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PzKpfw VIb Königstiger aka KingTiger used by Americans


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I don't know if this picture is posted here before (couldn't find it), but does anyone have some more details about this PzKpfw VIb Königstiger used by American troops?

 

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"I never liked the sound of the word "Replacements". It gave you the feeling that you were not very permanent."

www.Roermond1939-1945.nl

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I understood the U.S, British and Soviets captured several Tigers, Tiger II's and Panthers. Soviets got a lot of Tiger II's simply because thats where most of them were deployed. I've read that there was never more than 90 Tiger II's in the entire Western Theater.

They always painted U.S. markings on the ones we captured. I've some pics of Nazi tanks back over here at Aberdeen Proving Grounds with U.S. markings. 3rd Armored Division had quite a collection is what I've read.

I have never read anything about our guys ever using any Tigers or Panthers against their former owners. If you ever come across that story, I want to read it.

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Always looking for 70th Division(The Trailblazers) items or photos.

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There was a good story about just that situation in a WWII magazine last month, the Brits used one to shell a German strongpoint, will try to find the issue if I still have it.....mike

Always looking for and buying 50's era 11th Airborne/ 187th ARCT/ 82nd Airborne tac mark painted jump helmets!



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BTW, there is a cut-away King Tiger at the Patton Museum at Ft. Knox. Very cool tank. The US captured it by shooting a round across the bow, if you will, prompting the crew to flee the tank. When the GIs actually got to the tank, they found that it was frozen to the ground, which is why the Germans bailed. The GIs poured fuel around it and lit that on fire to unstick it. I don't think it was used in combat though -- I think it was sent back to be examined.

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It went both ways...I have seen pics of Soviet tanks being found with Nazi markings although I have not read anything about them being actually used against the Soviets. If anyone has anything I would love to read it

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There was a good story about just that situation in a WWII magazine last month, the Brits used one to shell a German strongpoint, will try to find the issue if I still have it.....mike

 

Maybe this article was about the Pzkpfw V Panther captured by the British 6th Guards Tank Brigade. They found the Panther (in running order) during the battle for Overloon in The Netherlands just after Market Garden was finished. It belonged to the German 107th Panzer Brigade. They renaimed the tank "Cuckoo" referring to its status as a strange "bird" between the British tanks. It was used to destroy a German stronghold in a castle just to the north of Venlo (The Netherlands) and in January 1945 it was used in Operation Blackcock (No, that's not a joke) for the attack at the German village Waldenrath, just south over the border near Roermond (The Netherlands). During Operation Veritable it broke down and due to lack of a spare parts the tank had to be abandoned.

 

Some (famous) pictures of Cuckoo:

Cuckoo1.JPG

Cuckoo2.JPG

Cuckoo3.JPG

"I never liked the sound of the word "Replacements". It gave you the feeling that you were not very permanent."

www.Roermond1939-1945.nl

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It went both ways...I have seen pics of Soviet tanks being found with Nazi markings although I have not read anything about them being actually used against the Soviets. If anyone has anything I would love to read it

 

ive watched doco's that stated after tank battle the germans would go over the battlefield and use any tank that could be fixed up, even russian ones, ive got a link i think you wwill like.

http://www.mil.hiiumaa.ee/2000_09_14_kurtna_T-34-36/

http://www.rense.com/general75/germ2.htm

http://www.vincelewis.net/t34.html

 

the last one is the best theres some videos of it too

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I'm torn about it. I think the restoration looks awesome, but there's a part of me that thinks that the historical value of the German markings should have been kept. The paint seemed to be in pretty good condition, so I feel saddened by seeing it "re-done"

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Gents, an interesting thread on the use of captured equipment, but please keep it US focused. Thanks.

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Actively seeking WW1 4th and 5th Brigade USMC helmets and also a named WW2 Raider green blouse.
I'd rather be a sparrow than a snail, if I could I surely would....

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Gents, an interesting thread on the use of captured equipment, but please keep it US focused. Thanks.

 

sorry about that, during WW2 our boys captured alot of US equipment, didnt seem to matter we were fighting on the same side lol

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sorry about that, during WW2 our boys captured alot of US equipment, didnt seem to matter we were fighting on the same side lol

 

 

Oh, I understand that completely. My concern comes from discussing the use of captured T34s by the German army. Thanks for taking note. thumbsup.gif

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Actively seeking WW1 4th and 5th Brigade USMC helmets and also a named WW2 Raider green blouse.
I'd rather be a sparrow than a snail, if I could I surely would....

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This is indeed an interesting topic, but let's take Jeremiah's suggestion and stick to the US angle.

 

There must be something that is very powerful psychologically when one captures an enemy's armored vehicle. We have all read accounts by US soldiers who were, justifiably, very concerned about German armor. The early stages of the Battle of the Bulge provide many examples of this. However, to not only defeat that powerful weapon but to take it and turn it on its former owners must have been a very satisfying experience. I am sure that there must also have been a legitimate fear of fratricide when friendlies were using captured enemy equipment.

 

Here is a pic that looks like it could be from the Battle of the Bulge judging by the snowy conditions, but I do not have any details on it. This is, I believe, a Sturmgeschutz III assault gun which, evidently, has been captured and put to good use by these GIs. They had it long enough to get that star painted on the front.

 

Regards,

Charlie Flick

 

 

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I believe this is the reverse; this was a Stug III dressed up as an M-10, part of Skorzeny's unit (150. Panzer Brigade?).

 

Géromont area, January 1945.

The GIs you see are 291st Engineers.

 

Erwin

704th Tank Destroyer Battalion

 

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I am sure that there must also have been a legitimate fear of fratricide when friendlies were using captured enemy equipment.

 

i suspect they couldnt paint a big enough white star on the side lol

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  • 4 weeks later...
Don't forget that they used captured vehicles to train on ways to destroy them.

There were even B-17s with German markings for that purpose.

 

Erwin

 

ive seen pictures of b 24's with german markings and read of them with no markings and joining formations, and not communication, getting height information for the flak guys on the ground

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  • 3 weeks later...
I believe this is the reverse; this was a Stug III dressed up as an M-10, part of Skorzeny's unit (150. Panzer Brigade?).

 

Géromont area, January 1945.

The GIs you see are 291st Engineers.

 

Erwin

 

I have to agree with Jeeper... alot of this German stuff was star marked and used by Skorzeny's unit. I think there is only one picture I've seen where US troops were actually using a piece of german equipment and that was a Hanomag SdKfz 251 halftrack...

 

Wayne

Freedom isnt free... it must be paid for. Too often it is paid for by the blood of patriots. For those who have paid their share, Freedom has a flavor the protected will never know.

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Yes, it was a SdKfz 251/9 with a 75 mm canon used by men of the 1 Bn/504th PIR in the Cheneux area.

 

Also I found a photo of a German SdKfz 250 put to use by American troops in the Samrée area in January 1945.

 

Erwin

704th Tank Destroyer Battalion

 

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  • 1 year later...

As I recall, the French under LeClerc had a Tiger that they proudly used against it's former owners for several months at the end, and the 83rd US Infantry also had one for a while. The 83rd, was called the "RagTag Circus" because they used so much captured and hastily repainted transport to keep moving fast, including several firetrucks and even, for a while a ME 109 that they painted "83rd Inf Div" on the underside in big letters and used as a Div hack (and souvenir). Some Piper Cub pilot bravely learned how to fly it.

At the end of the war German equipment, including aircraft and planes, were painted over with stars during testing, and France used Panthers and Mk IV, as well as StuG II's for several years in it's newly reconstituted postwar army. They had French former Army factories that had been used to rebuild German tanks, and lots of former Slave labor that had been building them in Germany. The British and Americans let them collect up parts and plans from the factories in the occupied zones, as well as tooling and machines, and take it back to France. With all the damaged and captured Tanks in France, Holland, Belgium, the French had battalions of Panthers and Mk IV's and StuG II's. Eventually the Panthers wore out and broke down (Slave labor intentionally made parts to fail) and the Mk IV's and Stug's were sold to Syria and others.

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  • 1 month later...
Yes, it was a SdKfz 251/9 with a 75 mm canon used by men of the 1 Bn/504th PIR in the Cheneux area.

 

Also I found a photo of a German SdKfz 250 put to use by American troops in the Samrée area in January 1945.

 

Erwin

 

 

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Found this one, also several others showing M8 in German markings, Panthers disguised to look like M10's all from Battle of the Bulge

Kev

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  • 2 months later...

Found this one, somewhere after the landings in Normandy.

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"Old tankers never die, they just smell that way!"

A co. 4/73rd Armor, 1st Infantry Division (Forward)

 

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