Jump to content

Question for Reenactors


Recommended Posts

This thread has given me lots to think about especially since I'm trying to form a living history group in North Texas based on my Father's doings in the 101st LRRP. With the DD214/books/info/etc about him, I can accurately portray his service.

Link to post
Share on other sites
Unless they are wearing their fathers or grandfathers original exact uniform, it is quite illegal here in the states to wear a valor award without actually earning it.
First off, I have no idea where this "My family member won it so I'm wearing it" thing came from but it's really common. If someone is going to give you a ration of it for wearing something, they WON'T CARE that a family member earned it. Really, they won't! But as for the legality, there's really NO law against wearing almost any award at a WW2 re-enactment as you're not passing yourself as a person who was awarded a WW2 decoration. It's the same as for theatrical stuff. Tom Hanks didn't get arrested for wearing a MoH while filming "Forrest Gump," now did he? A review of 18 U.S.C. 702 and 10 U.S.C. 772 (f) will show that the interpretation from SCHACHT v. UNITED STATES, 398 U.S. 58 (1970) is that any theatrical production would include pretty much anything where you're not trying to pass yourself off as the real deal. A WW2 uniform would clearly fall into that heading (with I guess the possible exception of a person over 80 years old wearing the uniform saying he earned the awards when in fact he never did).
Most reenactments have rules forbidding the wearing of awards not earned.
Not many of them. They'd of course discourage it and other folks would raise a big stink but I've never seen that officially recognized by any re-enactment group. Banning awards would be kind of foolish as that would include jump wings for the 506th group that seems to be in almost every re-enacting organization.
Link to post
Share on other sites

Looks like I tripped a wire with this question. Still think it's nutty to wear valor awards, no matter what you're doing, if you weren't awarded them. And, you can't really compare a reenactor standing around in a uniform to a guy in a movie. Tom Hanks didn't walk around the streets of San Francisco with the Medal of Honor on between takes, did he? Besides, what good is it doing wearing these things? Why are some of these dudes REALLY wearing valor medals? Is it to preserve history, or to play dress up and Pretend to be someone they aren't?

Link to post
Share on other sites
Looks like I tripped a wire with this question. Still think it's nutty to wear valor awards, no matter what you're doing, if you weren't awarded them. And, you can't really compare a reenactor standing around in a uniform to a guy in a movie. Tom Hanks didn't walk around the streets of San Francisco with the Medal of Honor on between takes, did he? Besides, what good is it doing wearing these things? Why are some of these dudes REALLY wearing valor medals? Is it to preserve history, or to play dress up and Pretend to be someone they aren't?

 

I reenact to preserve the history. When I educate people about Glider Pilots, which is really an all-but-lost history of 6,000 men out of countless others, I wear the proper uniform with proper insignia, wings, and Flight Officer bars. HOWEVER my grandfather's valor medals I DO NOT WEAR. He would most certainly not like me wearing them, even if I was portraying a pilot.

 

I could never live up to be half the man that he was, or countless other veterans were; real men's men, so I won't run around and pretend like I can. Anyone who thinks they can with no record of military service is a fool.

Link to post
Share on other sites
Revolution Rising
Funny how the Civil War re-enactor guys never have to deal with this, huh? :blink:

Yeah I suppose we got the lucky end of this since there were so few valor medals back then. I do CW, and to honor two of my ancestors who fought inthe same reg't, I wear a red star corps badge (1st brigade, 1st division, 12th and later 20th corps). My current reenacting regiment was in the 9th corps during the war, and some of the guys who think they're oh so historically accurate (despite their personal A-frame, officer sized tents) decided to get on me about it. Needless to say I told them off.

 

As for more modern medals... if you haven't earned it, I don't think you should wear it. The only way I could POSSIBLY see an exception to this is 1.) if you are/were in the service yourself and were awarded that medal, or 2.) you have received the permission of the person who was awarded the medal. For instance, my grandpa was in WWII. If I were to reenact WWII and wanted to wear medals, I would go to him and ask if, since I'm honoring him, it would be okay if I wore his medals.

 

He gave me some of his fatigues from the national guard (he was career enlisted) and I took all the patches off except for the last name, simply because, to me, it's not right to wear a rank you haven't earned. Let alone medals for valor.

Link to post
Share on other sites

"First off, I have no idea where this "My family member won it so I'm wearing it" thing came from but it's really common."

As for the family member thing it goes along with the British custom of wearing your family member’s medals in honor of them. Such as when I wear my grandfathers medals for ANZAC day for my visit to his graveside.

 

"If someone is going to give you a ration of it for wearing something, they WON'T CARE that a family member earned it. Really, they won't!"

Sounds like you have a right to your opinion then, as much as I have to wear my family members medals in honor of them.

 

"It's the same as for theatrical stuff. Tom Hanks didn't get arrested for wearing a MoH while filming "Forrest Gump," now did he?"

Actually Most if not all the Medals used in the Hollywood movies are fakes, such as the ones I was wearing in Gardens of stone. They were plastic gold colored poker chip medals not the real ones.

 

 

"They'd of course discourage it and other folks would raise a big stink but I've never seen that officially recognized by any re-enactment group. Banning awards would be kind of foolish as that would include jump wings for the 506th group that seems to be in almost every re-enacting organization."

Depends upon which groups you associate with, some don't and some do care.

 

 

“But as for the legality, there's really NO law against wearing almost any award at a WW2 re-enactment as you're not passing yourself as a person who was awarded a WW2 decoration.” "A review of 18 U.S.C. 702 and 10 U.S.C. 772 (f) will show that the interpretation from SCHACHT v. UNITED STATES, 398 U.S. 58 (1970) is that any theatrical production would include pretty much anything where you're not trying to pass yourself off as the real deal. A WW2 uniform would clearly fall into that heading (with I guess the possible exception of a person over 80 years old wearing the uniform saying he earned the awards when in fact he never did). Not many of them."

 

 

The Stolen Valor Act of 2005 (the Act), signed into law by President George W. Bush on December 20, 2006, is a U.S. law that broadens the provisions of previous U.S. law addressing the unauthorized wear, manufacture, sale or claim (either written or verbal) of any military decorations and medals. It is a federal misdemeanor offense, which carries a punishment of imprisonment for not more than 1 year and/or a fine; the scope previously covered only the Medal of Honor.

 

The Act was first introduced in the U.S. House of Representatives on July 19, 2005 by Representative John Salazar, a Democrat from Colorado, as H.R. 3352. It was introduced into the Senate by Senator Kent Conrad, a Democrat from North Dakota, on November 10, 2005 as S. 1998.The Senate version was passed unanimously on September 7, 2006. The Senate version then went to the same House Judiciary Committee that held the House version. The Act briefly stalled, but the House subsequently passed the Senate version, S. 1998, on December 6, 2006.

 

The purpose of the Act is to strengthen the provisions of 18 U.S.C. § 704 by broadening its scope and strengthening penalties. Specific new provisions in the Act include: granting more authority to Federal law enforcement officers, extending scope beyond the Medal of Honor, broadening the law to cover false claims whereas previously an overt act had to be committed, covering mailing and shipping of medals, and protecting the reputation and meaning of military heroism medals. The law Under the act, it is illegal to wear, buy, sell, barter, trade or manufacture "any decoration or medal authorized by Congress for the armed forces of the United States, or any of the service medals or badges awarded to the members of such forces." In the 18 months after act was enacted, the Chicago Tribune estimates 20 prosecutions and the number is increasing as awareness about the law spreads.

Link to post
Share on other sites

"Banning awards would be kind of foolish as that would include jump wings for the 506th group that seems to be in almost every re-enacting organization."

 

 

By the By,

“Jump Wings” are a Skill badge not an Award;

 

(AR 670-1)

29–13. Badges authorized for wear on Army uniforms

A badge is awarded to an individual for identification purposes, or for attaining a special skill or proficiency. The

criteria for the award of Army badges are contained in AR 600–8–22, and in NGR 601–1 for Army National Guard

 

Parachutist Badge (Basic)

To be eligible for award of the basic Parachutist Badge, an individual must have satisfactorily completed the prescribed proficiency tests while assigned or attached to an airborne unit or the Airborne Department of the Infantry School, or have participated in at least one combat parachute jump as follows:

 

1. A member of an organized force carrying out an assigned tactical mission for which the unit was credited with an airborne assault landing by the theater commander.

2. While engaged in military operations involving conflict with an opposing foreign force.

3. While serving with friendly foreign forces engaged in an armed conflict against an opposing armed force in which the United States is not a belligerent party.

 

So in fact As long as the “Farb” fell out of a plane…………

Link to post
Share on other sites
"First off, I have no idea where this "My family member won it so I'm wearing it" thing came from but it's really common."

As for the family member thing it goes along with the British custom of wearing your family member’s medals in honor of them. Such as when I wear my grandfathers medals for ANZAC day for my visit to his graveside.

 

"If someone is going to give you a ration of it for wearing something, they WON'T CARE that a family member earned it. Really, they won't!"

Sounds like you have a right to your opinion then, as much as I have to wear my family members medals in honor of them.

 

If I'm not mistaken, the "correct" tradtion in Great Britain is to wear the medals of family members on the opposite (left?) side they'd be worn by the actual recipient, and only if such person is deceased, right? You don't just stick them on and go trotting around wearing the good man's medals and expect that nobody will question it, do you?

Link to post
Share on other sites
If I'm not mistaken, the "correct" tradition in Great Britain is to wear the medals of family members on the opposite (left?) side they'd be worn by the actual recipient, and only if such person is deceased, right? You don't just stick them on and go trotting around wearing the good man's medals and expect that nobody will question it, do you?

 

Nope, wouldn't dream of it, I just wear them the days when I visit Opa's gravesite.

Yes I do wear them on the opposite breast with a black ribbon on them.

The core of the argument is whether or not you can wear them at all.

Far too many times you have yo-yo's out there that just slap them on and parade around with them, trying to pass them off as there own.

Those kind of people are usually the ones with an inferiority problem in their life.

As for my reenactment uniform, I wear the absolute minimum on it as I like to portray a private. The usual comment I get is that I am far too old for portraying a private. I tell them I just got busted down.

I’ll leave the commanding troops in the field to the armchair generals in the hobby who like to do it.

Link to post
Share on other sites

 

Nope, wouldn't dream of it, I just wear them the days when I visit Opa's gravesite.

Yes I do wear them on the opposite breast with a black ribbon on them.

The core of the argument is whether or not you can wear them at all.

Far too many times you have yo-yo's out there that just slap them on and parade around with them, trying to pass them off as there own.

Those kind of people are usually the ones with an inferiority problem in their life.

As for my reenactment uniform, I wear the absolute minimum on it as I like to portray a private. The usual comment I get is that I am far too old for portraying a private. I tell them I just got busted down.

I’ll leave the commanding troops in the field to the armchair generals in the hobby who like to do it.

 

Now, I have no problem with the black band and wearing his medals to the grave. Great way to honor his memory and his service. That's touching, at a time when so few even care to hang on to medals their grandparents were awarded in combat.

 

I agree -- these clowns in uniforms pretending is bad for everyone, even reenactors. If it weren't for scumbags like this, this discussion wouldn't be necessary at all.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Here is food for thought,

Both the ARCOM and Bronze Star can be awarded for non-valor actions, the same way a good conduct or achievement medal can be awarded.

You see plenty of people her on this list an elsewhere that have no problem with a Good conduct being worn but, scream at the site of somebody wearing a Bronze Star.

Now a bronze star with “V” for value device is an entirely different story……

 

3-13. Bronze Star Medal

a. The Bronze Star Medal was established by Executive Order 9419, 4 February 1944 (superseded by Executive Order 11046, 24 August 1962).

b. The Bronze Star Medal is awarded to any person who, while serving in any capacity in or with the Army of the United States after 6 December 1941, distinguished himself or herself by heroic or meritorious achievement or service, not involving participation in aerial flight, in connection with military operations against an armed enemy; or while engaged in military operations involving conflict with an opposing armed force in which the United States is not a belligerent party.

c. Awards may be made for acts of heroism, performed under circumstances described above, which are of lesser degree than required for the award of the Silver Star.

d. The Bronze Star Medal may be awarded for meritorious achievement or meritorious service according to the following:

(1) Awards may be made to recognize single acts of merit or meritorious service. The lesser degree than that required for the award of the Legion of Merit must nevertheless have been meritorious and accomplished with distinction.

(2) Award may be made by letter application to Commander, ARPERCEN, ATTN: DARP-VSE-A, 9700 Page Boulevard, St. Louis, MO 63132-5200 (enclosing documentary evidence, if possible), to each member of the Armed Forces of the United States who after 6 December 1941, has been cited in orders or awarded a certificate for exemplary conduct in ground combat against an armed enemy between 7 December 1941 and 2 September 1945, inclusive, or whose meritorious achievement has been other wise confirmed by documents executed prior to 1 July 1947. For this purpose, an award of the Combat Infantryman Badge or Combat Medical Badge is considered as a citation in orders. Documents executed since 4 August 1944 in connection with recommendations for the award of decorations of higher degree than the Bronze Star Medal will not be used as the basis for an award under this paragraph.

(3) Upon letter application, award of the Bronze Star Medal may be made to eligible soldiers who participated in the Philippine Islands Campaign between 7 December 1941 to 10 May 1942. Performance of duty must have been on the island of Luzon or the Harbor Defenses in Corregidor and Bataan. Only soldiers who were awarded the Distinguished Unit Citation (Presidential Unit Citation) may be awarded this decoration. Letter application should be sent to the Commander, ARPERCEN, ATTN: DARP-VSE-A, 9700 Page Boulevard, St. Louis, MO 63132-5200.

 

3-16. Army Commendation Medal

a. The Army Commendation Medal (ARCOM) was established by War Department Circular 377, 18 December 1945 (amended in DA General Orders 10, 31 March 1960).

b. The ARCOM is awarded to any member of the Armed Forces of the United States who, while serving in any capacity with the Army after 6 December 1941, distinguishes himself or herself by heroism, meritorious achievement or meritorious service. Award may be made to a member of the Armed Forces of a friendly foreign nation who, after 1 June 1962, distinguishes himself or herself by an act of heroism, extraordinary achievement, or meritorious service which has been of mutual benefit to a friendly nation and the United States.

c. Awards of the ARCOM may be made for acts of valor performed under circumstances described above which are of lesser degree than required for award of the Bronze Star Medal. These acts may involve aerial flight.

d. An award of the ARCOM may be made for acts of noncombatant-related heroism which do not meet the requirements for an award of the Soldier's Medal.

e. The ARCOM will not be awarded to general officers.

f. Awards of the ARCOM may be made on letter application to Commander, ARPERCEN, ATTN DARP-VSE-A, 9700 Page Boulevard, St. Louis, MO 63132-5200, to any individual commended after 6 December 1941 and before 1 January 1946 in a letter, certificate, or order of commendation, as distinguished from letter of appreciation, signed by an officer in the grade or position of a major general or higher. Awards of the Army Commendation Ribbon and of the Commendation Ribbon with Metal Pendant were redesignated by DA General Orders 10, 31 March 1960, as awards of the Army Commendation Medal, without amendment of orders previously issued.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Other than the awards that the unit earned, the ribbons on my 4 pocket are my modern ribbons. This has drawn the ire of some of the "holyer than thows" out there. But when called on it, I simply look the accuser in the eye and say " Sir these are mine, I earned these" If this makes me a farb so be it. I have never gotten a complaint from the vets. Hell most of them think that exchange is rather amusing.... Who are we doing this for anyways? Ourselves or the vets?

 

Besides, how often do we ware our class A's anyways?

Link to post
Share on other sites

I just recalled a discussion I had with the guys in my first WW2 unit back in the early 90s. All of us started out in Civil War and a few did Indian Wars. I had some Span-Am once at that point. We joked about wearing the campaign ribbons for THOSE time periods just to see if anyone would know what the heck they were.

I can't help but wonder if there's a forum somewhere that the German guys are arguing how their active duty awards translate to Third Reich medals? I do know I overheard an argument between "huns" at FIG one year where one thought he had more of a right to wear the Russian Front Medal (AKA: the "frozen meat medal") because he'd actually been to Russia in the winter (as an exchange student).

DE_Winterschlacht_1.jpg

The others didn't see it that way. Go figure.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Interesting discussion.

 

Question:

 

Do any of the branches, DoD or VA or anyone else have any kind of regulations that they pass on to dischargees or anyone else about this?

 

I'm not talking about "Stolen Valor" laws... but rather wondering about any long existing regs.

Link to post
Share on other sites
Interesting discussion.

 

Question:

 

Do any of the branches, DoD or VA or anyone else have any kind of regulations that they pass on to dischargees or anyone else about this?

 

I'm not talking about "Stolen Valor" laws... but rather wondering about any long existing regs.

 

When I retired, they gave me a pamphlet of information saying I wasn't supposed to wear my uniform to political events / religious events, stuff like that -- anything that could be perceived as "biased" in one way or another. I assume the same goes for medals and such, but nothing about whether or not I could wear my medals on civillian attire.

 

However, nothing I read anywhere said that I had free right to go out and buy Silver Stars and Distinguished Service Crosses and put them on a WWII uniform and call myself a living history actor.

 

Perhaps for some reenactors who don't see it as a big problem, or the guy who says it's a problem with guys "Under 50" they don't know or don't remember if they did serve, the big problem of (usually BOOT) troops buying what we called "Libo Stacks" -- large racks of ribbons worn while on off-base liberty or leave. I've seen it happen a few times, where a kid will go home on leave, and stop off at the PX on his way out the gate and buy a big stack of ribbons to wear on his uniform when he goes home in hopes that the perception of heroism will get him laid, or free drinks, or respect from his high school chums, that sort of thing. Well, 9 chances out of 10, that kid gets found out and either brought up on charges, NJP, or just a good ol' fashioned butt -whipping. In my younger days, before I sobered up for good, I can remember slapping unearned ribbons off of guys in uniform at the Marine Corps ball and other such events in dress uniform.

 

The plain and simple fact of the matter, regardless of Law, age, reason for doing it, etc, is that medals awarded for combat service are for combat vets. If you haven't earned them, you shouldn't wear them. It's just bad form. And Like I said before, there's NO reason a reenactor even needs to wear full dress uniform complete with valor medals. What's the point of reenacting in dress uniform? We hardly ever even wear dress uniforms w/ ribbons -- it's cammies, and before that it was fatigues. Reenactors reenact combat, right? So, put on your combat utilities and hop around in the woods playing army -- that's fine, but don't slap on ribbons you haven't earned and then get surprised or offended when someone calls you on it.

Link to post
Share on other sites
Perhaps for some reenactors who don't see it as a big problem, or the guy who says it's a problem with guys "Under 50" they don't know or don't remember if they did serve, the big problem of (usually BOOT) troops buying what we called "Libo Stacks" -- large racks of ribbons worn while on off-base liberty or leave. I've seen it happen a few times, where a kid will go home on leave, and stop off at the PX on his way out the gate and buy a big stack of ribbons to wear on his uniform when he goes home in hopes that the perception of heroism will get him laid, or free drinks, or respect from his high school chums, that sort of thing. Well, 9 chances out of 10, that kid gets found out and either brought up on charges, NJP, or just a good ol' fashioned butt -whipping. In my younger days, before I sobered up for good, I can remember slapping unearned ribbons off of guys in uniform at the Marine Corps ball and other such events in dress uniform.
We had a guy who did just that. He made the huge mistake of being photographed for the hometown paper, which the family of another solider of mine read and clipped the article and mailed it to another of my people with a "Do you know this guy, it says he's in your unit?" message. The other soldier didn't like this guy so it 'mysteriously' got into the hands of the 1st SGT and Company Commander. Yeah, not too many brand new 63Ws right out of Ordnance AIT have a CIB and a Silver star in peacetime (pre-9-11). I'd bet he's still doing pushups somewhere, Top was THAT mad at him. I was Company Safety Officer (among other additional duties) at the time and did the weekly safety briefing. Among the normal topics the week we all found out about the photo, (use protection, don't drink and drive, etc), I said that wearing awards you didn't earn can be even more hazardous to your health. That got a good chuckle.
Link to post
Share on other sites

Legally,both by UCMJ and civilian standards,the only time a veteran can wear his uniform is Memorial and Armistice (Veteran's) Days, ( this is the reason for the ruptured duck)That being said it is also unenforced.

On the rare occasions as a reenactor that I wear dress uniform I wear only the awards I was given,unless I am portraying a specific person,ie Col. Sink at which time I wear what he did,the other notable exception is the PUC which is awarded to the unit and not the individual. I hardly believe a case can be made of anyone in a 65 plus year old uniform ( which by the way is not legally even a uniform ) whom is not by any stretch of the imagination old enough to have been even alive during WW2 to be claiming they earned these awards.Any more then the teacher who strolls into the classroom as say Abe Lincoln can be believed to be honest Abe himself,yet he is doing as we do in trying to educate. First-person interpretation is an effective tool and is recognised as such by many historical sites and military units,such as The Old Guard and educational facilities.

I however do not think anyone should heedlessly just pin on awards or try to gather accolades to which they are not deserving. Keep in mind though that it is the person and their acts which are worthy and needful of our reverence and not some hunk of metal and cloth! The men make the medals special not the medals the men!!!!!

 

I hope not to have pissed in anyone's Wheaties nor was I of a mind to do so!! I shall now vacate the soapbox which I have so vociferously ensconced myself upon and shall fade to the woodwork......

Link to post
Share on other sites

My unit is reexamining our stance on this, and here is where we stand (so far):

 

Class A Uniform is reserved for the following:

* Memorial Day activities (we host and organize the event for the veterans & active Division & provide Color Guard, Salute team, wreath bearers, etc)

* Veterans Day activities if requested and approved

* Funerals, when requested by the deceased's family only (Color Guard, Pall Bearer, etc)

* other approved Color Guard activities

We are still debating other formal events - dances, etc

 

Rank worn reflects rank within the unit. We are all EM - no officers except female Nurses & Chaplain (except our active-duty and retired members who held a commission. They can wear any rank they earned while in service, but do not have command authority except on ceremonial occasions. Having a LtC in charge of a Color detail is cool, and always gets approval from our dignitaries, including those from Pentagon, DoD, etc!)

 

Ribbon bars permitted are limited to:

* Good Conduct - if with the reenacting unit 3 years or longer or if earned in active or reserve service in Army, Navy, Marine, Air Force or Coast Guard

* ETO (as this is where the unit served, and is worn in honor of the the men who served there)

* WWII Victory (as above)

* any other award, badge or insignia if earned in active or reserve service in Army, Navy, Marine, Air Force or Coast Guard AND if the award was available prior to November 1945

 

SSI as required for the unit (patch & tab both for 10th Mountain)

DI as required for the unit - to WWII specifications (87th MIR only)

 

Combat SSI - still being debated, but probably ONLY if earned in military service.

C.I.B. & C.M.B. - still being debated, but probably ONLY if earned in military service

Marksmanship - if earned (we do have live-fire events where a member can qualify on select weapons on military range)

Re-up stripes - ONLY if earned in military service

Overseas stripes - ONLY if earned in military service

Wound Stripes - not permitted

WWI Service Chevron - not permitted

 

We obtained written permission from DoD, Dept of the Army and CoS of the Division to wear the SSI, DI, etc without restriction as long as it is not on a currently issued uniform, not wearing any un-earned Valor awards and not claiming to be active-dute personnel. We have assisted the Division in providing a full Color Guard kitted out with WWII Class A uniforms for select events, and they have adopted our standards as theirs.

 

The only non-reg item is that we also wear an approved name badge over the right breast pocket indicating the wearer is in a Living History unit, so there is no doubt about afiliation.

 

In Class C or field uniform, we wear rank and SSI as a concession to the viewing public, who expect to see something. It is done acknowledging that it was NOT done in combat, but was commonly found on uniforms in training and post-war (based on photographic evidence). Rank is assigned based on duties & service within the unit, with the exception of PFC, which is authorized after 1 year of service within the unit.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Interesting topic. My father is a 22 year Army vet. Vietnam, MP, NATO and probably a few more that I will never know about. His fruit salad is visible from space. I am a 5 year Navy vet, Good Conduct, 1st Gulf War, Submarines, Strategic Tactical Nuclear Patrols etc etc etc... I never fired a shot in anger, but dad did enough for the both of us.

 

I reenact WWII and would definitely wear ribbons that I earned (or the equivalent). If my impression (infantry or mechanic) would have had a certain award, I would wear the CORRECT awards/ribbons for the impression. Did I earn a CIB? Of course not, but at any event I want to portray the CORRECT uniform. If you are going to bitch about a front vs rear seam helmet, then I am going to wear what a common infantry soldier would have worn. No, no Purple Hearts, Stars for Valor or other 'above and beyond' awards... but if the ribbon/award is for simply 'being in a certain place for a certain amount of time' ala CIB then it would be MORE correct to wear it that not.

 

Lastly, the EVENT ORGANIZER has to have the stones to give a warning then kick ANY reenactor (even if its their buddy) at an event. Policing ourselves is the absolutely best way to handle it.. but I highly doubt that will happen.

Link to post
Share on other sites
NobleLoyalGSD
If you are going to bitch about a front vs rear seam helmet, then I am going to wear what a common infantry soldier would have worn. No, no Purple Hearts, Stars for Valor or other 'above and beyond' awards... but if the ribbon/award is for simply 'being in a certain place for a certain amount of time' ala CIB then it would be MORE correct to wear it that not.

 

Lastly, the EVENT ORGANIZER has to have the stones to give a warning then kick ANY reenactor (even if its their buddy) at an event. Policing ourselves is the absolutely best way to handle it.. but I highly doubt that will happen.

 

I've been reluctant to weigh in on this topic. It's a rather delicate one and quite passionate as well, but I had to acknowledge the above statement: I agree, well spoken.

 

Indeed, when front or rear seams become paramount to authenticity, then a CIB is also an integral part of the accurate portrayal of any combat infantryman. I also agree with the above regarding NOT wearing valorous awards for the reasons given.

 

The context in which awards, ribbons, medals, badges, patches, and uniforms are worn is the key. If someone at the top of an exit ramp or at my favorite intersection were to solicit money from me claiming to be a homeless veteran, complete with CIB or whatever, but who really wasn't...well, I would loath the SOB to say the least. That goes for the guys who just slip on an old BDU shirt or trousers to bolster their ruse.

 

But I can't find fault or dishonor in someone who wants to create an honest, authentic representation or portrayal of a soldier, sailor, airman, or marine from an era gone by. Even more so when it is done out of respect or admiration for one's service. Whether or not a particular veteran approves will have to be resolved within him or herself.

 

Anyway, this is nevertheless a great philosophical topic and I've enjoyed reading the diverse thoughts and opinions.

 

~Jeff

Link to post
Share on other sites

You'll find good and bad wherever you go......but the few times I did WW2 it was with the old 4th Armored. We had tanks and halftracks....not an elite unit...just portraying GI's in an armored infantry regt.

 

I would never think of wearing anything on class A's other than unit insignia. You don't need the ribbons.

 

Look at some of the quality hardcore groups:

 

http://wwiiadt.org/

 

http://2ndsquad.tripod.com/

 

 

There are lots of good hardcore units out there for almost any war.

Link to post
Share on other sites
Armed 2 tha Teeth

Dirt doesn't make you hardcore and isn't a substitute for doing things correctly. However it does help a well researched and displayed impression look better.

 

The 1919a6 has an Israeli carrying handle and bipod.

post-763-1228248654.jpg

 

 

That is an old website, their newest in www.2ndsquad.com

 

The same could be said for using ribbons, when used correctly they make a thoroughly researched impression look it's best.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Good eye on the -a6. Its stuff like this that should be called on, and the event organizer or the Allied commander should have taken action to correct it. Either make it right or make it go away. Yes, USGI -a6 rigs are hard to find and expensive. Yes, M2 tripods are expensive and a *little* hard to find. I would say that the carry handle is not 'Israeli' but late war. Early war would be the U shaped handle.

 

My USGI -a6 kit has one... and its in the TM.

 

a6parts.jpg

 

Yes, my barrel is from the 50's (the eagle acceptance stamp) I have a -a4 barrel turned down to a -a6 for reenacting.

 

I'll agree that its a little different with awards for VALOR. But Sleeve hashes for time in service, CIB, Marksman badges etc are not really in the same realm of a Purple Heart, Bronze/Silver Stars etc.

 

As for the units that claim to be 'uber accurate' to me that means they have a tunnel vision of wartime supply.

 

But that's another discussion.

Link to post
Share on other sites
http://atthefront.com/rants_LH.htm

 

Not specifically pertaining to this w/ the medals and such, but still a very good read.

 

Were can I live in a foxhole for two days and bust caps!!!!!!! I would love to march in and have only what I carry. Run an event like that and I'm there dude.

 

Yeah, I'm old (39) big (6'1") fat (closer to 300 than 200) but have absolutely no problem humping a 1919 all day just to sit in a hole and see what walks by.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

By using this site, you agree to our Terms of Use.