avigo Posted May 28, 2019 Share #1 Posted May 28, 2019 Hey guys. Sorry if someone already posted this helmet, couldn't find anything. This was recently posted on ebay and I thought it was cool. I know very little about helmets and trying to learn. Is this helmet authentic? Is the painting authentic? If so, what unit is it? Trying to learn some of the tricks to telling if a helmet is authentic or not. This was originally part of a grouping and everything else in the grouping seemed legit. Thanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cap Camouflage Pattern I Posted May 28, 2019 Share #2 Posted May 28, 2019 The white blob kinda looks like a territory on a map to me, maybe the Massachusetts coast? Longshot but maybe unit is from Massachusetts or it's Massachusetts coastal artillery or something. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
avigo Posted May 28, 2019 Author Share #3 Posted May 28, 2019 The white blob kinda looks like a territory on a map to me, maybe the Massachusetts coast? Longshot but maybe unit is from Massachusetts or it's Massachusetts coastal artillery or something. 339-map-massachusetts-political.jpg Interesting idea! Wouldn't have thought of that one Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sgtdorango Posted May 28, 2019 Share #4 Posted May 28, 2019 Im pretty sure its a unit of the 26th ID yankee division from Mass...mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aef1917 Posted May 28, 2019 Share #5 Posted May 28, 2019 It's 101st Field Artillery, and that is indeed eastern Massachusetts. I don't particularly care for it. The vast majority of originals I've seen have been executed with far better detail. This one looks like a Native American and a half-eaten porkchop. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
avigo Posted May 28, 2019 Author Share #6 Posted May 28, 2019 It's 101st Field Artillery, and that is indeed eastern Massachusetts. I don't particularly care for it. The vast majority of originals I've seen have been executed with far better detail. This one looks like a Native American and a half-eaten porkchop. Thanks! Based on that are you saying this one could be fake? That's what I'm mainly trying to learn here. How to tell fake from real. Thanks for all the info so far guys Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doyler Posted May 28, 2019 Share #7 Posted May 28, 2019 Im on the other side of the Fence. I like it and think its original There is some definate rust coming through the paint and looks like chipped or damage area Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aef1917 Posted May 28, 2019 Share #8 Posted May 28, 2019 I would expect the insignia to have this level of detail, and I've never seen one as crude as the one in the OP. It could be real, but I'd hold out for a nicer one, since these are typically some of the most well-executed WWI painted helmets. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
avigo Posted May 28, 2019 Author Share #9 Posted May 28, 2019 I would expect the insignia to have this level of detail, and I've never seen one as crude as the one in the OP. It could be real, but I'd hold out for a nicer one, since these are typically some of the most well-executed WWI painted helmets. Great photo!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
avigo Posted May 29, 2019 Author Share #10 Posted May 29, 2019 So is the general consensus that the helmet is real, just crudely executed?Thanks for the help Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jguy1986 Posted May 29, 2019 Share #11 Posted May 29, 2019 I have noticed a few distinct styles of the 101st FA painted helmets, presumably by different guys in the unit painting them. This one is definitely among the most crudely executed, but the Indian head is similar to others I have seen on the more simple end of the spectrum. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
917601 Posted May 29, 2019 Share #12 Posted May 29, 2019 So is the general consensus that the helmet is real, just crudely executed? Thanks for the help Helmet is authentic in my opinion. I also have a " crude" looking painted helmet, it came from a noted collection, remember, these were hand painted from multiple " artists". Some artists better than others. The only sure fire method of determining if -period - authentic painted is testing the paint for lead, which can be done with a hand held spectrometer ( ?). Many large junk yards do have the large hand held devices....I used one for a meteorite and a few other artifacts to test paint. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aef1917 Posted May 30, 2019 Share #13 Posted May 30, 2019 The only sure fire method of determining if -period - authentic painted is testing the paint for lead, which can be done with a hand held spectrometer ( ?). Lead paint is no guarantee. I would not have this helmet in my collection at 1/3 of the asking price. There's a name on the strap. Knowing what it is might be instructive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
avigo Posted May 30, 2019 Author Share #14 Posted May 30, 2019 Lead paint is no guarantee. I would not have this helmet in my collection at 1/3 of the asking price. Are you saying the insignia painting is so bad that this helmet would be worth less than a helmet with no painting? That seems extreme. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aef1917 Posted May 30, 2019 Share #15 Posted May 30, 2019 I'm saying that it's wildly overpriced, even if real. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
avigo Posted May 30, 2019 Author Share #16 Posted May 30, 2019 I'm saying that it's wildly overpriced, even if real. Its sold. What do WWI helmets with liners usually sell for? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Rooster Posted May 30, 2019 Share #17 Posted May 30, 2019 Its sold. What do WWI helmets with liners usually sell for? I dont think there is any usual. It comes down to condition history provenance etc etc many variables plus the most important one what someone will pay. My 2 cents. Its like all this surplus stuff. Whats it worth to the collector.. Depends on whose eyes are looking at it. Rooster Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bugme Posted June 1, 2019 Share #18 Posted June 1, 2019 Helmet is authentic in my opinion. I also have a " crude" looking painted helmet, it came from a noted collection, remember, these were hand painted from multiple " artists". Some artists better than others. The only sure fire method of determining if -period - authentic painted is testing the paint for lead, which can be done with a hand held spectrometer ( ?). Many large junk yards do have the large hand held devices....I used one for a meteorite and a few other artifacts to test paint.As mentioned, determining lead base paint on a helmet is not going to help much since lead base paint is still easily made. I am assuming you are referring to X-ray Fluorescence Spectrometry when you say spectrometer. XRF Spectrometry has proven to be useless for determining legitimacy of paint or age on helmets. This thread covers the debate on that: http://www.usmilitariaforum.com/forums/index.php?/topic/187042-authenticating-helmets-with-xrf-spectroscopy/ I am curious as to why a junk yard would use one of these rather expensive tools for junk. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marchville1918 Posted June 1, 2019 Share #19 Posted June 1, 2019 I think it is real, but that doesn't prove ANYTHING. Helmets from the 101st FA are fairly common as painted helmets go. If you don't feel good about it or think it is poorly done you will eventually see another one. Checking out the name on the chin strap might add a level of comfort if it matches up with that unit. As a point of interest, the actor Walter Brennan served in that unit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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