Steve Rogers Posted March 29, 2015 Share #1 Posted March 29, 2015 Attached is an image of a scarce belt that sometimes goes unnoticed. Shortly after adopting the Roman style short sword for artillery, the army also adopted them for use by infantry sergeants. The difference in the two belts being the motif on one of the discs supporting the S-shaped clasp. The artillery belts had crossed cannons with a US; the infantry had stacked muskets. We tend to refer to them as NCO belts and swords, but they seem to have been restricted to sergeants only, not corporals. The material is white buff leather, with a frog on the left and an adjusting buckle on right. The disc pattern was changed in 1834 to a generic US and the belt itself was phased out starting in 1839 with the adoption of the 1840 pattern NCO sword (which, like this, was restricted to sergeants,) carried on a shoulder sling. Robert Dingee supplied a lot of the belts and brass to the army. The disc pattern on this, however, does not match Dingee's and is thought to be either a version made for one of the states or a federal product from Allegany Arsenal. See Campbell and O'Donnell for details on the plates. Link to post Share on other sites
trenchbuff Posted March 29, 2015 Share #2 Posted March 29, 2015 Don't often see these really early belts. Thanks for letting us take a look at it. Visit My WebsiteFalls Creek CollectiblesSelling Quality 20th Century Militaria Link to post Share on other sites
ken1967 Posted March 31, 2015 Share #3 Posted March 31, 2015 Awesome belt! Thanks for sharing. Collecting early US Army headgear and uniforms. Link to post Share on other sites
hawk3370 Posted November 2, 2015 Share #4 Posted November 2, 2015 Beautiful belt, these are so rare I am glad you posted it so others can see. I doubt but a handful of collectors have ever seen one of these. Terry Link to post Share on other sites
bheskett Posted November 2, 2015 Share #5 Posted November 2, 2015 I am not in that handful. I have never seen one before and it is a beauty. Thanks for sharing. Bob Link to post Share on other sites
Leatherneck72 Posted March 22, 2016 Share #6 Posted March 22, 2016 Is this in your collection? LEATHERNECK72Advanced Collector and USMC Officer --- Paying top dollar for quality Marine Corps antiques. Kepis, shakos, helmets, hats, good conduct medals, old photos, fighting knives, hat and collar emblems, swords, guns, documents. Keep your USMC item in a Marine Corps family! Send me a PM and let me know what you have.... Link to post Share on other sites
MasonK Posted March 22, 2016 Share #7 Posted March 22, 2016 Amazing, early piece. Thanks for sharing! Here is the artillery sword that I assume would be worn on this belt. This belongs to a family member of mine, and was used by a relative pre-Civil War. Eric ASMIC #5492 Are you a militaria collector in PA, NJ or DE? If so, please feel free to join my "Delaware Valley Militaria Collectors" page on Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/MilitariaCollectorsOfDelawareValley#!/groups/DELVALMILITARIA/ Check me out on Instagram @philly_militaria_collector Link to post Share on other sites
Steve Rogers Posted April 6, 2016 Author Share #8 Posted April 6, 2016 MasonK: thanks for posting the photo of the short sword. Yes, that's the pattern they were using for infantry NCOs as well for during the period. Yours looks in great condition, particularly for a family piece- most such things got chewed up by kids playing with them over the generations. Leatherneck72: I no longer have it. It was a nice piece to handle for a while though! Link to post Share on other sites
Old Marine Posted April 6, 2016 Share #9 Posted April 6, 2016 I don't know who to compliment first. Steve, thanks for posting the photos of the belt I have never seen anything like that and it's great to be able to see such a rare, early piece. Mason that sword is fantastic. It looks as heavy and sturdy as the day it was made. The fact that it has a family connection makes it even better, thanks for posting those photos too. Both piece are just incredible. Thanks. Link to post Share on other sites
VenitHora Posted April 7, 2016 Share #10 Posted April 7, 2016 Amazing artifacts. Thanks for sharing! Looking for WWII personalized or unit marked helmets, combat clothing, Navy and Army flying gear and souvenir items or just interesting stuff. Link to post Share on other sites
Terry K. Posted April 7, 2016 Share #11 Posted April 7, 2016 So nice to see something used for such a short time and that old, THANKS! You are his witness now, without a witness, they just disappear! Quote from the movie TAKING CHANCE 2009 Link to post Share on other sites
illinigander Posted January 18, 2019 Share #12 Posted January 18, 2019 Just bumped into this. There is good photo information of Btty A, 1st. Ill. Lt Art. wearing these 1833 ames swords at Fort Defiance, Cairo, Ill. 1861. Illinigander Link to post Share on other sites
VolunteerArmoury Posted January 19, 2019 Share #13 Posted January 19, 2019 Just bumped into this. There is good photo information of Btty A, 1st. Ill. Lt Art. wearing these 1833 ames swords at Fort Defiance, Cairo, Ill. 1861. Illinigander Any chance you know of a place I can find that photo? A quick search didn’t turn anything up unless I over looked it. Be well, Chad C. Rogers Retired Army Link to post Share on other sites
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