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Bailey Banks & Biddle of Philadelphia, PA: examples and patterns


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A nice Bailey, Banks & Biddle example indeed, however one could pick up three of them at retail for that money.

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Austin_Militaria

It is a $1200 wing, no doubt it is 100% original. The high bidder will never pay and they will relist it and some idiot(s) will do the same thing again. For some reason this happens a lot on this site. They have no way to hold anyone accountable.

 

And no you cannot use it as a tax write off because you are receiving something in return for your money.

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Perhaps it is due to the centennial, but lately interest in WW1 pilot wings has increased at auction.

 

The wing in the original post is indeed a fairly nice example of a Bailey Banks and Biddle-type "Dallas" wing.

 

Of course, people are free to spend their income as they see fit. but paying over $5000 for a $1200 wing is particularly poor asset management. If the buyer actually intends to follow through with the purchase they will never get their money back out of this wing.

 

When the market re-stabilizes a year or two after the centennial, it is likely that those who have rushed into the market--and driven prices up, may find that they are substantially underwater in their collections.

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  • 2 years later...

Did B.B. & B. ever make WWII USAAF pilot wings? If so, can someone post a photo of a pair? Were these typically marked “Sterling”, or just the word “Silver”? Any help is appreciated!

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There are some wings marked BB&B Bronze.  Again, not a very uncommon pattern of wing and I think the jury is stil out.

 

BB&B did make a jump wing that is very valuable (and relatively rare).  There are some USN aviator wings from the 20's and 30's (probably) marked BB&B.

 

Read this thread.

 

 

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Thanks for the reply. I do remember reading that post at one time. To elaborate on my question, I was wondering if B.B.&B. made any of the standard WWII pattern pilots wings, not the 1930s variant.

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So...did any of the wingdings win the BB&B wing? Ww1 Captain who served through ww2. I'm guessing a medals or ww1 aero collector won it all?

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5thwingmarty

Bob shows the Adams style BB&B wing with the WWII AAF wings on his site.  It is possible that like Noble and Robbins that BB&B continued to offer this pattern through WWII.  Does anyone have a WWII BB&B catalog?

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This is the wing in question cropped from the auction photos. I don’t know how to post a link, but it was ebay item #274456483867. I did see a similar B.B.&B. pilots wing posted on the ww2wings.com website, but did notice two differences. The pin seems a little different in the auction photos (hinge looks more robust/bigger) and the wing in the auction was stamped “Silver”, not “Sterling”. I’m not a wing collector, so I passed on this lot, but can anyone tell if the wings in the auction were authentic?

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6B71D1DC-9C5C-4167-BF2F-3971F2C9A539.jpeg

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I saw those wings as well. I threw a bid on the lot but it was about half of the final bidding. The original owner had extensive combat flight time in WW1...not sure what he did in WW2, but he retired as a Captain, per his obituary (there's a paper group of his closing today that probably answers those questions).

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This is the paper for the group. I hope whoever bought the medals and insignia can reunite it all. Looks to be a really super group. 

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Interesting wing.  The "SILVER" mark is wrong.  As a well established jewelry company, they wouldn't have used SILVER but instead they would have used the appropriate STERLING mark.  It is hard to see the BB&B  hallmark so I cannot compare it to the one on Bob's site.  Also, Bob's example has a "camed" pin that limits the opening to about 90 degrees (like the vintage NS Meyer wings), whilst this one doesn't seem to have that type of pin.  I also wonder about some of the other items in the grouping (like the combat infantry man's badge)

 

 

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All in all, I have mixed feelings about this grouping.  It seems like the paperwork, photos and some of the medals are very very nice.  There is a squadron badge that looks ok, but the Tiffany hallmark seems off--but that is only based on what I see in some poor photographs.

 

I would be willing to bet dollars to donuts that if you were to search for BB&B made items (not just wings), you would be very hard put to find even one that was marked SILVER instead of STERLING.  BB&B did have a line of insignia that were marked BRONZE, but I believe that was a trademark. 

 

Sure, I am as much as a Pollyanna when it comes to certain ebay auctions (the seller isn't strictly a militaria guy, there are lots of interesting and vintage stuff that is 100% related to this grouping, its a potentially very rare wing), but for that type of money when one thing is wrong, I wonder about the other things.  I want to believe in this wing... but I would also want a pretty good return option policy as well.  Sometimes things get salted into groupings in order to sell low value items. Sometimes things get added prior to the end seller getting a hold of the grouping  I know a couple of antique dealers who are notorious for doing that type of thing.  It would nice to see some provenance underlying where the group came from --was it out of an estate sale and is there a list of items sold, or was it bought from some other source.  Especially for that kind of money.

 

Frankly, I really do hope that the BB&B wing is good (I would love to have egg on my face and be totally wrong), and all the paperwork and photos are absolutely great.  The medals seem to be a nice mix of common and uncommon stuff that all could have come from the same guy.  Its just that "silver" mark and the pin on that wing.... 

 

P

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5thwingmarty

The fittings appear to match those on a BB&B Airship wing that Ron Burkey sold, and the sub badge posted in this thread.  

 

I have a Blackinton pilot wing that appears to have been made for Pasquale that is only marked SILVER.  It lacks the Pasquale name but the pattern of the rear matches other Pasquale hallmarked wings, which for some reason are marked SILVER and not STERLING.  I don't know if that has any bearing with this BB&B wing, but If I had seen the listing I would have bid on it.

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His NY CSC medal was auctioned in another lot and was traceable to him. The medals in that group look appropriate down to the silver citation star on the WWI victory medal.  There is even a photo of him wearing the WWI medals in one of the lots, 

 

He earned Mexican Border Service Medal 20059 . That medal was present in the lot.

 

He also earned a Purple Heart which was sold to the high bidder of the lot. I saw a photo of it.  A Purple Heart to a WWI Aviator would be worth more than that BBB wing.  I doubt that wing was added to salt the group. 

 

Kurt

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So just to throw my hat in the ring on this, the wing on my site is in my personal collection.  I got it through a fellow collector a very long time and to be honest, I've never felt 100% comfortable that it's actually a WW2 era wing.  It's a very nice wing in hand but I have not been able to find any documented proof that they are authentic to the period.  I leave them on the site because they are an interesting set of wings and a good conversation starter but I can't put a stamp of approval on them without some additional documentation.  

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