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Period Photo's WWI USMC Helmets w/EGAs


Maple Creek
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Maple Creek

As the result of purchase at the recent SoS, I am currently the owner of two WWI USMC helmets with EGA badges. The one on the left is an M17 and the one on the top right is an MKI. I'm a helmet collector, not an EGA expert, so please tell me if you think I'm wrong, but I believe that both badges are WWI vintage. One thing I've been told about the original WWI helmets with these badges is that the holes were punched, not drilled. On the MKI the hole is obviously punched. On the M17 it's less obvious, but the mounting bolt is offset indicating uneven surface below. The mounting bolt or disk is firmly stuck so I don't want to try to force it loose for a close look, but I think it's OK.

 

I bought the M17 from a small-scale dealer in upstate New York, who in turn said he got it from the family as I recall. He urged me not to clean it and I haven't.

 

There has been debate as to whether the EGAs were used on Marine helmets during WWI. I've been told that this debate has been settled in favor of EGAs being used during the war, but I haven't see totally convincing photographic evidence. Is there any?

 

For my helmet collection, I like to have pieces that are in their original war time configurations. So, for instance, I don't have any M17s or MKIs with painted unit insignia since these were almost always painted post-armistice. What I like about these two helmets is that they appear as they might have been worn in the field during the First World War.

 

Mark D.

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normaninvasion

EGAs are WW1 vintage.IMO I think both lids look great. There is photo evidence of EGAs being worn during combat, don't know how widespread. Lot's of drawings by John Thomason, showing them worn.

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Yep, I don't have any major issues either. There is still a debate, but as Normaninvasion indicated, artists of the period depict them being worn, and at least one prominent photograph at Belleau wood shows a couple worn. There is even said to be a few ground dug ega's from helmets at Belleau wood and if I remember correctly, a Marines shallow grave was unearthed there several years ago that has one on the helmet. I believe the general consensus is they might have been worn, but infrequently, and definitely not the norm. One has to also consider that the ega was worn on these helmets after WWI in other theaters, Nicaragua, Haiti and China. Too many folks think the ega on this style helmet must be WWI and that is not the case. In other theaters, and later time frames, I am not sure the drill vs. punch hole theory is as absolute as the WWI ones, especially the ones painted just following the war, which should be punched. I think you have a decent pair and should be proud to add them to your collection. Kevin

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Maple Creek

Hi Kevin and NormanI,

 

Thanks for weighing in. I'm glad you like the lids. That pretty much jibes with my understanding - Some Marines had EGAs on their helmets during WWI, but it was mainly a post-WWI practice. I haven't seen the photograph at Belleau Wood and I hadn't heard about the ground dug ones. I have seen the period illustrations of the practice. Also, it's good to get clarity about the punched versus drilled issue. Some were apparently drilled - makes sense.

 

Mark D.

Yep, I don't have any major issues either. There is still a debate, but as Normaninvasion indicated, artists of the period depict them being worn, and at least one prominent photograph at Belleau wood shows a couple worn. There is even said to be a few ground dug ega's from helmets at Belleau wood and if I remember correctly, a Marines shallow grave was unearthed there several years ago that has one on the helmet. I believe the general consensus is they might have been worn, but infrequently, and definitely not the norm. One has to also consider that the ega was worn on these helmets after WWI in other theaters, Nicaragua, Haiti and China. Too many folks think the ega on this style helmet must be WWI and that is not the case. In other theaters, and later time frames, I am not sure the drill vs. punch hole theory is as absolute as the WWI ones, especially the ones painted just following the war, which should be punched. I think you have a decent pair and should be proud to add them to your collection. Kevin

 

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Hello Mark,

 

I would agree with Jeff and Kevin, however; I'm not convinced the helmet you refer to as the M17 has a punched-in hole for the EGA. Looking closely at your picture in post #3 I see the washer lying flat against the surface... that would not be the case if it were punched-in as the Mk1 on the left. The fastening nut was either screwed on a bent post or crooked as it doesn't lay flat against the washer surface. It also appears that the fastening nut was secured in a little dab of glue or cement... you can clearly see the substance under the nut on the left side. The Mk1 is a one looker.

 

Best,

 

Chuck

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world war I nerd

USMC EGA cap badges were definitely worn to some degree in combat during WW I on the front of the helmet. How frequently they were worn has yet to be determined. The prevailing wisdom amongst the collecting community is that they were worn infrequently.

 

Personally, I agree that the majority of the cap badges were likely added to helmets after the war had ended, but I also think that EGA devices were more widely worn in combat than what is generally thought.

 

Anyway, in respect to photographic evidence, here's what I can add:

 

Close up of the three USMC officers wearing EGA emblems on the front of their helmets. The entire photo from which the images were cropped was posted elsewhere on the forum. That photo shows some of the USMC officers that had survived the battle for Belleau Wood. The photo was allegedly taken shortly after the capture of Belleau Wood.

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world war I nerd

This photo shows a USMC signal section in a barn or dugout. Judging by the fact that the Marines appear to still be wearing USMC issued clothing, the photo was likely taken sometime before the Spring of 1918. It is difficult to see in this image but at least three, or possibly all of the enlisted men, appear to be wearing EGA cap badges on their steel helmets.

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world war I nerd

This close up of the Marine in the center of the above photo shows him to be wearing what appears to be an EGA cap badge. The enlargement next to it is a unsuccessful attempt to show the badge in greater detail.

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world war I nerd

This photo, which was also posted elsewhere on the forum, shows a USMC MG Company in Germany circa 1919. Of all the men, only the officer in the center is wearing an EGA cap badge on his helmet.

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world war I nerd

Here is another photo of the officer in the above photo taken in Germany, and what is probably a post war studio portrait of a Marine also wearing the cap badge on his helmet. Because his gasmask satchel is either British or the very first pattern US made gasmask haversack, which was only manufactured for a short period of time in 1917, it's entirely possible that this photo was taken late in the war.

 

Left hand image courtesy of the John Adam-Graf collection

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Wow, great post... As usual WW1 Nerd earns his forum name by posting some great photographic evidence to back up his point!

 

I'm with Chuck on the helmet referred to as an M17 and the flat washer.... On the ones I've seen there is rarely washer, usually just a fastening nut. If the fastening nut on the M17 isn't frozen in place perhaps you could remove it and see if the hole is punched or drilled.

 

I would feel comfortable with the "MK1" as a "one looker".

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Here are a few more pictures of Marines with an EGA attached to their helmet during the WWI time frame. I have posted these before. Sorry, I do not remember what grouping they came from... they have been buried for decades. Some of the pictures have names written on them, and one of the Marines wearing the campaign hat has a numeral 2 under the EGA.

 

Chuck

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world war I nerd

Wow, nice additions Mr. Roelens!

 

Is it just me or is the Marine in the back row, second from left, in post no. 15 wearing a mangled helmet? Or is that a campaign hat? Also are they wearing wearing khaki cotton trousers? The Army had to turn in all of their cotton uniforms before they shipped out for France, I always assumed that the Marines did the same as I have, until now, never seen USMC summer field dress being worn 'Over There'.

 

Does anybody know if the dungarees worn in post no. 20 are Navy, USMC, or Army issued?

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normaninvasion

Nerd and Chuck, thank you for these photo additions, really make a proper thread!

 

As to the helmet with the washer, like Hessian stated, if you can remove the nut and emblem, which is acceptable if it won't damage, that would shed some more light on what you have.

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teufelhunde.ret

Great thread gents... Thx C. for the supporting pics! Will someday move this thread to our pinned reference thread on Marine helmets with EGAs

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Maple Creek

Hi Chuck, I see what you're talking about. I'm reevaluating now and guessing that the hole was drilled, not punched on my M17. I think you're probably right. This might cause some to be skeptical, but my overall sense is that it probably a period done thing. This is based on provenance (basically I know and trust the seller) and overall look and feel. Whether it's pre or post 11/11/18 would be impossible to say.

 

Another thing to ponder with these helmets is the punched vs. drilled thing. I've wondered about this... Since this practice was done by units or individuals, isn't it logical that there would be a variety of methods for making the hole? Wouldn't some logically have been drilled since people wanting to make holes in their helmets would have had ready access to drills? Warguy's observation that some painted WWI Marine helmets had drilled EGAs seems to confirm the idea that some were drilled, not punched. The problem for collectors is that drilled helmets are easier to fake.

 

I really like all the period photos!

 

Mark D.

Hello Mark,

 

I would agree with Jeff and Kevin, however; I'm not convinced the helmet you refer to as the M17 has a punched-in hole for the EGA. Looking closely at your picture in post #3 I see the washer lying flat against the surface... that would not be the case if it were punched-in as the Mk1 on the left. The fastening nut was either screwed on a bent post or crooked as it doesn't lay flat against the washer surface. It also appears that the fastening nut was secured in a little dab of glue or cement... you can clearly see the substance under the nut on the left side. The Mk1 is a one looker.

 

Best,

 

Chuck

 

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