Eric Queen Posted June 1, 2019 Share #1 Posted June 1, 2019 A friend recently found this for me. I don't recall seeing a messenger dog collar like this one before. Best I can describe it is seems to be some type of 782 gear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eric Queen Posted June 1, 2019 Author Share #2 Posted June 1, 2019 A view of the other side. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eric Queen Posted June 1, 2019 Author Share #3 Posted June 1, 2019 I think it is possible it (above) could be USMC issue. The army one (which I am familiar with) was made out of leather. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eric Queen Posted June 1, 2019 Author Share #4 Posted June 1, 2019 Another view. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eric Queen Posted June 1, 2019 Author Share #5 Posted June 1, 2019 The army collar in use. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eric Queen Posted June 1, 2019 Author Share #6 Posted June 1, 2019 This was posted on the forum several years ago as an army messenger collar. Have not ever seen any reference to this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
644td Posted June 1, 2019 Share #7 Posted June 1, 2019 Very interesting and informative. I guess I’ve never thought about the dog collar during WW2 but I enjoyed learning something new. Sorry I can’t help but thank you for showing the collars. Marty Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blacksmith Posted June 1, 2019 Share #8 Posted June 1, 2019 Interesting piece. Does it look like it could be field made? I have seen all manners of improvised K-9 collars, even a Carlisle pouch stuck on a standard leather collar. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eric Queen Posted June 1, 2019 Author Share #9 Posted June 1, 2019 Doesn't have the feel of being field made to me, although I know what you mean. From the few photos I have seen the 1st USMC War Dog Platoon (assigned to the Raiders) seem to be using that (single snap first aid) pouch on Bougainville in 1943. I even wondered if it could not be US. It has "Lift The Dot" snaps which I have seen on English made US field gear but they were of course used on US made items also. I believe they were manufactured by a company in Mass (United Carr). I think all of the British messenger dog collars I have seen (and I am in no way an expert) consisted of metal tubes (like the German ones). Here is an example. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
6th.MG.BN Posted June 1, 2019 Share #10 Posted June 1, 2019 Definitely has a USMC look to it. Just my observation with no history to back it up. Very nice piece. Ken Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
644td Posted June 1, 2019 Share #11 Posted June 1, 2019 Love the photos. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sgtdorango Posted June 2, 2019 Share #12 Posted June 2, 2019 Dang cool , it does resemble a flap from a usmc cross flap canteen cover.....mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eric Queen Posted June 2, 2019 Author Share #13 Posted June 2, 2019 Thanks to all who responded. Marty, happy to hear you liked the photos. I am going to add this one also for reference/comparison purposes since I mentioned the German messenger dog collar previously. This photo is from a German dog handlers private photo album and dates to the early 1930's. The German collars seem to have been virtually unchanged in WW1 through WW2. Notice the dog is wearing a pigeon vest also. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eric Queen Posted June 2, 2019 Author Share #14 Posted June 2, 2019 Now, back to the collar in question. This originally came out of a little Humane Society display in Southern California which was recently shut down. There was a piece of paper stapled to is which read "Messenger Dog Collar from WW2. Dogs name Tubby" Of course this does not prove anything but it is an interesting and somewhat odd name just to come up with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eric Queen Posted June 2, 2019 Author Share #15 Posted June 2, 2019 There was a dog (a corporal) named "Tubby" who served with the 3rd USMC War Dog Platoon under Lt. Putney. His handler was Guy "Mason" Wachtsletter. Here is a photo of Tubby and Wachtsletter during "Attack" training. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eric Queen Posted June 2, 2019 Author Share #16 Posted June 2, 2019 The reverse show that Tubby was donated by Lee Raymond of Ridgefield, WA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eric Queen Posted June 2, 2019 Author Share #17 Posted June 2, 2019 Tubby was killed in action on Guam (August 31, 1944) by what everyone believed was a stray bullet. Wachtsletter did not take it well. Here is an excerpt from a letter he wrote to the Raymond's. It was published in the Ridgefield newspaper at the time. Aug 31, 1944 US Marine Guy Wachtsletter wrote to Mr. and Mrs. Lee Raymond of Ridgefield, Wa." Now I have to tell you the worst. Tubby was shot and killed the night of August 31.He has to his credit eight japs..he behaved like a true Marine at all times and didn'teven whimper when he died. He was shot thru the heart and died instantly. We have buriedhim in the Marine Cemetery along with the other heroes of this campaign and if it is at all possible I will send you a picture of his grave. He has a cross with his name and rank. He was a corporal." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eric Queen Posted June 2, 2019 Author Share #18 Posted June 2, 2019 Tubby is on the wall of the WW2 fallen from Ridgefield Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eric Queen Posted June 2, 2019 Author Share #19 Posted June 2, 2019 And of course on the War Dog Memorial on Guam. Again, to reiterate, I am not claiming the little hand written piece of paper is true proof of anything but, based on only what I know right now, it seems plausible. Putney writes in his book (Always Faithful) that many of the men from his platoon stayed in the Oceanside/Los Angeles area after being discharged at Camp Pendleton. There were a number of dogs whose owners could not take them back (for a multitude of reasons) and most of these dogs ended up living with their handlers. Dr. Putney DVM became the vet in civilian life to many of the dogs who had served under him. There is a chance, although I cannot of course prove it, that Wachtsletter could have kept the collar, settled in the LA area and it ended up being donated after he passed away. Again, no way to prove it but I think it is possible. I will send pics of the collar to Hayes O. and see if he has any info on it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
6th.MG.BN Posted June 2, 2019 Share #20 Posted June 2, 2019 I guess you will never know for certain but there's a good chance you found your dog. Certainly not a common name as far as War Dogs go. A very nice find, congrats. Ken Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skautdog Posted June 2, 2019 Share #21 Posted June 2, 2019 Eric, Thanks for sharing all the information.I was with Scout Dogs and Combat Trackers in VN. You might enjoy this site:http://www.combattrackerteam.org/ Ken Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
6th.MG.BN Posted June 2, 2019 Share #22 Posted June 2, 2019 Eric, Thanks for sharing all the information.I was with Scout Dogs and Combat Trackers in VN. You might enjoy this site:http://www.combattrackerteam.org/ Ken That's a great site. I guess I never thought about the use of "tunnel dogs" only "tunnel Rats". Thanks for sharing. Ken Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cap Camouflage Pattern I Posted June 4, 2019 Share #23 Posted June 4, 2019 Very marine looking construction Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
conn Posted June 4, 2019 Share #24 Posted June 4, 2019 canvas would be a better choice in the PTO than leather for holding up against the wetness Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Usmccollector Posted June 23, 2019 Share #25 Posted June 23, 2019 Idk if anyone pointed it out but the buckle holding it together is a latter or M buckle from an m41 usmc haversack Sent from my LM-Q710(FGN) using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now