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WWII Photo of A in Diamond Rate Beig Worn.


patches
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Just for fun

 

Just found this nifty photo of legendary Tennis Pro Bobby Riggs when he was in the Navy in WWII, wearing that A Specity Rate, a Petty Officer 1st Class one.

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42 minutes ago, David Minton said:

No surprise he was an Athletics Instructor.


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Yes indeed. Kinda rare to find photos of the rate being worn we should think.

 

Here's the only other one I could find.

image.png.2ebc08f39789769cb8cbd66b577d090c.png

Baseball Great Bob Feller, this at Great Lakes in the Spring of 1945 after around 2 years of Sea Duty on Alabama, where he was a Gunners Mate I guess for awhile then a Gun Captain, here I gather he wore the Turret Type rate right.

 

image.png.a48491ac9a97e9b565867b1c26f934ef.png

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David Minton
Yes indeed. Kinda rare to find photos of the rate being worn we should think.

 

Here's the only other one I could find.

image.png.2ebc08f39789769cb8cbd66b577d090c.png

Baseball Great Bob Feller, this at Great Lakes in the Spring of 1945 after around 2 years of Sea Duty on Alabama, where he was a Gunners Mate I guess for awhile then a Gun Captain, here I gather he wore the Turret Type rate right.

 

image.png.a48491ac9a97e9b565867b1c26f934ef.png

If I recall Gun Captain was a distinguishing mark. The rating you posted was Turret Captain.

 

And if I recall further I believe only Chief and 1c existed for Turret Captain.

 

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33 minutes ago, David Minton said:

If I recall Gun Captain was a distinguishing mark. The rating you posted was Turret Captain.

 

And if I recall further I believe only Chief and 1c existed for Turret Captain.

 

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These right? Would this be an insignia worn say by Feller and others holding this postion after they left this duty and would wear it as long as he was in the Navy, like in the manner of a Army Qualification Badge such as the Parachute Badge etc.

ts-l1600.jpg

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Feller was initially given a direct appointment as chief boatswain's mate to serve as a PT instructor in December 1941, but changed to specialist (A) when that rating was established. Wanting to go to sea, he applied to AA gunnery school, qualified and was assigned to the battleship Alabama as a 40mm gun captain. His rate was still CSP(A), though. There is a display about him in the USS Alabama museum at Mobile.

 

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11 hours ago, patches said:

These right? Would this be an insignia worn say by Feller and others holding this postion after they left this duty and would wear it as long as he was in the Navy, like in the manner of a Army Qualification Badge such as the Parachute Badge etc.

ts-l1600.jpg

He most likely did not wear this mark. Many were only worn by PO 1 and below, and only while serving in that capacity. Chiefs rarely wore these sorts of marks.   Diver and the Submarine qualification badge (patches at this time) being the exception 

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11 hours ago, Justin B. said:

Feller was initially given a direct appointment as chief boatswain's mate to serve as a PT instructor in December 1941, but changed to specialist (A) when that rating was established. Wanting to go to sea, he applied to AA gunnery school, qualified and was assigned to the battleship Alabama as a 40mm gun captain. His rate was still CSP(A), though. There is a display about him in the USS Alabama museum at Mobile.

 

That's interesting , so even though he was a gunner for something like two years he still wore the Specialist (A) rate?

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11 hours ago, sigsaye said:

He most likely did not wear this mark. Many were only worn by PO 1 and below, and only while serving in that capacity. Chiefs rarely wore these sorts of marks.   Diver and the Submarine qualification badge (patches at this time) being the exception 

Thanks Steve.

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41 minutes ago, patches said:

That's interesting , so even though he was a gunner for something like two years he still wore the Specialist (A) rate?

On thing most non Navy people have a hard time with, is that “Gunners Mates were not Gunners. Gun crews were made up of everyone that did not have a combat related job. Deck Seamen, supply guys, Admin guys. Being assigned to a 40 mm gun crew would have been exactly what his Battle Station would have been. The rest of the time, he would have been an Athletic/PT instructor on the Ship, and assisted in Administrative duties. 
 

Gunners Mates, were concerned with gun Maintenance and running the magazines there may have been a GM assigned to a gun as a repair tech ivy, or a group of guns. But the gun crews were NOT,  Gunners Mates. Gun Captains were simply a Qualification. It was the Lead Man on the Gun. Mostly his position was the “Trigger Man”. He controlled the Hun and had final switch on the firing circuit. I was first loader on a 5 inch 38 cal single mount. The crew had a position in the back of the turret for a GM repair guy, but deleted it to make more room in the mount. Our Hun Captain was a First Class Boatswains Mate. I was a Third Class Signalman. We were very short handed on that ship. As soon as the Deck Seaman and cooks started to get fully manned, I was out of the gun and back on the bridge. 
 

the Turret Captain rate that you dhow was on Cruisers and Battleships. For guns 6 inch or larger. It was only a First Class or Chief. You had to be a Gummers Mate First Class to convert to TC. Your job was maintaining the big gun turrets. You received junior GMs to assist you. 
 

hope that helps. 

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1 hour ago, sigsaye said:

On thing most non Navy people have a hard time with, is that “Gunners Mates were not Gunners. Gun crews were made up of everyone that did not have a combat related job. Deck Seamen, supply guys, Admin guys. Being assigned to a 40 mm gun crew would have been exactly what his Battle Station would have been. The rest of the time, he would have been an Athletic/PT instructor on the Ship, and assisted in Administrative duties. 
 

Gunners Mates, were concerned with gun Maintenance and running the magazines there may have been a GM assigned to a gun as a repair tech ivy, or a group of guns. But the gun crews were NOT,  Gunners Mates. Gun Captains were simply a Qualification. It was the Lead Man on the Gun. Mostly his position was the “Trigger Man”. He controlled the Hun and had final switch on the firing circuit. I was first loader on a 5 inch 38 cal single mount. The crew had a position in the back of the turret for a GM repair guy, but deleted it to make more room in the mount. Our Hun Captain was a First Class Boatswains Mate. I was a Third Class Signalman. We were very short handed on that ship. As soon as the Deck Seaman and cooks started to get fully manned, I was out of the gun and back on the bridge. 
 

the Turret Captain rate that you dhow was on Cruisers and Battleships. For guns 6 inch or larger. It was only a First Class or Chief. You had to be a Gummers Mate First Class to convert to TC. Your job was maintaining the big gun turrets. You received junior GMs to assist you. 
 

hope that helps. 

Thanks again Steve that was very informative.

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10 hours ago, patches said:

Thanks again Steve that was very informative.

 

Yes, great to have the real gouge there!

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Just reread my post. Sorry for all the miss spelling and auto correct. Hope it was not too confusing. By the way, the Chiefs stop at AA school would have been a standard training stop on his way to a ship where he would be acting as a Mount Captain on a 40 mm mount. 
 

Aboard ship, everyone has your regular daily job and you also have your “General Quarters”, (Battle Stations) job. Most Sailors regular job is related to their GQ job. At GQ, you double things or man more positions. Not on GQ, you maintain equipment and spaces while off watch. 
 

people who have Admin and supply jobs, close up their regular jobs and go to a battle station. They serve as Gun Crew, Ammunition passers/Handlers, Phone Talkers/Status Board keepers, (those guys writing on those clear plastic boards, keeping track of contacts), Look Outs, Stretcher Bearers. On Amphibious ships, they will also be Cargo Handlers, both in the holds and on deck. And of course, assigned to Repair Lockers to fight damage and fires. All Sailors are trained in fire fighting and Damage Control and first aid. They are the First Responders to a hit, and do all they can to slow damage and assist casualties until the “Professionals” arrive. All receive these extra trainings and drill every day. Even during WW2. 

So, gun crews were not filled with Gunners Mates. Damage Control Teams were not all Damage Control Men or Fire Fighters. Stretcher teams and Battle Dressing Stations were not all Corpsmen. Those specific rates were there, in charge, but those teams were fleshed out with Cooks and  Clerks. I read in these collector forums about finding “Just a Cook” uniform. Ok. Yeah, a Cook. In the morning, he’s frying bacon and eggs. That afternoon, he’s shooting down Kamkazies as a 20mm gunner, of plugging a torpedo hole from a U-Boat. Maybe pulling a wounded engineer out of a burning engine on to get him to a dressing station for help. So, don’t just pass on “Just a Cook” uniform, or any other “Non Combat”  Navy uniform. You never know who they were, where they went or what they did. My uncle was a Cook in the Navy from 1939-1960. He fried a lot of bacon. He also tended wounded at Pearl Harbor on a Fleet Tug. Handled Cargo on an Amphib and was Gun Captain on 40mm on a Battleship. 

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