Air Force Fighter Weapons Squadron Patches - Russian Students ?

[HistoryNut]

Here are a few more from the collection I purchased. Would the 64th and 65th patch with foreign lettering be for foreigners assigned to the squadron? I was assigned to the 962nd AWACS from 1986 - 1989 and we had some Canadians assigned, but they wore the same patches as us...so these have me puzzled. Any help would be greatly appreciated.

[hink441]

They are aggressor squadrons. They fly, fight, and train like the enemy. These aggressor squadrons are pitted against our front line fighters and they keep the tip of America's spear very sharp!!

[lugar05]

all from Nellis AFB

[HistoryNut]

Hink441, are you saying they simulate he enemy? If so, do they wear the foreign lettered patches when they do so? Thank you lugar05.

[Randy]

They had their patches done with Russian vs. English lettering to make them more like the folks they were portraying. All the aggressor units did this, to include the USAFE and PACAF ones. They also took the stock US manufacturer's aircraft patches for the F-15, F-16 etc. and used Russian aircraft instead like the Mig 25 or the Flanker.

 

Randy

[gwb123]

You need this book... Red Eagles: America's Secret Migs by Steve Davies

 

http://www.amazon.com/Red-Eagles-Americas-General-Aviation/dp/1846039703/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1428115359&sr=1-1&keywords=red+eagles+america%27s+secret+migs+-+by+steve+davies

[Randy]

The aggressor program and the MiG program were two different things. The aggressors started with T-38s and later F-5s with the 64 and 65 Fighter Weapons Sqs (later Aggressor Sqs). The MiGs fell under the 4477 Tactical Evaluation Flight (later Sq). The MiG program was highly classified at the time at Tonapah, while the aggressor program was very much out in the open with 4 squadrons. Two at Nellis, one each at Clark and Alconbury.

 

Randy

[firefighter]

I have some from the 26th Aggressor Sq when they were at Clark AB.One or two have Russian writing.I use to go by their squadron but never went in.I was told they even had Russian flags and stuff in there.Wished I had checked it out.The flew F-5's with Russian paint schemes and numbers on the fuselage.

[gwb123]

The aggressor program and the MiG program were two different things. The aggressors started with T-38s and later F-5s with the 64 and 65 Fighter Weapons Sqs (later Aggressor Sqs). The MiGs fell under the 4477 Tactical Evaluation Flight (later Sq). The MiG program was highly classified at the time at Tonapah, while the aggressor program was very much out in the open with 4 squadrons. Two at Nellis, one each at Clark and Alconbury.

 

Randy

 

Correct, but if I recall the book correctly, it also discusses the Aggressor Squadrons that were deployed around the globe.

 

If you want something strictly on the Aggressor squadrons, here's another title:

 

http://www.amazon.com/Adversary-Americas-Aggressor-Squadrons-Schiffer/dp/076430688X/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1428174883&sr=8-1&keywords=aggressor+squadron

 

As far as the patch that Randy provided, it has an odd story of its own.

 

I seem to recall that patch appearing in collector's circles long before the unit was declassified. (It was inactivated in 1990, but the full story did not come out until later.) Back in the day, once a unit ordered patches it was not uncommon for the manufacturer to make overruns and then sell them through price lists. Patch collectors who got hold of them early on did a fairly good job of surmising what the unit had been up to, although of course nobody knew the full extent of it.

 

This is a fair summary of events of the 4477th and follow on activities:

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/4477th_Test_and_Evaluation_Squadron

[HistoryNut]

Great explanation guys..very informative. I had no idea. gwb123, the book looks like a great read.

[firefighter]

Here is a list of the other Aggressor Squadrons.

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_United_States_Air_Force_aggressor_squadrons

[Randy]

 

Correct, but if I recall the book correctly, it also discusses the Aggressor Squadrons that were deployed around the globe.

 

If you want something strictly on the Aggressor squadrons, here's another title:

 

http://www.amazon.com/Adversary-Americas-Aggressor-Squadrons-Schiffer/dp/076430688X/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1428174883&sr=8-1&keywords=aggressor+squadron

 

As far as the patch that Randy provided, it has an odd story of its own.

 

I seem to recall that patch appearing in collector's circles long before the unit was declassified. (It was inactivated in 1990, but the full story did not come out until later.) Back in the day, once a unit ordered patches it was not uncommon for the manufacturer to make overruns and then sell them through price lists. Patch collectors who got hold of them early on did a fairly good job of surmising what the unit had been up to, although of course nobody knew the full extent of it.

 

This is a fair summary of events of the 4477th and follow on activities:

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/4477th_Test_and_Evaluation_Squadron

Yes, I just wanted to let folks know they were two separate programs. As you said, the patches were out while the MiG program was still black. I got mine in the late 80s. I have no idea why a highly classified program would even have a patch, much less one that pretty much spells out the mission. The F-117s did it as well, with lots of veiled references to the Nighthawk. I was told the F-117 didn't exist, even though I was standing next to one, but that's another story! The USAF works in strange ways....

Randy

[gwb123]

Yes, I just wanted to let folks know they were two separate programs. As you said, the patches were out while the MiG program was still black. I got mine in the late 80s. I have no idea why a highly classified program would even have a patch, much less one that pretty much spells out the mission. The F-117s did it as well, with lots of veiled references to the Nighthawk. I was told the F-117 didn't exist, even though I was standing next to one, but that's another story! The USAF works in strange ways....

Randy

 

This is nothing new. If you have seen the weird little book book "I Could Tell You But then You Would Have to Be Destroyed By Me: Emblems from the Pentagon's Black World" by Trevor Paglen it seems the black program guys just can't resist having their own little emblem for their specific program. While some of these designs seem dubious, I am thinking a fair number in his book are close to what he says they are, or are at least for a similar program.

 

I wish I could take 3 or 4 days and just scour the Las Vegas area thrift shops to see what turned up... you'd be surprised what you would find on ceramic mugs and coffee cups alone.

 

http://www.amazon.com/Could-Tell-Then-Would-Destroyed/dp/193555414X/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1428204885&sr=1-1&keywords=If+I+tell+you+I+have+to+destroy+you

 

[Randy]

Yes, that's true. Just an FYI, I've been told most of the patches in the Paglen book are repros of the actual item made just for the book.

 

Randy

[gwb123]

That's probably accurate.... a lot of them look like they were made by the same source. After the book came out, dozens of the same patches suddenly appeared overnight on eBay. Go figure! Somebody had their eye on cashing in... bet it caused some red faces behind the fences at Nellis!