1910 Medical Squad Leader's Pouch?

[world war I nerd]

Over the years I've seen about a dozen 1910 Squad Leader's Pouches stamped or stenciled with a red cross symbol above the initials U.S.

 

Does anyone know if these pouches were used or issued by the Medical Department for use by corpsmen or first aid providers?

 

Unmarked pouches were intended to hold supplies needed by the average infantry squad. Some of the articles carried were adhesive tape, sticking plasters, and foot powder for the men's feet. Gun oil, rifle patches, and a shell extraction tool was also included to maintain the rifles. It also was home to a squad sewing kit that was comprised of various sized needles and safety pins, different colors and weights of sewing thread and cards of spare buttons for the flannel shirts and underwear.

 

The pouch could be worn either on the haversack suspended underneath the meatcan pouch in place of the squad's entrenching tools or it could be suspended from the cartridge belt. The webbing hanger was long enough to allow it to hang just below the first aid packet. Because of this, I've always wondered if it was officially used to augment the storage capacity of the enlisted men's and officer's medical belts?

 

Any thoughts or information would be appreciated ...

 

Thanks for looking

 

I've only ever seen one period photo of this pouch being used (it was worn on the belt under the first aid pouch) by a WW I Doughboy, who I think was on 'snake parade' (in a line) waiting to get a Salvation Army or YMCA doughnut.

 

Can anybody post a photo of the pouch in use?

 

[Too Much WW1 Militaria]

As far as I know, they weren't issued to the medical department, which means nothing. I have a converted shotgun shell pouch that my Dr. grandfather used to carry vials. So, issue, I'd say no, adapted for, heck yes!

 

John

[world war I nerd]

John, I concur that all sorts of stuff was unofficially pressed into service by medical personnel during WW I to carry additional medical supplies.

 

I once read about a WW I medic filling and then carrying empty cloth bandoleers with field dressings! Not a bad idea actually.

 

I'm curious about the 1910 pouches, because the red cross on every one that I've seen has been identical. To me, that indicates that they were not stenciled on an ad-hoc basis. That doesn't mean that they weren't unofficially marked, it just means that they were unofficially marked with care.

[Too Much WW1 Militaria]

I've only ever seen a couple with the crosses on them. And, they have been identical. The nickel 98 question is were they done by someone in the field?

[solcarlus]

Bonjour.

 

I think that this package had to be diverted from its destination by various users. I do not know many of the medical equipment department with a red cross stencil.

 

solcarlus.

 

[DocCollector1441]

Its possible they were marked with the red cross because they carried some basic medical stuff or items that could be used or improvised for use in first aid. But honestly in some ways the red crosses I have seen on them are very similar to the red crosses put on some modern IFAKs

[world war I nerd]

Great photo Socarlus, Thanks for posting!

 

Hey Doc Collector, what is IFAK?

 

For what it's worth, I've seen 1910 Squad Leader's Pouch marked with similar red crosses as long ago as the late 1980s and just about every year between then and now. In each instance, the red crosses were aged, faded or worn appropriate to the condition of the pouch. None of them looked as if they had been recently stenciled. But of course, that doesn't mean that they weren't stenciled in the 1930s, 40s or 50s.

[DocCollector1441]

An IFAK is an Improved First Aid Kit... carries basic medical supplies to be used if the soldier is wounded... I am just thinking if there were items that could be used for first aid why not mark the item with a red cross so soldiers know to look there

[scmcgeorge]

The one image of a doughboy wearing one of these is in the forum " INteresting ww1 web equipment" post started by jgawne Sept 28 2007. My sources ID these guys as men of 315th Field Signal BN. image dated 14 Oct. 1918. In clearer images you can see that the fellow with the squad leader pouch has signal corps stencil on his regular (smaller) 1st aid pouch. I know of no other images of one of these pouches in use beyond this one and the female ARC Worker. Steve McG

[solcarlus]

[scmcgeorge]

Merci Sol !!!! Steve McG

[world war I nerd]

Thanks for the acronym definition Doc ... I never would have figured that one out.

 

Steve, that's the photo I was thinking of, but obviously, the soldiers aren't waiting for doughnuts and coffee - my mistake!

 

It would be interesting to find out the real story concerning these pouches.

 

Clearly they were available, but I wonder why, other than the above examples, they never show up in period photographs?

[DocCollector1441]

It could because they don't appear in period photographs that they are so prevalent. Its honestly something that would get left in a trench. If I was going over the top I wouldn't want to carry the extra equipment that wasn't necessary to complete my mission.

[world war I nerd]

Solcarlus ... my apologies! It was you that posted both photos, not Steve. One day, I'll learn how to read. Thank you for that.

 

Doc, I agree that a great deal of equipment was 'ditched' before going into combat or to lighten one's load on a long hot march. Before going into combat, the Doughboys were ordered to leave everything behind except for what was called the 'battle pack' which was comprised only on the mess kit and eating utensils, rations, a change of socks, an entrenching tool, and a few toilet articles.

 

To me it's odd that those pouches other that the two examples posted here don't show up in ANY photos whether the men are in formation, at inspection, in camp, on the march, etc. I think that they were adopted by the Army in 1916. It's just weird that they are never seen.

 

In my opinion, those pouches were of a size that made them convenient to hold grenades, emergency rations, smokes, compass, maps, note or message books, gloves, eyeglasses, or just about anything else that a soldier might want to keep handy - especially when worn on the belt. It would be much easier to reach into a pouch on the left hip than unslinging the pack and root around until you found what ever it was you wanted. But that's just me ...

[solcarlus]

No problem world war I nerd ;-)

[2ad82recon]

Interesting debate gentlemen I have always wondered about their issue. One thing we do note about this pouch is that it fits EXACTLY under the neat can pouch on the pack ? into the entrenching tool tab....

 

Are we looking for original pictures of this pouch in the wrong place ?

 

Regards

 

Lloyd

[world war I nerd]

Original photos of the pouch worn either under the meat can pouch (per regulations) or hanging from a pistol or cartridge belt (as shown in the above photo) seem to be the two most likely locations the pouch would have been carried. I'd be happy to see period photos of the pouch in use, regardless of where it was carried.