kcmo Posted March 26, 2017 Share #1 Posted March 26, 2017 All, Just got this at auction and in I've searching the forum trying to educate myself on it but wasn't 100% sure if this is an M1923 belt or an earlier WWI model. There are no markings anywhere on it to include the black metal portions, inside pockets or on the material. I also could confirm the differences on the buckles between WWI and WWII. Any information would be appreciated. Thanks for your time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robinb Posted March 26, 2017 Share #2 Posted March 26, 2017 It's a WW1 model. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cololab Posted March 26, 2017 Share #3 Posted March 26, 2017 Agree it's WWI. I have one that looks just like it, and if I recall the only marking is a 1918 date on the belt that separates the pocket sections. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
'Flage Guy Posted March 26, 2017 Share #4 Posted March 26, 2017 Heckuva Belt you scored there- well done! This type of Belt, often referred to as "stitched construction", was made by R.H. Long, Plant Bros., and L.C. Chase in the early part of the 20th century, and was a simpler design from the Mills "woven pocket" Belts. Looks like you might have to do a little poking around to find the maker stamp and date. Below is a Belt like yours (except that it's a Dismounted Belt), made by the Chase Company in March of 1918, with the stamps on the inner side of the flaps. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
'Flage Guy Posted March 26, 2017 Share #5 Posted March 26, 2017 Here is a Plant Brothers Dismounted Belt, with "LEFT" and "RIGHT" under the company stamp on the inside of the pocket itself. This is applied in the 2nd pocket on each side. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
'Flage Guy Posted March 26, 2017 Share #6 Posted March 26, 2017 Here is the stamp on the adjustment strap that Cololab mentioned, the date of which appears to be "AUG. 1918". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kcmo Posted March 27, 2017 Author Share #7 Posted March 27, 2017 All, Thanks for the info. I did not check the inside of the pockets for a stamp. If I find one I'll post it. Thanks again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kcmo Posted March 27, 2017 Author Share #8 Posted March 27, 2017 Flage Guy, You were spot on. It was in the 2nd pocket on the right. On the dismounted it is the first pocket on the left. I never would have thought to look there as it has always been stamped on the back or the flap of the pocket. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
'Flage Guy Posted March 28, 2017 Share #9 Posted March 28, 2017 Cool! Thanks for updating us!! Why they stamped them that way, I'll never know...I think Plant is the only contractor who did this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheMinistryOfAviation Posted March 30, 2017 Share #10 Posted March 30, 2017 And look how fresh the stamp is too being hidden away in that pocket! Well done! -Jeremy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
'Flage Guy Posted April 30, 2017 Share #11 Posted April 30, 2017 After this discussion, I looked over the W.W.I pile and realized there was no "sewn" Mounted Belt anywhere; plum forgot that I had 2 of them that were re-dyed for the Big One, one with a snap for the .45 Pouch and one without (the Dressing Pouch was re-dyed as well). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
'Flage Guy Posted April 30, 2017 Share #12 Posted April 30, 2017 "L.C. Chase" stamps still very visible on one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
'Flage Guy Posted April 30, 2017 Share #13 Posted April 30, 2017 Went into a panic realizing there was no stitched Mounted Belt in the early stuff, so snagged this "Plant Bros." along with a Pouch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
'Flage Guy Posted April 30, 2017 Share #14 Posted April 30, 2017 The left side is stamped inside the pocket like ours are, but the right is stamped like most others are, on the back side. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
'Flage Guy Posted April 30, 2017 Share #15 Posted April 30, 2017 Here is a detail of the difference between stitched and woven (lower) Belts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RustyCanteen Posted May 2, 2017 Share #16 Posted May 2, 2017 After this discussion, I looked over the W.W.I pile and realized there was no "sewn" Mounted Belt anywhere; plum forgot that I had 2 of them that were re-dyed for the Big One, one with a snap for the .45 Pouch and one without (the Dressing Pouch was re-dyed as well). Nice belts! I know in the past, some collectors have tended to look down at the re-dyed belts/pouches, but I kind of like them. The repairs on the upper belt flaps are 'character' RC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
'Flage Guy Posted May 2, 2017 Share #17 Posted May 2, 2017 Nice belts! I know in the past, some collectors have tended to look down at the re-dyed belts/pouches, but I kind of like them. The repairs on the upper belt flaps are 'character' RC Thanks, RC! Yeah, there was a time, many years ago, when I didn't like multi-colored or re-dyed web, but I just quickly developed a big appreciation for it, especially since it doesn't show up very often. And I definitely don't have anything against repaired gear- it's history, just like old surplus store price markings, tags, etc.. The re-dye pile, below...note the Mounted Mills Belt which had a 10th pocket fitted onto the left front. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RustyCanteen Posted May 4, 2017 Share #18 Posted May 4, 2017 Nice assortment of re-dyed stuff! We've had a few threads on the topic, one of which is here: http://www.usmilitariaforum.com/forums/index.php?/topic/6847-blancod-cartridge-belt-discussion-of-od-7-dyed-gear/ http://www.usmilitariaforum.com/forums/index.php?/topic/56578-m1917-cartridge-belt-redyed-od-7/ http://www.usmilitariaforum.com/forums/index.php?/topic/79948-m1910-cartridge-belt-mills-redyed/ http://www.usmilitariaforum.com/forums/index.php?/topic/175293-redyed-haversacks/ RC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bheskett Posted May 4, 2017 Share #19 Posted May 4, 2017 Here are a couple side by side shots of the Model 1918 mounted cartridge belt (sewn) and the M1923 mounted cartridge belt. The bottom pic is of the m1923 makers stamp. Bob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
'Flage Guy Posted May 5, 2017 Share #20 Posted May 5, 2017 Bob, great shots. Those Burlington M1923 Mounted Belts are really scarce. Below is one of only about a half dozen I've seen; all the components are dated '41 as well. One cool thing about yours is that it actually shows use! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bheskett Posted May 5, 2017 Share #21 Posted May 5, 2017 Thanks I liked that as well, the pocket flaps have some wear from the en bloc magazines. I have not seen any others other than the one I own. I bought it about 20 years a go for 125.00 (I think), but that was quite a bit for a belt back then. Not sure what they go for now but I imagine more than what I piad. Bob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
'Flage Guy Posted May 6, 2017 Share #22 Posted May 6, 2017 Thanks I liked that as well, the pocket flaps have some wear from the en bloc magazines. I have not seen any others other than the one I own. I bought it about 20 years a go for 125.00 (I think), but that was quite a bit for a belt back then. Not sure what they go for now but I imagine more than what I piad. Bob Yeah, they've gotta be up above that, as rare as they are. The earlier sewn and woven Mounted Belts don't seem to have commanded very high dough these days, except for the M1912 (?) Rifle Ring Belts. They've gone nuts in price. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baron3-6 Posted May 6, 2017 Share #23 Posted May 6, 2017 My understanding is that almost all M1923 mounted belts were made by Burlington Mills in 1941 (I think I saw a reference on this forum that a JQMD example or two has surfaced though). I have one that has been converted to dismounted with an OD7 pocket added.- Burlington Mills '41. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
'Flage Guy Posted May 6, 2017 Share #24 Posted May 6, 2017 Baron, I'd been told that Burlington was the only W.W.II contractor for these as well; now I'm gonna be snooping around for a Jeffersonville The madness never ends... The converted ones like you have are just as collectible as any of the others, IMO- especially if it's an off-shade addition. Pretty cool! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baron3-6 Posted May 8, 2017 Share #25 Posted May 8, 2017 Agree on the conversion being just as cool - Mine came from a local auctioneer friend who found it hanging on a nail in an old garage - didn't get the original owners name - but a copy of the 84th Div unit history was also found....so I'd like to think it saw some action with them. I looked on here and could not find the thread about the JQMD belts- it may have been posted somewhere else. I remember thinking - dang! I thought B-Mills was the only one! Of course JQMD makes sense because they did limited runs of a little bit of everything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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