at the website of the 392nd ( https://www.b24.net/ ) and could see there is only one navigator with that name, ánd he was second lieutenant...  The name i found was Smith, James W...

 

Here is his picture...

 

  Smith-James-W.jpg.9d0054d9790fc8d19508667c860007e1.jpg

 

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