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Vietnam M1 Helmet Graffiti - ID


matthewsq
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Thanks for your comprehensive reply Sgt. Stubby! That newspaper clipping is definitely informative and does add some confidence to the origins of this helmet cover. Paul (pchepurko) chimed in and confirmed that Billy and Betty Lou met in the summer of 1960... so August 2nd, 1960 must have been their first date.

 

 

Quinn - if this really is William Dutches' helmet cover - what an amazing artifact from early Vietnam years.

I LOVE the layers of faded Magic Marker. It gives us all something to compare when we run across WAY too black Sharpie mutilations. However - being a doubting Thomas - I reserved my opinion until I could look into it myself.
The evidence:
1. Hawthorne New Jersey
2. (Snorkle) Dutches
3. Betty Lou 8/2/60
4. Omega Gamma Delta(in Greek)
#3 Betty Lou 8/2/60 gave me a problem. Her birthday? That would make her 5 years old. Too young for girlfriend, too old to be his daughter. Maybe Bill and Betty Lou's anniversary? That works for me.
As far as the other "proof" - the remaining 3 puzzle pieces of NAME, Hawthorne NJ, and Omega fraternity were all answered in one newspaper article.
CONGRATULATIONS Quinn in scoring truly what you called, "such a sobering piece of history". Amazing find.

 

 

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aznation, thanks for adding this to the discussion. I'll print out all of these files and keep them with the helmet.

 

Paul (pchepurko) sent me an excerpt from his book about the story of Billy's death. He quotes a letter from Billy's Sergeant, who tells that Billy was shot in the neck and died in his arms. To think that there were thousands more young men, just like Billy, all with families and lives and dreams... really makes the conflict all the more real.

 

Thanks again.

 

Quinn

 

 

Source: Coffelt Database of Vietnam Casualties

 

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I definitely will! Any specific advice for displaying a helmet like this to ensure it isn't damaged? I've never owned a helmet with a cloth cover.

 

I looked closely but couldn't tell if the helmet in the photo has the same cover as this one. I would think that for a proper USMC photo they would want him to have a clean cover?

 

A side note - I wonder how many covers these grunts would go through while in country? I can't imagine them lasting more than a few months. They're always super torn up in photos.

 

 

Absolutely crazy find and research! Display it with care

Does the cover on the helmet match with the cover in the newspaper photo? You can kinda see the pattern

 

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My pleasure! The story deserves to be told, and I'm happy to be the one to tell it.

 

Cheers!

Quinn

 

 

Truly wonderful, congratulations, :love:

 

And thank you for taking the trouble to share it with us!

 

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Posted Today, 11:37 AM

aznation, thanks for adding this to the discussion. I'll print out all of these files and keep them with the helmet.

 

You're welcome. Awesome helmet!

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Catfishcraig

Once in a while I read posts that inspire me, and this is one of these. What a significant find and hope this will help Cpl. Dutches legacy survive. What a tragic event for his family have to endure. RIP Cpl. Dutches and thank you for your service to our country.

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Cap Camouflage Pattern I

I definitely will! Any specific advice for displaying a helmet like this to ensure it isn't damaged? I've never owned a helmet with a cloth cover.

 

I looked closely but couldn't tell if the helmet in the photo has the same cover as this one. I would think that for a proper USMC photo they would want him to have a clean cover?

 

A side note - I wonder how many covers these grunts would go through while in country? I can't imagine them lasting more than a few months. They're always super torn up in photos.

 

 

 

This studio portrait was probably done like this:"the soldiers line up, one puts on the "studio helmet", sits on the stool in front of the backdrop, then takes the helmet off and passes it to the next in line who repeats the process. Not certain, but I think that's how it went. Maybe if someone has a series of portraits taken at the same time they can compare the helmets.

 

As for how many helmet covers a soldier had, I think usually 1. Just see a lot of guys with faded and ripped helmet covers.

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This studio portrait was probably done like this:"the soldiers line up, one puts on the "studio helmet", sits on the stool in front of the backdrop, then takes the helmet off and passes it to the next in line who repeats the process. Not certain, but I think that's how it went. Maybe if someone has a series of portraits taken at the same time they can compare the helmets.

 

.

I can't speak specifically for how the USMC did their portraits, but I have a yearbook from when my grandfather trained with the 5th ID at Fort Ord in '56. It's harder to tell for certain, but it looks like many of the men are wearing different helmets, some are actually just wearing liners. I'm away from my computer but I could post an example page later if anyone would like. The whole book is actually filled with really interesting pictures and text.

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i remeber our portrait photo, the dress blues were cut in the back , preclosed in the front. you put it on like a welders leather jacket, while wearing your cammo trousers and black boots, this was to save time, the DI made you make stupid faces for your platoon book

 

semper fi

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Burning Hazard

Awesome helmet set!

 

Kinda makes me sad that he had a gf, wrote her name on the cover, then never got to see here again after shipping out....

 

Pat

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Awesome helmet set!

 

Kinda makes me sad that he had a gf, wrote her name on the cover, then never got to see here again after shipping out....

 

Pat

Indeed it is....
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i remeber our portrait photo, the dress blues were cut in the back , preclosed in the front. you put it on like a welders leather jacket, while wearing your cammo trousers and black boots, this was to save time, the DI made you make stupid faces for your platoon book

 

semper fi

 

 

Thanks for the anecdote Conn, and thanks for your service.

 

Cheers,

Quinn

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Awesome helmet set!

 

Kinda makes me sad that he had a gf, wrote her name on the cover, then never got to see here again after shipping out....

 

Pat

 

Very sad. Maybe they would have enjoyed a long life together had the war not happened. The ultimate sacrifice...

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USMC-RECON0321

Absolutely crazy find and research! Display it with care

 

Does the cover on the helmet match with the cover in the newspaper photo? You can kinda see the pattern

 

 

I definitely will! Any specific advice for displaying a helmet like this to ensure it isn't damaged? I've never owned a helmet with a cloth cover.

 

I looked closely but couldn't tell if the helmet in the photo has the same cover as this one. I would think that for a proper USMC photo they would want him to have a clean cover?

 

A side note - I wonder how many covers these grunts would go through while in country? I can't imagine them lasting more than a few months. They're always super torn up in photos.

 

 

 

 

When I went through USMC Infantry School (ITS) in 1987 we used our own helmets for our individual school pictures, BUT,,, These helmets were issued by and turned into the school upon graduation, along with all the other issued field gear that we used. You then received orders, transferred and checked into your next unit in the FMF, at which time you would go through all the check in stations for that unit, including the Armory and Supply to get your Weapon, magazines, helmet and all required field gear needed. So I would say the picture used in the paper is most likely his Infantry School picture and not the helmet he used in Vietnam.

Maybe we have a Vietnam era Infantry Marine Vet on here who could confirm if this was the same procedure then or not.

 

Great Helmet for sure!!

 

Congrats, Troy

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Thanks for the reply and service, Troy!

 

The helmet arrived yesterday, but I haven't had much of a chance to look at it yet. The cover is not stuck to the helmet, so I don't think the set has been together since the war. I've yet to check to see if the rust spots line up. I can see more graffiti on the other side of the cover through the rip in the top, so I'm going to see if I can remove the cover and check out the reverse side. On the part of the cover that folds up inside the helmet, there's a tonne of red dirt, probably left over from vietnam.

 

The cover contract info is present yet faded, and dates to a 1963 contract.

 

There is a stamp on the headband with DLA on it, meaning the liner is post VN era, dated 1979. So, while the cover was certainly Billy Dutches', it was paired to the liner much later.

 

I'll take more photos when I get the chance.

 

Quinn

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Had a chance to take the cover off today. The cover was not stuck on, so I felt it was fine to remove it. The reverse side has some unique Graffiti as well. It's much less worn than the reverse side, so I would think that he spent most of the time with the green side of the cover facing out.

 

On the left side of the helmet (as the wearer):

 

Hawthorne NJ is present again in large letters. He must have been proud of his home town.

 

KID is written - must have been a nickname too, given his age.

 

Dutch

 

and of course, his fraternity, omega gamma delta.

 

 

On the right side:

 

"Cliche" is written, with quotations. Another nickname perhaps? The rest of the marker you can see is bleed-through from the other side.

 

 

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post-159322-0-34341600-1565799852_thumb.jpeg

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Helmet shell is a rear seam Schleuter (ww2 vintage). The top of the helmet has been worn down to what appears to be the metal - I would think because of the fact that these helmets were used to pound in tent stakes etc.? that may also be responsible for the large rip in the helmet cover. In other areas, what looks like red primer can be seen. Does anyone know if red primer was used to coat M1 shells before receiving an OD spray?

 

Chinstraps are sewn on, in the green colour indicative of later ww2 / korean era helmets.

 

One question: has anyone seen stamps in the inside of m1 lids before? "S-1081" is stamped multiple times on the inside, as well as on the outside of the helmet directly on the forehead area.

 

 

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post-159322-0-84808300-1565800102_thumb.jpeg

post-159322-0-40226900-1565800120_thumb.jpeg

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The red paint could be a number of different things, it's possible that the helmet was painted red for training purposes or that it could have been in use with the navy at some point (you'll see red M1s often associated with naval damage control).

 

As for the S-1081, that's somebody's laundry number. The laundry number is the first letter of a soldiers last name followed by the last 4 digits of their ASN. I know that it was common for soldiers in WWII and Korea to mark their gear with their laundry number, though I can't speak to how common this practice was during the Vietnam war.

 

The fact that this isn't Dutches' laundry number isn't too concerning seeing how often helmets were reissued. However, the fact that the cover came off easily would lead me to think that the helmet and cover are not original but I'm not certain. If the areas where the paint appears to be chipped off are a bit rusty I would expect the cover to have matching rust stains. That being said, the helmet cover is the truly exceptional piece in this set so I wouldn't be too concerned if the helmet was added to help display the cover.

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The fact that this isn't Dutches' laundry number isn't too concerning seeing how often helmets were reissued. However, the fact that the cover came off easily would lead me to think that the helmet and cover are not original but I'm not certain. If the areas where the paint appears to be chipped off are a bit rusty I would expect the cover to have matching rust stains. That being said, the helmet cover is the truly exceptional piece in this set so I wouldn't be too concerned if the helmet was added to help display the cover.

 

Thanks for the reply and insight Nick. Considering the liner is post-VN, and that the cover wasn't stuck tight to the shell, I believe the cover was added to the set by a collector. The idea of a KIA soldier's cover making it back home seems more plausible than his cover, helmet, and liner coming home.

 

I'll take a closer look at the rust stains and wear and see if they match.

 

Thanks for following!

 

Cheers,

Quinn

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