GF97 Posted March 17, 2016 Share #1 Posted March 17, 2016 Picked this up at a garage sale. The serial number is an "E" series 689xxx. as far as I can tell everything looks legitimate. The barrel is 20" and marked CYL next to 12 GA it's also marked on the bottom of the barrel along with an R in a box. The wear is consistent on all of the parts and all of them are WW1 era, which leads me to believe it is all original, but I just thought it would be nice to get another set of eyes on it. The sling is WW2 I put that on there for now. If anyone wants bigger pics let me know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GF97 Posted March 17, 2016 Author Share #2 Posted March 17, 2016 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GF97 Posted March 17, 2016 Author Share #3 Posted March 17, 2016 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GF97 Posted March 17, 2016 Author Share #4 Posted March 17, 2016 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GF97 Posted March 17, 2016 Author Share #5 Posted March 17, 2016 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ben@HI Posted March 17, 2016 Share #6 Posted March 17, 2016 not an expert here by any means but the muzzle of the barrel looks wrong to me and the walls look to thick at the muzzle as well, like it was a longer barrel that was cut down? the one I had looked to have a more rounded and the barrel walls were thinner at the muzzle as I remember. just my observation and I am not very experienced with these, just happened to own one once. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
268th C.A. Posted March 17, 2016 Share #7 Posted March 17, 2016 Either way....a garage sale find! Congratulations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GF97 Posted March 17, 2016 Author Share #8 Posted March 17, 2016 268th C.A., Thank I figured it was worth it! Ben@HI, I wondered about the muzzle as well, but I started comparing it with another shotgun and the muzzle wall measurements are the same. The finish of the gun from butt to muzzle matches so well it seems like it would have to be the original barrel maybe it was dropped on the muzzle at some point? Would you know if there were slots for the mag tube clamp on all brush gun barrels? I have been seeing that on a lot of cut down made trench guns, but there is little to no info on these guns that is useful online. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robinb Posted March 17, 2016 Share #9 Posted March 17, 2016 Looks good to me. If it was a long barrel that had been cut down it would be necessary to add a sleeve to the inside of the barrel shroud to get it to fit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ben@HI Posted March 17, 2016 Share #10 Posted March 17, 2016 not sure about WW1 as I did not read up on barrels for them because I was not concerned with mine but I did have a WW2 m97 trench gun that I was concerned about the barrel on so I did read up on WW2 barrels a little and from what I found the barrel length for them was inconsistent, they were mostly 21" to 18" as I recall and I would think if they were inconsistent in WW2 they would probably be during WW1, but for all I know they were inconsistent because the WW2 M97 was a take down unlike the WW1 which had a solid one piece receiver. also as unlike a rifle the crown is not as important for a shotgun so I would think that if the crown did get dinged up a armorer would properly just square up the muzzle them self rather then send it up to a higher level of maintenance to have the barrel replaced (just a thought). I am not the best person to answer these questions as my knowledge on trench guns is limited to the little I looked up on the ones I owned and as I have only had a handful in my life (they are pretty hard to find) but I know some of the other members have a lot better knowledge about these then I do and I am sure one of them will chime in before long. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robinb Posted March 17, 2016 Share #11 Posted March 17, 2016 One of them already did. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ben@HI Posted March 17, 2016 Share #12 Posted March 17, 2016 i see that lol, you must have posted when i was still writting Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris3bs Posted March 17, 2016 Share #13 Posted March 17, 2016 No matter - it looks nice. The shorter the barrel better the spread at close distances. Are they pretty much the improved cylinder type when made for combat? I know barrels are made in different vareity of chokes. Just asking in case one was produced more than the other. Thanks Chris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GF97 Posted March 17, 2016 Author Share #14 Posted March 17, 2016 chris3bs, from everything I have read the WW1 and WW2 military Trench guns were all Cylinder bore, which gives a wider spread than Improved Cylinder. Other chokes were for civilian use, but some faked trench guns have cut down barrels with other chokes, and as robinb stated they would need a sleeve over the barrel to allow the hand guard/ heat shied to fit properly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mdonzi Posted March 18, 2016 Share #15 Posted March 18, 2016 looks sweet, I have cly bore riot gun the barrel look the same at the end. did they tell you how they came a bought having it do tell what did you have to give for it great gun Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheGrayGhost Posted March 18, 2016 Share #16 Posted March 18, 2016 Beautiful! One of my all time favorite weapons. Congratulations on a great find! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GF97 Posted March 19, 2016 Author Share #17 Posted March 19, 2016 Thanks everyone! The guy who sold it to me said he got it from his grandfather. After I looked it over and was impressed by the fact that the finish wear was so even and all the parts looked original I got it. I gave him $1,000. Figured that was very reasonable for a nice ww1 gun especially being all WW1 parts. Most of the ones I see at gun shows and online are 3k plus and quite a few of em don't look quite right. By the way would a ww1 canvas NOBUCKL sling be appropriate for this gun or just the 1907 leather sling? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mdonzi Posted March 19, 2016 Share #18 Posted March 19, 2016 great deal looks very nice Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robinb Posted March 20, 2016 Share #19 Posted March 20, 2016 I'd use a leather M1907 sling an not a Kerr. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hyrax222 Posted March 20, 2016 Share #20 Posted March 20, 2016 It looks correct to me. You stole it at $1000! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buzzbomb Posted March 23, 2016 Share #21 Posted March 23, 2016 How do you tell if it has ww1 parts?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GF97 Posted March 25, 2016 Author Share #22 Posted March 25, 2016 buzzbomb, there are a few parts that are different from WW1 to WW2. The WW1 stock is "high comb" , thin, and it does not have grooves in the wood. Look up some picks on google of a WW1 and WW2 stock so you can get the visual. The heat shield has six rows of holes, the bayonet lug is roughly flush with the muzzle, and has either a "pat app" stamp or "patent 1918" like the one I have pictured. Early WW2 six row heat shields are unmarked, and later shields are 4 row and have a shorter hand guard/ bayonet lug which makes it look like the barrel sticks out further. Other than that the rest has to do with wether the gun is a solid frame and in the right serial number range. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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