Colt 1911 reworked for WW2

[kilgarvan]

Got some money saved up and possibly in the marked for a 1911. I already have, although not in the greatest shape, an all original and correct 1918 manufactured Colt 1911.

 

So I was thinking about looking for the following.

 

A World War 1 manufactured Colt 1911 that was reworked for World War 2. As a historian and history teacher I like the idea of a gun used in both world wars.

 

Is it possible to find, and how hard would it be, to find a Colt 1911 that was reworked at Springfield arsenal with the world war 1 type grips still on and re-reblued not parkerized during its rebuild? Was this done, does it exist?

 

Suggestions and comments welcomed. Also, what should I expect to pay? I know that's a difficult question. and I don't have to tell you that the price range is crazy. From over priced dealers and online sources, maybe somebody on the forum has one they'd be willing to let go. I just can't pay the crazy asking price out there. Do people really pay these prices or are the sellers hoping to find somebody who will just bite......

 

Thanks

[hink441]

I have a 1918 made Colt that was refurbed twice. Once at Augusta Arsenal and then at Rock Island Arsenal. Mine is parkerized and I think most if not all Arsenal refurbed 1911s were parkerized.

 

I have not purchased a 1911 in a few years now. But even the Arsenal reworked pistols are usually well over $1000 bucks these days.

 

Chris

[kilgarvan]

Thanks Chris. Yeah, I was thinking it would be in that $1,000 range. So, if they were reworked twice does that mean it may have seen service in WW2 & Korean?

[268th C.A.]

I agree with $1000. not a rattle trap. People laugh but first thing I do is pick it up and shake it, for wear....they will rattle if there worn out...

[maskman]

There are plenty of them out there, in fact most WW1 1911's have been through arsenal rework. You can find them from $800 up, depending on condition. The 1911A1's are really going up in price if they are original as are WW1 original blue 1911's.

[Allan H.]

I have a 1911 that came directly from a WWII veteran with green parkerized finish and WWI diamond wood grips. I recall showing this to another collector who pulled his out of the gun safe- he had a 1911 with green park and brown plastic grips. I'm sure that all the arsenal guys cared about was that the grips were serviceable. If the old ones weren't, they were replaced. The same goes for the various parts on the pistol.

 

Allan

[Chris_B]

Respectfully, In my opinion, there are many reasons a pistol might rattle, and being "worn out" is not proven or dis-proven by the sound. I do understand that this 'rattle' test has some roots in the US military's experience with pistols that were decades old and were in fact worn out, but that is a condition of simultaneous events and again it is my opinion that the sound may be an indication, but it is not the sole qualifier.

 

Both my 1918 manufactured Model of 1911 and my Colt Series 70 manufactured in 1978 will 'rattle'. I am not a gunsmith nor an expert in the field of 1911 pattern pistols but I do feel I am a knowledgeable amateur. A lack of a rattle noise when shaken means that most likely, there is a tight slide to frame fit. The fact that this fit is tight doesn't mean the pistol is not worn out. It means the slide to frame fit is tight.The mere fact of frame to slide play does not make a pistol 'worn out'. It merely indicates a loose tolerance. The barrel to slide fit is much more important. It is natural to feel that the noise means trouble or that the pistol is worn out. We are sort of conditioned to feel that noises must mean bad things. Don't forget, even in WWII, heat treating and even metallurgy were not what they are today.

[artu44]

Rattle depending on mechanical tolerances and these in a gun which must operated in the mud of trenches have to be large. Non rattling pistols are good for the range only.

[Blacksmith]

I have never seen a legit example of a WWII arsenal reworked 1911 that retained walnut grips. Those were replaced for reasons beyond condition, such as compulsion to attract moisture. Actual selling prices for USGI 1911s have been consistently and slowly dropping from the cartoonish levels they reached about 10 years ago.

[everforward]

I have a 1911 that came directly from a WWII veteran with green parkerized finish and WWI diamond wood grips. I recall showing this to another collector who pulled his out of the gun safe- he had a 1911 with green park and brown plastic grips. I'm sure that all the arsenal guys cared about was that the grips were serviceable. If the old ones weren't, they were replaced. The same goes for the various parts on the pistol.

 

Allan

+1. If the grips were wood but still in usable shape and met the standard, they could have been retained on the pistol. If a pistol was refurbished in the 1930s, it most certainly would have had wooden grips.

 

I have a (nearly unfired) Colt 1911 reworked by Augusta Arsenal and sold through the NRA (via the DCM) in 1961, along with it's original box and NRA/DCM paperwork. The pistol was a 'black army' 1911 when new......despite being an arsenal rework, the pistol's slide and frame were not switched out AND it still has it's original (but park'd) WW1 Colt barrel (!!!) The hammer, trigger and grip safety are WW2 replacement parts, but they left the WW1 mainspring housing intact.

[hink441]

Here is the twice re-furbed pistol I own. This one was last re-furbed in WW2 and has the plastic grip panels.

 

[everforward]

Here is mine, along with its box and paperwork.....actually the slide is a little earlier than the frame which is definitely from the black finish period of manufacture. I think the coolest thing about this pistol is that one of the magazines that came with it is a WW1 Springfield Armory lanyard loop mag that was parkerized...(!)

 

 

 

[phantomfixer]

drooling

[collector]

I think I asked this in another post, but maybe there are some new members or viewers so,

my AA arsenal refurbed Remington UMC has the blackish parking, what was the time frame for that?

 

The two versions were zinc and manganese, the manganese producing the dark finish.

From what info I can find, the manganese parkerizing was replaced by the zinc process in the 1930s?

[everforward]

I think I asked this in another post, but maybe there are some new members or viewers so,

my AA arsenal refurbed Remington UMC has the blackish parking, what was the time frame for that?

 

The two versions were zinc and manganese, the manganese producing the dark finish.

From what info I can find, the manganese parkerizing was replaced by the zinc process in the 1930s?

From my experience, if the black finish was applied by the military then it's pretty early. I have seen M1903s and M1917 Enfields that had this type of finish where the refurb dated from the 20's....I had read something about it years ago, maybe it was Brophy's '03 book but not sure. If you have pics, it would be great to see the pistol.