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Help to ID (POW?) Ribbon?


obal7
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I picked up a grouping from a WW2 Vet's family... Sgt. Frank J. Michela ASN 37560231. He was with the 76th ID, I believe with the 304th IR.

I would like some help identifyting this "Black " Ribbon. I looks similar to a POW ribbon, but unlike others I have seen. While talking to Michela's family, they advised that he was captured, at one time by the Germans during WW2.

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

 

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It is a WW1 Occupation Medal ribbon bar. The theory is that many soldiers and units assumed the WW2 Occupation Medal would use the same ribbon design as the WW1 medal. The earlier ribbon bar is many times found on the uniforms of WW2 veterans who did not qualify for the WW1 medal.

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This is a FANTASTIC WWII Ike jacket to a soldier in the 76th Infantry Division's 104th Infantry Regiment. Carbine Phalen will be jumping up and down over this one!

 

The name of the medal that this ribbon represents is "The Occupation of Germany" medal. When it was announced in 1946 that there would be an occupation medal awarded, it was assumed by many that the order meant the Occupation of Germany medal to those forces that had occupied Germany. Of course, the WWII Occupation medals didn't come out until 1947, so many soldiers went home wearing the wrong ribbon.

 

I hope that you share this great Ike jacket and the veteran's story with us in more detail.

 

Allan

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Yes, I share this with Mr. Phalen. Matter of fact, I just purchased a 63rd Division Jacket from him. My dad was in the 63rdID 255th IR.

Yes. I will post some more info about this jacket and the Soldier.

Thanks for the info and the explanation about the ribbon.

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Sorry. I believe it is the 304th infantry Regiment.

When I get home, I will pull out some letters he sent when he was in the hospital ith wounds to his face.

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It is indeed the 304th. No idea why I would have typed 104 as that would have been a 26th Division unit.

 

Allan

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Linedoggie

It is a WW1 Occupation Medal ribbon bar. The theory is that many soldiers and units assumed the WW2 Occupation Medal would use the same ribbon design as the WW1 medal. The earlier ribbon bar is many times found on the uniforms of WW2 veterans who did not qualify for the WW1 medal.

Not so far fetched. While stationed at USMA West Point after 9-11 one of our NCO's put the American Defense ribbon on his rack thinking it was like an NDSM for several eras. Our PSG was confused and asked me what it was, and my hysterical reaction told him all he needed to know

 

Another Soldier we had in Iraq in 04-05 did an extra year with 48th BCT in Iraq and we next saw him he was wearing a CIB with star. (48th actually cut him orders awarding it)

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carbinephalen

Great uniform! I'm attempting to pin down what company he was with. The various spellings of his last name are making it difficult!

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Enclosed are a few Photos from Michela's grouping. A photo of Frank's Soldier Individual Pay Record book, possibly being transferred from Co. B to Co. E. Also an excerpt from one of his letters home, explaining the plastic surgery to his face from unknown wounds to his face, from a USA Hospital at Ft. Leonard Wood, Mo.

Also with his IKE Jacket was one of his shirts with the Green "Combat Leadership Stripe".

 

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Old Marine

That is a great jacket with a great story, thanks for posting it. I hope that soldier's wounds healed and he lived a good life, he certainly earned it.

 

Recently there have been a few WWII Army jackets posted with the WWI Army of Occupation Ribbon either pinned on or in the pocket. Evidently in 1945 there was some confusion about the Occupation Medal and ribbon. It appears that a few WWI Occupation medals and ribbons were issued in error, it seems to have been a common mistake. The timing of the establishment of the medal and the delay in procurement of the medal is probably the cause of the confusion.

 

Below is a 1945 dated World War I Army of Occupation Medal. This medal was issued for service in Germany or Austria-Hungary between 12 November 1918 and 11 July 1923. The medal was established on 21 November 1941. The WWI Army of Occupation medal did not exist until 23 years after the First World War. It was a reto-active award and eligible veterans would have to apply to receive the medal.

 

In a stroke of bad timing the medal was established and authorized about 2 weeks before the attack on Pearl Harbor. Two weeks later the US entered the war and production and procurement of the medal was put on hold until after the war. The first lot of these medals were purchased and ready for issue in late 1945.

 

The medal in the photo shows a purchase order date of 6 September 1945. If you look at the close up of the box label you can see that the box makes no mention of 1918 - 1923 German Occupation.

 

It's pretty easy to figure that if a separation center supply room received a box of these medals or ribbons in late 1945 or 1946 they might figure they were for WWII occupation duty and issue them out to discharging soldiers.

 

Anyway, maybe this helps to explain and make sense why the WWI ribbon is on that Ike. Every little bit tells a story with this old Army stuff.

 

 

This is the paragraph from the Army Awards Manual 600-8-22

 

5–18. Army of Occupation of Germany Medal

The Army of Occupation of Germany Medal was established by the act of 21 November 1941, (55 Stat. 781). It is awarded for service in Germany or Austria-Hungary between 12 November 1918 and 11 July 1923.

 

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Old Marine

The box label. No mention that this medal is for World War I service. A supply sergeant in a very busy separation center gets a big box of brand new occupation medals. Why would he think those new shiny medals are for the war that ended 27 years ago and not the war that just ended a few months ago?

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Old Marine

Just for curiosity both Occupation medals. The Airplane device is for providing assistance during the Berlin Airlift.

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easterneagle87

Just for curiosity both Occupation medals. The Airplane device is for providing assistance during the Berlin Airlift.

 

Pretty interesting to have the Germany, Japan and Airlift device on the same medal.

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Jarhead8007

Old Marine,

 

Never underestimate the confusion of the supply sergeant. When my unit finished with our time in Somalia, the adjutant expected that we'd be awarded the Humanitarian Service Medal (the purple and blue ribbon one with the "helping hand" on the planchet), but the supply section accidentally ordered the Medal for Humane Action (the Berlin Airlift Medal). The funny thing was that the DoD actually shipped 250 of them to us. Oh, I wish I had been able to keep a couple of them. As an aside, HQMC decided we weren't eligible for the HSM so we never were awarded it, anyway.

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easterneagle87

Old Marine,

 

Never underestimate the confusion of the supply sergeant. When my unit finished with our time in Somalia, the adjutant expected that we'd be awarded the Humanitarian Service Medal (the purple and blue ribbon one with the "helping hand" on the planchet), but the supply section accidentally ordered the Medal for Humane Action (the Berlin Airlift Medal). The funny thing was that the DoD actually shipped 250 of them to us. Oh, I wish I had been able to keep a couple of them. As an aside, HQMC decided we weren't eligible for the HSM so we never were awarded it, anyway.

 

That happened in my unit as well, but for some disaster relief. This guy was a VMI grad as well and didn't know the difference or relieze his error. I snatched one up and stupid of me flipped it later on, and I believe on this forum.

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carbinephalen

It looks like he returned to the US with the 8th Infantry Div on August 31st of '45

 

I'll keep digging through my resources for you.

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Here's a couple of Photos of Michela's letters return addresses of locations he was at in the US while in the hospital. One letter excerpt just after VE Day where he was stationed at Chemnitz Luftwaffe Air Base after his unit captured it.

 

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I have found these ribbons on numerous Constab Ikes.....you will, too. I have one Ike w/ plastic ribbons - both the WW I Occupation and WW II Occupation on the same bar.

 

As mentioned before, a lot of confusion in the ranks.

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