Mango Posted June 7, 2020 Share #1 Posted June 7, 2020 So here's a cool find I did the other day. Please correct me if I'm wrong but what I could find is that this helmet is that It's a WWII front seam swivel bail stamped 73C (or a badly stamped 0 maybe) with a Vietnam era paintjob on top of what looks to be the WWII color. It has a Mitchell cover marked with DSA 100-67-C-0713 made by Capitol Fur Inc. The chinstrap is sewn onto the bales (none of my other Vietnam era M1's has that feature?). Note the chin strap being pulled through the helmet cover. Helmet band is getting a little tired but in good condition besides that. Liner is a plastic model (80's or euroclone?) I have had a hard time finding much info on the Mitchell cover maker marking. From what I have found it should be an early cover made of twill. Feel free to give any information or input you might have. I'm here to learn 😀 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeneralCheese Posted June 7, 2020 Share #2 Posted June 7, 2020 Other than the cover, everything is foreign Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mango Posted June 7, 2020 Author Share #3 Posted June 7, 2020 Really? Also the helmet shell? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeneralCheese Posted June 7, 2020 Share #4 Posted June 7, 2020 Yes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Rooster Posted June 7, 2020 Share #5 Posted June 7, 2020 +1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mango Posted June 7, 2020 Author Share #6 Posted June 7, 2020 Never seen a front seam euro clone before or one with heat stamp with the same font as US makers - Who made this then? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mango Posted June 7, 2020 Author Share #7 Posted June 7, 2020 Well darn it.. I'll see if I can get my money back 😔 What gives it away? I thought when it had the heat stamp and the front seam it wasn't a euro clone Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Rooster Posted June 7, 2020 Share #8 Posted June 7, 2020 Or ? Its Us Steel Lid that went to Europe ? And was employed by a foreign military..........Because the Chin Straps definately are not U.S. chin straps. And the liner is euro. The liner screams Im euro !! General cheese can weigh in, he may see something I'm mising in the steel shell. Here in the helmet section pinned towards or at the top, is a thread all about euro and clone M1's https://www.usmilitariaforum.com/forums/index.php?/topic/188788-us-m-1-vs-euro-clone-helmet-components-guide/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Rooster Posted June 7, 2020 Share #9 Posted June 7, 2020 8 minutes ago, Mango said: Well darn it.. I'll see if I can get my money back 😔 What gives it away? I thought when it had the heat stamp and the front seam it wasn't a euro clone I would hope, that whoever sold it as a us helmet and liner would refund your money. Dont feel too bad. Its happened to prob everyone who collects helmets at first. It has happened to me........ Its best to study the pinned threads in the helmet section and do searches on things you have questions on. Then when you buy, you are armed with info that will save you time money and hassles... Thats what it so great about this forum and the good folks on here. You can learn a lot before you begin buying things. It happens. Its a learning tool. Just be glad you didnt buy a lid from WW2 for thousands of dollars that turned out to be a fake !!! Thats happened too. Let the buyer beware and let the buyer study and research and let the buyer be wise. Some folks honestly dont know what they are selling. But some are sharks out to decieve. Be armed with research and study. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mango Posted June 7, 2020 Author Share #10 Posted June 7, 2020 I thought I was prepared rooster.. I couldn't find anything on front seam euro clones or US like heat stamps anywhere. So when this was sold as a US Vietnam helmet with a newer liner then I just thought that someone had replaced the original liner somewhere through time. Could it be a shell made post war by a US manufacturer for a European army hence the similar font on the heat stamp? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Rooster Posted June 7, 2020 Share #11 Posted June 7, 2020 Okay, I think I see what GeneralCheese was refering to about the shell. The loops, it look like they are attached to the shell with the metal holding the loop folded inward and the seam on the metal facing inside inside. On a US helmet, the metal that hold the loop folds up andover and the seam is facing outward.... Thats what it looks like besides the chin straps. In picture 13 from the top down. If you look on the underside of the rim opposite of the loops, Is there a little spot weld on both sides of the rim by each loop ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mango Posted June 7, 2020 Author Share #12 Posted June 7, 2020 It looks like this Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mango Posted June 7, 2020 Author Share #13 Posted June 7, 2020 I guess it should be so the middle clasp is under the outer ones if it is to be a US shell Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Rooster Posted June 7, 2020 Share #14 Posted June 7, 2020 The attachment looksright for a US shell. But the dimple weld im talking about would be on the rim opposite the loop (or bail) Covered by the cover in your photo. Im asking because some early US shells that were fixed loop, were converted to sviwel loop. And if your shell was an old us shell with that low heat number, it would have been a fixed loop converted to swivel loop and thus would have a dimple weld on the rimm opposite of each loop. Im thinking that after the war, some countries recieved surplus US lids and put their own chinstraps and paint on them and used them for some years. This might be one of those. ??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mango Posted June 7, 2020 Author Share #15 Posted June 7, 2020 Ah I see. On one side it looks like there could be a weld but cant see it on the other side Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Rooster Posted June 7, 2020 Share #16 Posted June 7, 2020 The other side is where you need to look. Look at the underside if the weld or divit is there ,Id say the shell was a US shell a one time. The experts can weigh in. Swivel the strap out of the way and check. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mango Posted June 7, 2020 Author Share #17 Posted June 7, 2020 I'm sorry for not understanding your intructions so thank you for being kind to me 😅 Now I think I finaly got it. Here are the shots of the weld marks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Rooster Posted June 7, 2020 Share #18 Posted June 7, 2020 Well, that certainly looks like an early production Front seam McCord that was converted from fixed to swivel. By the heat stamp I get Feb 42 Must have been repurposed by a European country. Whats the concensus from the experts ? I could be wrong too. Is the rim stainless steel ? Or manganese dull looking where the paint is chipped off? If its not stainless ? Then Im wrong. Im hoping someone more in the know will check what Im telling you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeneralCheese Posted June 7, 2020 Share #19 Posted June 7, 2020 My thoughts are now that this is a US shell refurbed by a foreign country, who added swivel bales. The spot welding seems pretty sloppy/not pressed very hard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mango Posted June 8, 2020 Author Share #20 Posted June 8, 2020 If that's the case I'm just glad that I actually managed to identify a US helmet at first and that I learned something new about the bales and heat stamps! Pictures provided was my bad and I know what to present next time. Thank you very much guys, your help is much appriciated 😄 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mango Posted June 8, 2020 Author Share #21 Posted June 8, 2020 Should I try to remove the green paint? Looks like there's a darker shade beneath so it might be WWII paint Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeneralCheese Posted June 8, 2020 Share #22 Posted June 8, 2020 I would leave the paint, it doesn't look like there is any WWII corking underneath Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mango Posted June 8, 2020 Author Share #23 Posted June 8, 2020 You're right it looks like silica sand. I guess the chin straps are safe to remove from the helmet? The seller was genuinely sorry about the incident and offered me the helmet as a gift for the inconvenience. I said I wanted to pay for it and in the end we agreed on $40. So all good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
644td Posted June 8, 2020 Share #24 Posted June 8, 2020 If the seller offered you the helmet, he is a class act and good for him and for you and seller coming to an agreement. marty Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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