mortaydc60 Posted February 1, 2018 Share #1 Posted February 1, 2018 There was a sleeper on ebay that at first appearance everyone was missing. Only one bid at $5 on start of last day. Looked at first like possible repo because seller did not hype the item either because he did not know or was unsure. Was listed with current pin which hurt the look of the sale. The back was covered with good amount of black paper. The 3 or 4 people who placed decent bids knew what it was and the rest of ebay missed a great buy . It is real and sold for half of what it is worth. Knowledge is King once again. Mort Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tonomachi Posted February 1, 2018 Share #2 Posted February 1, 2018 Yup I was hoping but didn't bid high enough I guess but it still went for $1281.50 which is a lot of money for a patch. Even though there was only one bid until the very minute there were six bidders so a number of people recognized this patch for what it was an original OSS SSI. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teamski Posted February 1, 2018 Share #3 Posted February 1, 2018 Yeah when you start going over that One Grand mark, it all gets pretty fuzzy to me too! -Ski Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Squeaker Posted February 1, 2018 Share #4 Posted February 1, 2018 My opinion, and you know how those are, is that a "sleeper" would be an OSS patch for a couple hundred dollars or less. To me this shows a slow down in the militaria market. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ocsfollowme Posted February 1, 2018 Share #5 Posted February 1, 2018 The winner is a top collector too and new what he had. I never saw the auction but couldnt afford it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mortaydc60 Posted February 1, 2018 Author Share #6 Posted February 1, 2018 It was a sleeper in the low activity as far as bidding and lack of anyone in the forum bringing it to the attention of this group. Understand that it may not be best to inform competition on wanted item but again it was Knowledge that ruled the day and the top bidders had the knowledge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doyler Posted February 1, 2018 Share #7 Posted February 1, 2018 It was a sleeper in the low activity as far as bidding and lack of anyone in the forum bringing it to the attention of this group. Understand that it may not be best to inform competition on wanted item but again it was Knowledge that ruled the day and the top bidders had the knowledge. No one brought the attention of the fake OSS wing to the forum either that recently sold. I saw it when it was first listed and wasn't a fan but figured it would get posted here(and I didn't even bid or watch the auction). Not much gets by the internet crowd.Some wont post things if they are going to bid on them thinking it will fly under the radar so I don't agree with an item isn't posted(here) its not being looked at or a sleeper. Its the market place.Some are not willing or don't care to spend a significant amount of money on a patch.If two of the same rare patches sell on ebay in a short time of each other and one brings less is it a sleeper?? There are a lot of patches that are listed at buy it now prices and haven't sold.If they are "worth" the buy it now and that's the "market" then why do they sit unsold?? Granted there are still serious buyers but I have known many and I'm included that the prices have out grown my intrest in some of the more uncommon types of insignia and I don't feel the need to own something Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blacksmith Posted February 1, 2018 Share #8 Posted February 1, 2018 Agreed, this forum is not the gateway to eBay. Collectors that I know check it frequently (read, daily +), more often getting app alerts. So, I'm not sure that posting an auction here increases 'foot traffic' measurably. Also, $1300 for any patch seems like a lot to me. As Ron said more eloquently, prices on this stuff seem to be in a back-slide, for a host of reasons. I'd say this patch sold for what the market currently bears. Hardcore patch collectors knew what it was, as bidders simply thinking "cool patch" aren't dropping $1000+ on it. So, the partnering pin didn't seem to be a factor. $20 would have been a sleeper, $1300 seems like a fair price - albeit less than 'bubble prices' of yore. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patchcollector Posted February 1, 2018 Share #9 Posted February 1, 2018 I saw the OSS patch on eBay and was going to investigate further then got sidetracked and forgot about it until I saw it mentioned here.I'm glad it was posted as I did want to see the outcome of the auction.I agree about it not really being a "sleeper".Most patch collectors will recognize that OSS patch.I know I instantly did and I don't regard myself as a super advanced collector.As a few others have already stated,my take is that it sold for what the current market was willing to pay.I state "current",because as we all know,the eBay winds change daily and auctions can end with hugely fluctuating prices depending on who's bidding.I think that the true "sleepers" are the ones that come from the really obscure units that not many recognize.The OSS was a secret organization during the War but I don't think that it qualifies as a little known,obscure unit nowadays. Some time back I picked up a Vietnam war piece for a Counter Intel Signals Unit.I got it for around 25 bucks because I believe that no one(myself included) knew much about it.It was only when I did some digging for info that I realized the rarity of the patch.I consider that piece to be a true "sleeper". As far as prices go,long ago I set a price of around 400 as the most I would pay for a patch.That limit is tailored to suit my budget,and over the years I've stayed within the parameters I set for the most part.It's not that I feel that certain patches aren't worth more than 400,it's just the upper limit of what I'm willing to pay.If the deeper pocketed collectors want to shell out thousands for a patch,then have at it because this is the way a free market works. I've settled nicely into the what I consider the mid level of the hobby and I'm happy to reside there.I enjoy looking at the "grail" pieces but I'm content with what I have in my personal collection. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manayunkman Posted February 1, 2018 Share #10 Posted February 1, 2018 What does the back look like? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tonomachi Posted February 1, 2018 Share #11 Posted February 1, 2018 What does the back look like? Here you go for future reference. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mortaydc60 Posted February 1, 2018 Author Share #12 Posted February 1, 2018 Thanks for showing the back. This view perhaps shows why some who looked at this had to really look very closely before committing to place bid. Thoughts like could it be a new retro,etc had to enter their minds since they were going to committ a large sum of money with basically seeing only half the patch. Trust me they did some serious research and checked all the old info on this patch many times because I know I did. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manayunkman Posted February 1, 2018 Share #13 Posted February 1, 2018 The back doesn't look white enough with too much black return thread. From my understanding only one manufacturer made these. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mortaydc60 Posted February 3, 2018 Author Share #14 Posted February 3, 2018 Not sure what you are saying in the above post; are you questioning if it is real? Understand that the big problem atleast for me was the black paper on the back blocking clear view of back of patch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manayunkman Posted February 3, 2018 Share #15 Posted February 3, 2018 I had 3 of these with that amount of black return thread, not to be confused by the black paper. This was in 2007 and I listed them on eBay. I was told by several collectors that only one company made them and that they had less black return thread on the back. I was then refered to a site that specialized in rare patches and there was a WW2 OSS patch there showing the whiter reverse. I do not remember the name of the site but everyone knows about it and the gentleman who runs it is well respected. Is his name Hugh? Other than that experience I have nothing else to offer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ocsfollowme Posted February 3, 2018 Share #16 Posted February 3, 2018 This is the site you are speaking of http://www.insigne.org/OSS-summary.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ocsfollowme Posted February 3, 2018 Share #17 Posted February 3, 2018 Pat Daniels shared his Sorry about the giant size of the pictures. I am not computer savvy, to say the least, and I did reduce the file size to around 40-50kb. Here is a real OSS spearhead patch (left) pictured next to a Marston "copy" and a 502nd PIR S-2 patch. http://www.usmilitariaforum.com/forums/index.php?/topic/227563-sugamo-prison-patch-imtfe-war-crimes-trials-patch/?hl=%2Bharbor+%2Bnet+%2Btender&do=findComment&comment=1807631 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ocsfollowme Posted February 3, 2018 Share #18 Posted February 3, 2018 The person who bought the OP insignia is a highly advanced collector. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manayunkman Posted February 3, 2018 Share #19 Posted February 3, 2018 I just checked the site and that is the one I was thinking of. The one you show Steve has more black return thread than the one that sold on eBay. And is Hughes correct that only one company made just a few of these, 195 of which most were lost? Would return threads be different on each patch with such a short run? I'm not to sure about my information concerning the return threads now. Any pictures of mine are long gone but it's most likely that it should be more black thread on the back. I got it reversed, mine were whiter on the back but still fully embroidered. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ocsfollowme Posted February 3, 2018 Share #20 Posted February 3, 2018 Return threads can surely be different. There was an ASMIC article on WW2 Washington District that had a chain of uncut insignia. Their reverse all differed from 100% white to 50% white return threads. I had an Official Photographer patch that have of the reverse was 100% snow back and the other have was heavy black. It depends on the tension of the return threads. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patchcollector Posted February 4, 2018 Share #21 Posted February 4, 2018 I'm not seeing much if any difference in the patches in posts #'s 11 and 17 (the real one on the left in post # 17),so based on that comparison I would agree that the OP piece is authentic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Montana40 Posted June 23, 2018 Share #22 Posted June 23, 2018 I am one of those who was hooked on the Marsten Copy. The patch is on twill as described previously and came with very credible documentation. 1. a Notorized copy of a handwritten letter indicating that the patch was removed by the owner from his uniform. The Owner is verified to be a member of the OSS stationed with the HQ & HQ detachment in Washington D.C. 2. A Notorized copy of the owners DD214. 3. OSS vets documentation. 4. OSS org. chart. 5. Copy of Vets Obit. I certainly don't question the credibility of the original owner as there is no doubt that the documentation was provided with the original patch. But whoever was the original recipient or purchaser of the original patch used the documentation to sell the Marsten Copy (s). I paid $225 for the patch and documentation and still have the patch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HOF Posted July 1, 2018 Share #23 Posted July 1, 2018 This is in the CIA Museum. Based on this thread, I don't think it is correct? It is twill. They do not have a picture of the back. What do you all think? Is it real? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mortaydc60 Posted July 1, 2018 Author Share #24 Posted July 1, 2018 This opens the door to Marston version being a possible valid period example or just another example of museums not being that authoritarian. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tredhed2 Posted July 1, 2018 Share #25 Posted July 1, 2018 Twill = shill. Period. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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