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Gunners Mate specialist patch?


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Hey everyone, just received this Amphibious jumper from a fellow forum member and I have spent the last day or so trying to research. My question is that clearly this uniform belonged to an S1C, but I was wondering whether the gunners mate patch on the sleeve would change how his rank was shown on ship muster rolls?

 

The name is either R Long or E Long so I am trying everything to narrow it down and was wondering if there would be some sort of distinction next to the S1C since he was a gunner or if he would show up as a different rank altogether.

 

Best,

 

Alex

 

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GEN. David R. Atchinson- MO State Guard              ACW

PVT. John H. Drury- Co. A, 27th Ky IR                      ACW               Died of Typhoid

PVT. Henry E. Thomas- Co. I, 17th Ky IR                  ACW

PVT. Joseph E. Drury- Co. E, 356th IR, 89th ID       WWI                WIA

SGT. Edward P. Drury- 51st QM Training Co.           WWII

PFC. Delmer C. Koonter- Co. I, 142nd IR, 36th ID    WWII              WIA

SC3c Michael C. Drury- LCS (L) (3) 70                     WWII

SGT. Steven D. Koonter- 5th Cav, 1st Cav Div         Vietnam

SGT. John M. Drury- 227th AVN Bn. 1st Cav Div     Vietnam

 

Contact me with items from the 36th Infantry Division or any IDd uniforms of European Theater Infantry Divisions

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Thanks for the responses, I just wasn’t sure if there would be a distinct abbreviation in the muster rolls or whether it would probably still be S1C

GEN. David R. Atchinson- MO State Guard              ACW

PVT. John H. Drury- Co. A, 27th Ky IR                      ACW               Died of Typhoid

PVT. Henry E. Thomas- Co. I, 17th Ky IR                  ACW

PVT. Joseph E. Drury- Co. E, 356th IR, 89th ID       WWI                WIA

SGT. Edward P. Drury- 51st QM Training Co.           WWII

PFC. Delmer C. Koonter- Co. I, 142nd IR, 36th ID    WWII              WIA

SC3c Michael C. Drury- LCS (L) (3) 70                     WWII

SGT. Steven D. Koonter- 5th Cav, 1st Cav Div         Vietnam

SGT. John M. Drury- 227th AVN Bn. 1st Cav Div     Vietnam

 

Contact me with items from the 36th Infantry Division or any IDd uniforms of European Theater Infantry Divisions

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Good morning, I have a KIA purple heart engraved to a GMGSN. He was a gunner's mate gunner seaman, showing both rating and rank. Hope this helps

. That is way post WW2. WW2, just S1/c. No mention of any striker dtatus
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Thanks for the responses, I just wasnt sure if there would be a distinct abbreviation in the muster rolls or whether it would probably still be S1C

. He would still be listed as S1/c. Striker status was not listed until after 1948.
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The purple heart was for a sailor, who died in1970.

. Quite correct. The striker-designation and SN, did not start to be used until after 1948. Different era, different Navy
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Steve, How was it listed with the rank was abbreviated with just an S ?

Sorry, not understanding your question. Regardless of his being a Striker for a Rate, that designation would not be used with his rate. He would appear in paper as S1/c.

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Sorry, not understanding your question. Regardless of his being a Striker for a Rate, that designation would not be used with his rate. He would appear in paper as S1/c.

My understanding is that the mark was worn by sailors having gone through Gunners Mate school and in WW2 as in WW1 advancement was not guaranteed and as Sigs noted your rank would have been S1cl

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Sorry, not understanding your question. Regardless of his being a Striker for a Rate, that designation would not be used with his rate. He would appear in paper as S1/c.

Right Steve, plain S1/c, I was perhaps thinking on a muster/roster these guys might of had Striker in there, in example for this gunner in this case, S1/c GMS would of been listed, the GMS here being for Gunners Mate Striker.

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A small item from the April 1945 edition of All Hands concerning the distinguishing mark for class A school graduates. Could not find any info about these marks published after the 1941 uniform regs..

 

 

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The order to move the striker's mark from the lower to the upper sleeve was in July 1944.
All Hands August 1944.
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I have seen WW2 rolls that list strikers. Sometimes in parentheses, like S1c(GM), and sometimes all together, S1cGM. Maybe depended on the yeoman? IIRC it is more of a late-war thing. I think some have been posted here but it will take some looking.

 

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The order to move the striker's mark from the lower to the upper sleeve was in July 1944.
All Hands August 1944.
I have seen WW2 rolls that list strikers. Sometimes in parentheses, like S1c(GM), and sometimes all together, S1cGM. Maybe depended on the yeoman? IIRC it is more of a late-war thing. I think some have been posted here but it will take some looking.

 

 

Interesting!

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FWIW, a Coast Guard Personnel Bulletin from May 1944 notes that non rated men who have completed rating schools or have passed the exam for their rating will be designated (ex s1c (QM) ) and will wear the specialty mark of their rating on the appropriate uniform sleeve as prescribed. The CG instruction noted that personnel units would use this procedure to ensure that the personnel were assigned to the appropriate units where their training could be put to good use. The CG was acting as a service of the USN and followed USN uniform regulations. Maybe the personnel manual followed fairly close also ??

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Here is a Dec. 1944 report that has an examples of S1c(GM) and S2c(GM) (which I forgot to highlight). From the information at the bottom, it looks like these strikers were entered as changes in rating. It seems like the navy was really averse to using the word "striker" in anything official, too.

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Steve, I thought the same. The VAST majority of WW2 entries are just S2c, S1c, F2c, F1c. Whether the guidelines changed during the war is a subject for further research, I can't find anything in my copy of the BuPers manual so far.

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donation2011.gifdonation2012.gifdonation2013.gif

donation2014.gifdonation2015.gifdonation2016.gif

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Steve, I thought the same. The VAST majority of WW2 entries are just S2c, S1c, F2c, F1c. Whether the guidelines changed during the war is a subject for further research, I can't find anything in my copy of the BuPers manual so far.

. I think, quite often, it had to do with the person making the entry. I have lots of documents that just list me as AA, or AN, although I was an ASE at the time I reported aboard my first ship (ASEAA). I dont remember anyone really caring al that much at the time, as long as they got it right on pay day and advancement time.
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