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NAVIGATOR WING

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I don't know...it's online...but I think I am going to jump at it!

 

(Yes?)

 

Chris

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BTW, I need to get in touch with you about my next lot of insignia for you...

 

Chris

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The navigator wing is indeed an original. I like the brass pin and would expect it to open a full 180 degrees.

Allan


Never under-estimate the power of prayer.

 

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Thank you guys for the advice. There was an ebay seller selling what looked to be his collection of wings. From the looks of his past auctions, it looks as though he had a long standing collection of WWII wings. He had two pair of Navigator wings, one for $40, and the other at $45. The pictures looked absolutely identical, so I went with the cheaper pair. Following 36's response on here, I took his word and bought one set. When I logged on today, and saw Allan's response, the other set was sold. RATS!!! I was going to buy both pair last night, but I held off becuase I was not 100% sure.

 

I know that these are pretty hard to find - more so than your pilot wing, right?

 

Chris

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The navigator wing is indeed an original. I like the brass pin and would expect it to open a full 180 degrees.

Allan

WWII made Wing PINS had a stop built into them, & only Open 90 Degrees (not 180*) > that is one way to tell WWII made long pin-backs from the re-strikes (repros); which open 180 degrees. Anyway, Navigator wings are scarce, & $45.00, for an original, is a steal!

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WWII made Wing PINS had a stop built into them, & only Open 90 Degrees (not 180*) > that is one way to tell WWII made long pin-backs from the re-strikes (repros); which open 180 degrees. Anyway, Navigator wings are scarce, & $45.00, for an original, is a steal!

 

Not sure if the above statement is 100% correct. I've just checked all my wings and while most only open to 90 degrees, a couple open fully.

Perhaps they have become slightly loose over time??

 

This Amcraft pilot of mine opens all the way up but it's not a repro.

 

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WWII made Wing PINS had a stop built into them, & only Open 90 Degrees (not 180*) > that is one way to tell WWII made long pin-backs from the re-strikes (repros); which open 180 degrees. Anyway, Navigator wings are scarce, & $45.00, for an original, is a steal!

 

I was under the notion that was a rumor made by some collectors to scare others from buying real wings, hence lowering the price because they assumed to the 90 degree plus wings to be fakes. Is this true?


Ebay Sales: wwii.uniform.collector

 

Auctioneer Website: http://www.cnymilitaria.com

 

Facebook Sales Group

 

 

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I think it is not 100% true, but a pin opening not more than 70-90 degrees is always a good sign.

 

Regards,

Stephan


"Did Americans want heroes ? Well, we were willing at that point to be satisfied with survival."

Looking for 45th, 86th Infantry Division and 106th Cav items.

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I think it is not 100% true, but a pin opening not more than 70-90 degrees is always a good sign.

 

Regards,

Stephan

 

Yeah it's a good sign but not set in concrete, like I said the above pilot wings pin opens all the way up so if I go by the statements made then it must be a repro. The Amcraft looks perfectly fine to me so why does the pin open fully?...perhaps it is well used.

 

Dave

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WWII made Wing PINS had a stop built into them, & only Open 90 Degrees (not 180*) > that is one way to tell WWII made long pin-backs from the re-strikes (repros); which open 180 degrees. Anyway, Navigator wings are scarce, & $45.00, for an original, is a steal!

 

Bob,

Your info would be correct if you were talking about Meyer made wings as the originals open to approximately 90% and the restrikes "flop" open to a full 180 degrees. I think that David B. effectively proved that point with his ORIGINAL Amcraft wing (anyone want to try to dispute the originality?).

 

We need to be VERY careful here to ensure that the info that we put out here on the forum is accurate. Too often, collectors fall into the trap that statement to specific items get blown into unsubstantiated sweeping statements that end up hurting the collecting community as a whole.

 

I do agree that $45 for an original PB sterling navigator wing is indeed a steal.

Allan


Never under-estimate the power of prayer.

 

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Perhaps that Amcraft wing has a replaced Pin. I'd still maintain that 99% of original WWII made U.S. Wings will only be found with pins that open strait up 90 degrees from the wing (not just Meyers)

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Bottom line - some originals open 90 degrees, some 180 degrees. Some fakes open 90 degrees, some 180 degrees. It's just one aspect of a wing to consider. By itself, it is not the end all final word on originality.

 

Kurt


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Since some originals open at 90 degree's, and some open at 180 degreee's, does this not make that aspect of wing authentication invalid? I can tell you that with German badges, consideration goes into the quality of the pin, and drum assembly (US wings don't have a "drum"), and that would be one deciding factor. Is there a way that this could be used with US badges?

 

Chris

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Thanks Justin! Since you acquire most of your uniforms directly from the veterans, I was going to see if you could tell us what is on your uniforms. The answer is there...and this thread has actually developed into something pretty interesting.

 

Chris

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Perhaps that Amcraft wing has a replaced Pin. I'd still maintain that 99% of original WWII made U.S. Wings will only be found with pins that open strait up 90 degrees from the wing (not just Meyers)

 

The wing does absolutely not have a replaced pin but looking at the hinge closely under a loupe I think it may be missing the stop that prevents it from opening fully...but as I don't have another Amcraft to compare it to I'm not sure.

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Bottom line - some originals open 90 degrees, some 180 degrees. Some fakes open 90 degrees, some 180 degrees. It's just one aspect of a wing to consider. By itself, it is not the end all final word on originality.

 

Kurt

 

Well said, I agree with Kurt and Allan on this.

 

Dave

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Of course, everyone is free to believe whatever they want, but if You want to be sure of WWII originals > stick with the 90* open long pins. I've aquired many Flyer's wings (direct from Veterans) in the last 28 years of collecting WWII, & they've ALL had 90* open pins. I've got 8 originals here in front of Me; by various makers (1 Command Pilot, 2 Pilots, 1 Navigator, 3 Air Crew, & 1 AirGunner) all with 90* open pins; with the flat edge "stop" built into the Hinge part of Pin (not rounded as found on repros, & restrikes). thumbsup.gif

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Of course, everyone is free to believe whatever they want, but if You want to be sure of WWII originals > stick with the 90* open long pins.

 

Again, you need to be careful with the info as this is NOT a 100% catch all. Once the fakers figured out that collectors look for 90 degree stops on the pins, they started to incorporate them into their fakes.

The bottom line is that you need to study your area of collecting and realize that there is no such thing as an absolute in this hobby.

 

For those of you that want to believe that if the pin "flops" to 180 degrees, then the wing is a fake, I am morethan willing to buy these "fakes" from you. Of course, I want to pay fake prices!

Allan


Never under-estimate the power of prayer.

 

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OK I'll throw my 2 cents in. I have original wings that open 45, 90 and 180 degrees. That by itself is NO indication of originality. I have had numerous Amcraft wings and none of them that I can remember had pins that opened to 90 degrees, all opened to 180. The 90 degree rule is a nice starting point, particularly with Meyer wings. On the other hand one of the best fakes I have ever seem (an LGB wing) had a 45 degree pin, with a stop, die struck etc. How did I determine it was fake, an older collector friend remembered them coming out in the mid 1970's and fooling a lot of people. The moral of the story, network with other collectors, get second options; look at collections of people you trust. And BTY great price on the totally good Nav wing! If you find one at the SOS for under 125.00 I would be surprised!


Paul Conrad
Still looking for quality wings!

www.conradwings.com
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I am bored prefixing everything I say with "I think" or "in my opinion".
Everything I say is my opinion; the only thing of which I am certain is that there is very little of which one can be certain.

 


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Allan,

 

I would like to get in on that "fakes" buy too! :D

 

Paul


Paul Conrad
Still looking for quality wings!

www.conradwings.com
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donation2013.gifdonation2014.gifdonation2015.gifdonation2016.gif
donation2017.gifdonation2018.gifdonation2019.gif

I am bored prefixing everything I say with "I think" or "in my opinion".
Everything I say is my opinion; the only thing of which I am certain is that there is very little of which one can be certain.

 


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Not navigator wings, but wings nonetheless. I am new to US collecting, and bought these not even thinking about if they were real nerv0003.gif

 

Are these 1) real 2) WWII? Many thanks in advance.

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